Former CBO director cuts through the fantasy math of the healthcare bill

[Lefty 0]

Clicky

Ever get that feeling that adding new entitlement programs while decreasing the deficit seems a little...impossible? Good article.

Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful.
-Calvin

[rushmc 18]

Smoke and mirrors
The CBO has also said that with the medicare "fix" the plan in the red

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

You did have a panty wetting experince for a while though didnt ya........

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Medicare-fix-would-push-apf-2700343586.html?x=0&.v=2

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[mnealtx 0]

He's Lefty, not Lucky.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[rushmc 18]

Quote

He's Lefty, not Lucky.

Opps

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

Sorry
Been a long moring already

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[RonD1120 58]

Quote

Smoke and mirrors
The CBO has also said that with the medicare "fix" the plan in the red

Focus here:

http://www.tenthamendmentcenter.com/

Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

[futuredivot 0]

Quote

He's Lefty, not Lucky.

So Lucky is lefty but Lefty isn't Lucky

You are only as strong as the prey you devour

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

Quote

He's Lefty, not Lucky.

So Lucky is lefty but Lefty isn't Lucky

Yes.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[livendive 8]

How do the costs of this bill compare to the costs of the Iraq war?

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

How do the costs of this bill compare to the costs of the Iraq war?

Blues,
Dave

if they are close - does that make both of them ok?

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[Lefty 0]

Quote

He's Lefty, not Lucky.

OK, I laughed.

Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful.
-Calvin

[Lefty 0]

Quote

Quote

He's Lefty, not Lucky.

So Lucky is lefty but Lefty isn't Lucky

Nor is Lefty lefty.

Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful.
-Calvin

[Lefty 0]

Quote

How do the costs of this bill compare to the costs of the Iraq war?

Blues,
Dave

Does it matter? The article points out the financial trickery Congress uses on the gullible for this particular bill. Everything else can take a break for the time being. The healthcare bill is expensive enough to warrant its own discussion.

Provoking a reaction isn't the same thing as saying something meaningful.
-Calvin

[shropshire 0]

Quote

Quote

He's Lefty, not Lucky.

So Lucky is lefty but Lefty isn't Lucky

But Who's on first?

(.)Y(.)
Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome

[lawrocket 3]

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How do the costs of this bill compare to the costs of the Iraq war?

Blues,
Dave

So far there is no comparison. The projected costs? Pretty big, in comparison.

What I suspect to be actual costs? HC financing will dwarf it.

Recall that this is not "health care" reform. This is "health care financing" reform. It's control of the $$$$.

Taking out seniors (covered by Medicare), children (covered by SCHIP, Medicaid, etc) and illegal immigrants, how many Americans are uncovered? 10 or 15 million? Assuming it's 15 million, this plan will spend between $950 billion and $1.5 trillion to cover 92% of these people within 10 years.

Imagine spending a trillion on 14 million people. A trillion. And you don't even cover them all.

Does anyone else see a problem with that? Does anyone else think, "there must be something else at work here?"

Either there is something else at work or they are piss poor at this. This is Denmark, and there is something rotten.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[livendive 8]

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How do the costs of this bill compare to the costs of the Iraq war?

Blues,
Dave

if they are close - does that make both of them ok?

Not really. I do believe there is a valid argument to be made about the cost of this healthcare bill. I do not believe proponents of the Iraq war have plausible access to it. If you were ok with spending close to a trillion dollars over 10 years to kill people, you should also be ok with spending close to a trillion dollars over 10 years to heal people. Anyone who supported the Iraq war cannot honestly claim that the cost is their issue with this bill.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

I do believe there is a valid argument to be made about the cost of this healthcare bill. I do not believe proponents of the Iraq war have plausible access to it. If you were ok with spending close to a trillion dollars over 10 years to kill people, you should also be ok with spending close to a trillion dollars over 10 years to heal people. Anyone who supported the Iraq war cannot honestly claim that the cost is their issue with this bill.

that's a nonsensical argument with a foundation based solely on your personal opinions on both topics

I can see those with the flip side of your argument using the exact same type of reasoning - and they'd be just as wrong

the cost is a great reason to scrutinize both topics - is this huge expense really going to do what it says (reduce support of terror/provide more standardized health to all) or is just a political move to consolidate power and money to those in power?

I suspect the answer is the same also - many supporting (war/HC) believe it'll help the people of the country but still many more support (war/HC) to just increase control of the party in charge and give something to the masses to let them rationalize voting for these guys again.

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[livendive 8]

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Quote

I do believe there is a valid argument to be made about the cost of this healthcare bill. I do not believe proponents of the Iraq war have plausible access to it. If you were ok with spending close to a trillion dollars over 10 years to kill people, you should also be ok with spending close to a trillion dollars over 10 years to heal people. Anyone who supported the Iraq war cannot honestly claim that the cost is their issue with this bill.

that's a nonsensical argument with a foundation based solely on your personal opinions on both topics

I can see those with the flip side of your argument using the exact same type of reasoning - and they'd be just as wrong

the cost is a great reason to scrutinize both topics - is this huge expense really going to do what it says (reduce support of terror/provide more standardized health to all) or is just a political move to consolidate power and money to those in power?

I suspect the answer is the same also - many supporting (war/HC) believe it'll help the people of the country but still many more support (war/HC) to just increase control of the party in charge and give something to the masses to let them rationalize voting for these guys again.

Cost and value are seperate topics. One could argue that Iraq provides enough bang for the buck, and is thus justified by its value. One could make a similar argument for healthcare. These are not the same as saying we can/cannot afford either.

"I can afford to invest $1,000 in stocks, but not in bonds" is nonsensical. Either you can afford to invest $1,000 or you can't.

"A $1,000 investment in stocks will return more than $1,000 in bonds" is plausible, and you can probably find two competent brokers who will disagree with each other on the subject.

Personally, I'd like to see our government make ginourmous, unbelievably super huge budget cuts across the board, but the realist in me thinks that they're going to spend the money regardless, and that more access to healthcare is as good or better than some other economic boondoggles.

Blues,
Dave

"I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXTREME ATHLETE!"
(drink Mountain Dew)

[rehmwa 2]

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I'd like to see our government make ginourmous, unbelievably super huge budget cuts across the board, but the realist in me thinks that they're going to spend the money regardless, and that more access to healthcare is as good or better than some other economic boondoggles.

got it - let me paraphrase

cost and value are interesting, but value is subjective and my subjective position is as good as anyone elses - cheerfully conceded

the right thing is huge cuts across the board - I CONCUR (livendive for congress)

but

track record is they are going to spend and spend and borrow and borrow and we can't do a damn thing about it - I am tending to agree, but I'm not ready to give up yet

therefore

we just as well break the bank on something that makes us feel all warm and fuzzy inside - I see your point and would like to subscribe to your newletter

later

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants