$18 Billion to "control our borders"

[skydiver30960 0]

http://news.yahoo.com/govt-spent-18-billion-immigration-enforcement-143135675--politics.html

I think most would agree that what we're doing now isn't working. I don't think we're getting our $18 billion's worth out of our border control So what's the solution? Open the flood gates and let everyone in? Or toughen up and spend more (financially and/or ethically) to control our borders?

Elvisio "games without frontiers" Rodriguez

[DrewEckhardt 0]

Quote

http://news.yahoo.com/govt-spent-18-billion-immigration-enforcement-143135675--politics.html

I think most would agree that what we're doing now isn't working. I don't think we're getting our $18 billion's worth out of our border control So what's the solution? Open the flood gates and let everyone in?

That's what made America the best country in the world*

* "opening the flood gates" isn't quite accurate. We didn't welcome criminals, sick people, or Chinese (with the Chinese Exclusion Act of 1882).

[lawrocket 3]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZD0BcQTIr4c

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[billvon 2,466]

>So what's the solution? Open the flood gates and let everyone in?

Let more people in; anyone who wants to work (and isn't a criminal.) Let them work at whatever wage they want to. Will reduce border crime and help US industry.

[OHCHUTE 0]

Look, as Iraq/ Afgan winds down there's got to be some money spent on drones, protection etc. Military Industrial complex. Nothing new here. With that amount of money we could pay Mexicans not to come here, much like we pay farmers not to grow wheat and we'd still be way ahead. It's about money, not about controlling any border. The border is an illusion, and a means for some to make a pile of cash.

[regulator 0]

So how exactly do you make a determination on the spot when you open the floodgates if someone is criminal or not?

[billvon 2,466]

>So how exactly do you make a determination on the spot when you open the
>floodgates if someone is criminal or not?

Biometrically indexed database. Filled with data from other countries if they cooperate, with our own data if they don't.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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>So how exactly do you make a determination on the spot when you open the
>floodgates if someone is criminal or not?

Biometrically indexed database. Filled with data from other countries if they cooperate, with our own data if they don't.

Perhaps the UN could be of some help with regulating who has access to guns?

[billvon 2,466]

>Perhaps the UN could be of some help with regulating who has access to guns?

War on Christmas, stupid Obama. Covered the other two; now back to the topic at hand . . .

[Gravitymaster 0]

Quote

Look, as Iraq/ Afgan winds down there's got to be some money spent on drones, protection etc. Military Industrial complex. Nothing new here. With that amount of money we could pay Mexicans not to come here, much like we pay farmers not to grow wheat and we'd still be way ahead. It's about money, not about controlling any border. The border is an illusion, and a means for some to make a pile of cash.

"Oh, great...look, some unappropriated money. Let's find something else to spend it on instead of paying off our debts".

[masterrig 1]

Here's one reasn we need to know just who is coming into this country!

http://home.myhughesnet.com/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CDA3LNM882%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=1018

Besides the drug runners and other un-desirables.


Chuck

[OHCHUTE 0]

More info: this is what we ARE CURRENTLY SPENDING for immagration enforcement problems. The budget exceeds FBI, DEA, Secret Circus, US Marshalls Service, BATF COMBINED.

In 1990 there were only 30,000 deportations while last year there were 400,000,

Problem is: there's just more coming in that need dealt with.

Solution: Instead of deporting back to Mexico, deport them to Artic. Bears are hungry. Once word got out, they'd stay in Mexico. They want to migrate North, then we'll provide all the assistance to get them as far North as possible. Or, make them citizens via a ligitment process, as we do need more Walmart shoppers to fuel our economic growth.

[regulator 0]

Quote

>So how exactly do you make a determination on the spot when you open the
>floodgates if someone is criminal or not?

Biometrically indexed database. Filled with data from other countries if they cooperate, with our own data if they don't.

-----------------------------------------------------
Seems that having a database of over three countries of people would be so massive that the cost would be prohibitive. Do you have a rough guess of about how much this would cost?

[masterrig 1]

It's not just people from Mexico, wanting into this country. We're dealing with Central and South America, also. With a sprinkling of folks from other countries. This country of ours is running out of room due to population. We used to 'feed the world' but we're losing millions of acres of farm and ranchland to urban sprawl, we are beginning to have a problem just feeding our present population. The main point is, we are getting more criminals sneaking across the border. The days of the migrant farmhand looking to pick lettuce are gone. We're getting too many wanting to get in on the very lucrative drug trade. We've got to do something about it and we're only about 40-yrs. too late.


Chuck

[Andy9o8 0]

Yep, let em in. The only people not hypocritical about bitching about it would be today's descendants of the survivors of the genocide of the Native Americans.

They let the Irish in 100 yrs ago and it didn't kill us. We'll be fine.

[regulator 0]

You can start by leasing out your house to the immigrants. Let me know how that works out for you.

[Andy9o8 0]

Right after you pay into the Native American reparation fund for their land you're currently squatting on.

[masterrig 1]

That was then, this is now. How 'bout you lead the parade to the ships and planes headed back to Europe, Asia, and wherever else. Then, all the other people in the world can take our places. Where are the Native people then?


Chuck

[Andy9o8 0]

How easily we dismiss the genocide of other people.

[CygnusX-1 42]

Quote

Look, as Iraq/ Afgan winds down there's got to be some money spent on drones, protection etc. Military Industrial complex. Nothing new here. With that amount of money we could pay Mexicans not to come here, much like we pay farmers not to grow wheat and we'd still be way ahead. It's about money, not about controlling any border. The border is an illusion, and a means for some to make a pile of cash.

+1. I would be all for some hellfire missiles raining down on those who are trying to get into this country illegally. And so what if we take out some innocent people every once in a while. That is just the price for security. We accept the TSA at airports. This is just one more thing we would have to live with.

[regulator 0]

Ok go get all the karankawa indians you can find and get back with me.

http://www.texasindians.com/karank.htm

[masterrig 1]

I'm not dismissing anything. Native people are still with us. What I'm saying is, it's something our fore-fathers did, not us. Fixing the problem is complicated and until our government changes it's attitude, the problem will persist.


Chuck

[billvon 2,466]

>Seems that having a database of over three countries of people would be so massive
>that the cost would be prohibitive.

Well, it would be dozens of countries. But storage currently costs $50 a _terabyte_ - database size is not going to be an issue.

What is going to be an issue is the logistics cost of setting up scanning stations, legal costs of dealing with privacy issues (gotta scan our own criminals as well) governmental costs for all the treaties that would need - it would be significant. But likely less than $18 trillion.

[regulator 0]

It might be 50 bucks a terabyte or so, but what about having a tool that will decompile all of that database in a small handheld tool that can disseminate all of that information in a reasonable amount of time. The database you propose would be so immense getting accurate data polled in a standard amount of time(with a tool border agents can use that is portable) seems to be rather insurmountable.

[regulator 0]

An example of this would be:

I lived in Dallas for 15 years or so. I worked for a telecom company as a network engineer and I could work from home 2 days a week. Now all the managers has ISDN lines in their places. The company paid for them to have ISDN hooked up in their houses...but the other engineers...well we had the best connection at the time...56K modems. Literally the database was so large that just by clicking on the state of texas would cause a delay in the range of 2-4 minutes. Any additional key presses would have similar delays. Now obviously our current technology we have much faster internet connection speeds...( just got Uverse this past weekend 24Mbps!!!) but this database was ONLY for the US locations. Having a database with BILLIONS and billions of people could cause delays and the end stations and could cause the lines at border checkpoints to be considerable larger than what we have now. I'm not saying it cant be done...but I am saying that I have experience polling large databases...and one this large would require some serious re-tooling to make it reasonable for those wanting entrance.