ACA grows to 20,000 pages plus

[rushmc 18]

Written by those who do not answer to voters/people

http://www.cbn.com/cbnnews/us/2013/May/Affordable-Care-Act-Becomes-a-Source-of-Heartburn/

Quote

"This is legislation that was 2,500 pages long (that is) now 20,000 pages of legislation," the Cato Institute's Michael Tanner said.

That's 17,500 pages of new regulations written by bureaucrats on top of an already complex law passed by Congress.

And for employers who have no choice but to understand the 'nitty gritty' details to make decisions for their companies -- the task is overwhelming.

"For example, the employer mandate, the requirement that businesses with 50 or more full-time equivalent employees provide health insurance or pay penalties...that was a three-and-a-half page provision that got turned into 144-page regulation with 44 definitions," Kevin Kuhlman with the National Federation of Independent Business said.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[RonD1120 58]

I am currently reading The Harbinger by Jonathan Cahn. The current American crisis is making more sense now. Not in a good way.

Prepare for SHTF.

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[rushmc 18]

RonD1120

I am currently reading The Harbinger by Jonathan Cahn. The current American crisis is making more sense now. Not in a good way.

Prepare for SHTF.

There is a reason FEMA has millions of MRE's, LEO's are getting armored up vehicles and non-enforcment government departments are getting armed up and buying ammo

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[turtlespeed 212]

rushmc

***I am currently reading The Harbinger by Jonathan Cahn. The current American crisis is making more sense now. Not in a good way.

Prepare for SHTF.

There is a reason FEMA has millions of MRE's, LEO's are getting armored up vehicles and non-enforcment government departments are getting armed up and buying ammo

All while trying to limit the weapons the normal public has.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[diablopilot 2]

And people think we're crazy.....

----------------------------------------------
You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously.

[turtlespeed 212]

diablopilot

And people think we're crazy.....

Wha-chu Talkin' 'bout Willis?

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Bignugget 0]

rushmc

***I am currently reading The Harbinger by Jonathan Cahn. The current American crisis is making more sense now. Not in a good way.

Prepare for SHTF.

There is a reason FEMA has millions of MRE's, LEO's are getting armored up vehicles and non-enforcment government departments are getting armed up and buying ammo

Sweet a foil hat thread.

*Dons foil hat*

how you for

think that fema attack
ok m&mnent

ahahah sure
proof it.


*sets foil hat down*

wow that was trippy, stepping into your world is wild.



I am pretty sure that FEMA and LEO aren't stockpiling MRE's and armored vehicles because of the ACA.

[rushmc 18]

Quote

I am pretty sure that FEMA and LEO aren't stockpiling MRE's and armored vehicles because of the ACA.

Never said is was because of ACA
Please try and keep up

Oh
And I bet is was trippy leaving your world

I am sure anything close to normal sensibilities looks very flash back like to you

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[Gravitymaster 0]

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/penny-starr/waxman-10535-pages-obamacare-regs-it-important-i-read-it

CNSNews.com: "What I was going to ask you is if you've read those [10,535 pages] of regulations."

Waxman said: “Have you read them?”

CNSNews.com: "No. Have you read them?"

Waxman said: “Is it important that I read it?”

CNSNews.com: "Do you think that the American people should read it? I just asked you a very honest question. Whether you've read them? It's a yes or no question."

Waxman: "I think it is a propaganda question, and I refuse to talk to you about it."

____________________________________________________

CNSNews.com) – When Sen. Mark Warner (D-Va.) was asked on Wednesday whether he has read all 10,535 pages of final Obamacare that the administration has so for published in the Federal Register, he first gave a response that did not address the question. When Warner was asked the question a second time, he walked away without answering.

CNSNews.com: “Sir, the administration has published 10,535 pages of final Obamacare regulations into the Federal Register. Have you read all 10,535 pages?”

Sen. Warner: “I think we saw yesterday a lot of interest from the American people. And are there ways that we can make this law better? Absolutely, but that ought to be debated at a different time.”

CNSNews.com: “But have you read those 10,500 pages?” Warner did not answer and walked away.

[SkyDekker 1,123]

Gravitymaster

http://cnsnews.com/news/article/penny-starr/waxman-10535-pages-obamacare-regs-it-important-i-read-it

CNSNews.com: "What I was going to ask you is if you've read those [10,535 pages] of regulations."

Waxman said: “Have you read them?”

CNSNews.com: "No. Have you read them?"

Waxman said: “Is it important that I read it?”

CNSNews.com: "Do you think that the American people should read it? I just asked you a very honest question. Whether you've read them? It's a yes or no question."

Waxman: "I think it is a propaganda question, and I refuse to talk to you about it."

____________________________________________________

CNSNews.com) – When Sen. Mark Warner (D-Va.) was asked on Wednesday whether he has read all 10,535 pages of final Obamacare that the administration has so for published in the Federal Register, he first gave a response that did not address the question. When Warner was asked the question a second time, he walked away without answering.

CNSNews.com: “Sir, the administration has published 10,535 pages of final Obamacare regulations into the Federal Register. Have you read all 10,535 pages?”

Sen. Warner: “I think we saw yesterday a lot of interest from the American people. And are there ways that we can make this law better? Absolutely, but that ought to be debated at a different time.”

CNSNews.com: “But have you read those 10,500 pages?” Warner did not answer and walked away.

Sorry, but questions like that are silly.

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document? Any loans? Did you read the entire document?

Most people in these situations rely on third parties (lawyers, assistants, experts etc) to provide feedback and insight. That's what they have a staff for. Quite frankly I think that him personally reading all regulations would be a waste of valuable time.

It is a propaganda question.

It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

[jgoose71 0]

SkyDekker

***http://cnsnews.com/news/article/penny-starr/waxman-10535-pages-obamacare-regs-it-important-i-read-it

CNSNews.com: "What I was going to ask you is if you've read those [10,535 pages] of regulations."

Waxman said: “Have you read them?”

CNSNews.com: "No. Have you read them?"

Waxman said: “Is it important that I read it?”

CNSNews.com: "Do you think that the American people should read it? I just asked you a very honest question. Whether you've read them? It's a yes or no question."

Waxman: "I think it is a propaganda question, and I refuse to talk to you about it."

____________________________________________________

CNSNews.com) – When Sen. Mark Warner (D-Va.) was asked on Wednesday whether he has read all 10,535 pages of final Obamacare that the administration has so for published in the Federal Register, he first gave a response that did not address the question. When Warner was asked the question a second time, he walked away without answering.

CNSNews.com: “Sir, the administration has published 10,535 pages of final Obamacare regulations into the Federal Register. Have you read all 10,535 pages?”

Sen. Warner: “I think we saw yesterday a lot of interest from the American people. And are there ways that we can make this law better? Absolutely, but that ought to be debated at a different time.”

CNSNews.com: “But have you read those 10,500 pages?” Warner did not answer and walked away.

Sorry, but questions like that are silly.

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document? Any loans? Did you read the entire document?

Most people in these situations rely on third parties (lawyers, assistants, experts etc) to provide feedback and insight. That's what they have a staff for. Quite frankly I think that him personally reading all regulations would be a waste of valuable time.

It is a propaganda question.

It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

Seriously?

When I signed my mortgage, it was a several hour ordeal, and I went through every piece of paper.

While a supreme court judge may not have read every law on the books, they will sit down with their staff and read every rule or ruling that applies as reference to the case they are working on.

A more honest answer from those politicians would be "I read that I am exempted, and then I stopped reading after that..."

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[SkyDekker 1,123]

jgoose71

******http://cnsnews.com/news/article/penny-starr/waxman-10535-pages-obamacare-regs-it-important-i-read-it

CNSNews.com: "What I was going to ask you is if you've read those [10,535 pages] of regulations."

Waxman said: “Have you read them?”

CNSNews.com: "No. Have you read them?"

Waxman said: “Is it important that I read it?”

CNSNews.com: "Do you think that the American people should read it? I just asked you a very honest question. Whether you've read them? It's a yes or no question."

Waxman: "I think it is a propaganda question, and I refuse to talk to you about it."

____________________________________________________

CNSNews.com) – When Sen. Mark Warner (D-Va.) was asked on Wednesday whether he has read all 10,535 pages of final Obamacare that the administration has so for published in the Federal Register, he first gave a response that did not address the question. When Warner was asked the question a second time, he walked away without answering.

CNSNews.com: “Sir, the administration has published 10,535 pages of final Obamacare regulations into the Federal Register. Have you read all 10,535 pages?”

Sen. Warner: “I think we saw yesterday a lot of interest from the American people. And are there ways that we can make this law better? Absolutely, but that ought to be debated at a different time.”

CNSNews.com: “But have you read those 10,500 pages?” Warner did not answer and walked away.

Sorry, but questions like that are silly.

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document? Any loans? Did you read the entire document?

Most people in these situations rely on third parties (lawyers, assistants, experts etc) to provide feedback and insight. That's what they have a staff for. Quite frankly I think that him personally reading all regulations would be a waste of valuable time.

It is a propaganda question.

It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

Seriously?

When I signed my mortgage, it was a several hour ordeal, and I went through every piece of paper.

While a supreme court judge may not have read every law on the books, they will sit down with their staff and read every rule or ruling that applies as reference to the case they are working on.

A more honest answer from those politicians would be "I read that I am exempted, and then I stopped reading after that..."

I think your bias is showing. Also confirms the question is indeed propaganda.

(question is also based on the falsehood that reading equals comprehension)

[jgoose71 0]

SkyDekker

I think your bias is showing. Also confirms the question is indeed propaganda.

(question is also based on the falsehood that reading equals comprehension)

Biased?

I don't know about you, but when I get ready to fuck somebody, I will make sure I know what hole I'm sticking it in.

As to comprehension? Yes, most politicians do think your ass hole is your pleasure center.

"There is an art, it says, or, rather, a knack to flying. The knack lies in learning how to throw yourself at the ground and miss."
Life, the Universe, and Everything

[DaVinci 0]

Quote

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document?

YES, and you are an idiot if you don't. And that is just for ME, I'd be a hell of a lot more detailed if my actions effected the people who elected me to represent them.

Quote

It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

And they do read every law relating to a case they are presiding over. While they might have helpers, how much you wanna bet that check the information?

[Bignugget 0]

DaVinci

Quote

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document?

YES, and you are an idiot if you don't. And that is just for ME, I'd be a hell of a lot more detailed if my actions effected the people who elected me to represent them.

***It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

And they do read every law relating to a case they are presiding over. While they might have helpers, how much you wanna bet that check the information?


IME the vast majority of people never read contracts completely top to bottom every word.

I have sold well over 1000 vehicles in the last 4 years with financing and I cannot remember a single person who sat down and read all 50 pages of the contract and assorted forms.

Of course it was explained what each form was, and they indicated they understood, but I can't think of a single person who did more than skim, certainly not anyone who sat down and read 50 pages of fine print.

[turtlespeed 212]

Bignugget

***

Quote

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document?

YES, and you are an idiot if you don't. And that is just for ME, I'd be a hell of a lot more detailed if my actions effected the people who elected me to represent them.

***It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

And they do read every law relating to a case they are presiding over. While they might have helpers, how much you wanna bet that check the information?


IME the vast majority of people never read contracts completely top to bottom every word.

I have sold well over 1000 vehicles in the last 4 years with financing and I cannot remember a single person who sat down and read all 50 pages of the contract and assorted forms.

Of course it was explained what each form was, and they indicated they understood, but I can't think of a single person who did more than skim, certainly not anyone who sat down and read 50 pages of fine print.

Most people aren't serving the public as their representative, are they?

I have read every word of every contract I am involved in, either as the contracto or the contracted.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Bignugget 0]

turtlespeed

******

Quote

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document?

YES, and you are an idiot if you don't. And that is just for ME, I'd be a hell of a lot more detailed if my actions effected the people who elected me to represent them.

***It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

And they do read every law relating to a case they are presiding over. While they might have helpers, how much you wanna bet that check the information?


IME the vast majority of people never read contracts completely top to bottom every word.

I have sold well over 1000 vehicles in the last 4 years with financing and I cannot remember a single person who sat down and read all 50 pages of the contract and assorted forms.

Of course it was explained what each form was, and they indicated they understood, but I can't think of a single person who did more than skim, certainly not anyone who sat down and read 50 pages of fine print.

Most people aren't serving the public as their representative, are they?

I have read every word of every contract I am involved in, either as the contracto or the contracted.

You are arguing that members of congress are by and large more intelligent than the average american?

I have seen it 0/1000 times, admittedly a small sample.....how many have you witnessed sit down and read word for word 50 pages of contract fine print?

[turtlespeed 212]

Bignugget

*********

Quote

Do you have a mortgage? Did you read the entire mortgage document?

YES, and you are an idiot if you don't. And that is just for ME, I'd be a hell of a lot more detailed if my actions effected the people who elected me to represent them.

***It is the equivalent of asking a Supreme Court Justice if they have read every law and concluding they must be worthless if they haven't.

And they do read every law relating to a case they are presiding over. While they might have helpers, how much you wanna bet that check the information?


IME the vast majority of people never read contracts completely top to bottom every word.

I have sold well over 1000 vehicles in the last 4 years with financing and I cannot remember a single person who sat down and read all 50 pages of the contract and assorted forms.

Of course it was explained what each form was, and they indicated they understood, but I can't think of a single person who did more than skim, certainly not anyone who sat down and read 50 pages of fine print.

Most people aren't serving the public as their representative, are they?

I have read every word of every contract I am involved in, either as the contracto or the contracted.

You are arguing that members of congress are by and large more intelligent than the average american?

I have seen it 0/1000 times, admittedly a small sample.....how many have you witnessed sit down and read word for word 50 pages of contract fine print?

Everyone in my family (immediate) always does. Mortgage, cars, signature loans, articles of incorporation, Partnership agreements, cell phone contracts . . . etc etc

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[linebckr83 3]

Buying a car for yourself is not the same thing as making laws for a nation of people...people who gave you your job. Not even close.

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[DaVinci 0]

Quote

IME the vast majority of people never read contracts completely top to bottom every word.

And whose fault would it be if they signed a contract that was terrible for them?

Quote

I have sold well over 1000 vehicles in the last 4 years with financing and I cannot remember a single person who sat down and read all 50 pages of the contract and assorted forms.

And if they end up with a contract that hurts them significantly... Who is to blame? You?

Quote

Of course it was explained what each form was, and they indicated they understood, but I can't think of a single person who did more than skim, certainly not anyone who sat down and read 50 pages of fine print.

And if you lied to them, or didn't understand it... Who is on the hook? You? Or them?

Also the vast majority of people are NOT passing laws that will affect almost every single person in the US. Higher responsibility should bring a higher standard.

[Bignugget 0]

Great, so if I understand the consensus....

You guys believe Congress operates above the bar as far as things like making sure the I's are dotted etc. go.

I wish I shared that faith, you have listened to these guys speak before right?

Didn't one crazy right winger go on a 22 hour binge speech against the ACA?

Why didn't he read it out loud for everyone? Think it was because he had already read it 3x himself and was bored with it?

[linebckr83 3]

I wouldn't say a filibuster constitutes you as a "crazy right winger". Plenty of people do it from both sides.

I'm guessing no one in that building has read the whole thing, and none of them would understand it anyways.

"Are you coming to the party?
Oh I'm coming, but I won't be there!"
Flying Hellfish #828
Dudist #52

[rushmc 18]

linebckr83

I wouldn't say a filibuster constitutes you as a "crazy right winger". Plenty of people do it from both sides.

I'm guessing no one in that building has read the whole thing, and none of them would understand it anyways.

Actull, the result of what he did has been positive
Except for those who unconditionally support Obamacare

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DaVinci 0]

Quote

You guys believe Congress operates above the bar as far as things like making sure the I's are dotted etc. go

No, we are not saying they DO. We are saying they SHOULD.

If your client buys a car from you and does not bother to read the details... Who is on the hook? THEM. But if congress does not read the details we ALL are on the hook. Potentially 313M people.

And again, (you didn't answer this before)... When the person buying a car from you finds out that since they didn't ready the fine print... Who is at fault for the higher interest rate? You or them? Who pays for it, you or them?

Quote

Didn't one crazy right winger go on a 22 hour binge speech against the ACA? ....Why didn't he read it out loud for everyone?

You would have to ask him.

But why don't you ask why those who voted FOR it... Didn't bother to read it?

[turtlespeed 212]

Bignugget

Great, so if I understand the consensus....

You guys believe Congress operates above the bar as far as things like making sure the I's are dotted etc. go.

I wish I shared that faith, you have listened to these guys speak before right?

Didn't one crazy right winger go on a 22 hour binge speech against the ACA?

Why didn't he read it out loud for everyone? Think it was because he had already read it 3x himself and was bored with it?

I wonder if you read your waivers at the DZ.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun