shropshire 0 #26 December 22, 2008 QuoteQuote Whether or not he's been successful in that regard is a matter of opinion, and mine is that he's been a failure. Clinton and his dad were both better Presidents with better policies on Iraq. Blues, Dave I guess that opinion would also depend upon whether you're a person sitting safely at home behind your computer or a Kurd living in Iraq. What about the families of the countless innocents and servicemen or all of the tax payers that have had their hard earned wages squandered? (.)Y(.) Chivalry is not dead; it only sleeps for want of work to do. - Jerome K Jerome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #27 December 22, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuote Whether or not he's been successful in that regard is a matter of opinion, and mine is that he's been a failure. Clinton and his dad were both better Presidents with better policies on Iraq. Blues, Dave I guess that opinion would also depend upon whether you're a person sitting safely at home behind your computer or a Kurd living in Iraq. Or the mother of a dead child, killed by a US bomb. Or the family of a dead US serviceman. Ok. I get it. You think everything is America's fault. China's environmental pollution. Saddam's genocide. The dead US serviceman. You think it's all our fault and poor Saddam should've been left alone to do his business. I'm pretty confident I've never once read a positive post from you regarding this country. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #28 December 22, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuote Whether or not he's been successful in that regard is a matter of opinion, and mine is that he's been a failure. Clinton and his dad were both better Presidents with better policies on Iraq. Blues, Dave I guess that opinion would also depend upon whether you're a person sitting safely at home behind your computer or a Kurd living in Iraq. What about the families of the countless innocents and servicemen or all of the tax payers that have had their hard earned wages squandered? They're not countless. We have the records. The wages squandered on OIF? Should we have saved it up to hand out more to the big 3 or AIG? -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,634 #29 December 23, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Whether or not he's been successful in that regard is a matter of opinion, and mine is that he's been a failure. Clinton and his dad were both better Presidents with better policies on Iraq. Blues, Dave I guess that opinion would also depend upon whether you're a person sitting safely at home behind your computer or a Kurd living in Iraq. Or the mother of a dead child, killed by a US bomb. Or the family of a dead US serviceman. Ok. I get it. You think everything is America's fault. China's environmental pollution. Saddam's genocide. The dead US serviceman. You think it's all our fault and poor Saddam should've been left alone to do his business. I'm pretty confident I've never once read a positive post from you regarding this country. You should pay better attention. However, it is a regrettable FACT that: the US DID supply Saddam with weapons and chemical precursors, The US HAS exported a huge fraction of its manufacturing and concomitant pollution to Asia, The US DID invade Iraq under false pretenses, resulting in the deaths of countless Iraqis and well over 4,000 US servicemen and women. And those ARE facts. Care to dispute any of them?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #30 December 23, 2008 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuote Whether or not he's been successful in that regard is a matter of opinion, and mine is that he's been a failure. Clinton and his dad were both better Presidents with better policies on Iraq. Blues, Dave I guess that opinion would also depend upon whether you're a person sitting safely at home behind your computer or a Kurd living in Iraq. Or the mother of a dead child, killed by a US bomb. Or the family of a dead US serviceman. Ok. I get it. You think everything is America's fault. China's environmental pollution. Saddam's genocide. The dead US serviceman. You think it's all our fault and poor Saddam should've been left alone to do his business. I'm pretty confident I've never once read a positive post from you regarding this country. You should pay better attention. However, it is a regrettable FACT that: the US DID supply Saddam with weapons and chemical precursors, The US HAS exported a huge fraction of its manufacturing and concomitant pollution to Asia, The US DID invade Iraq under false pretenses, resulting in the deaths of countless Iraqis and well over 4,000 US servicemen and women. And those ARE facts. Care to dispute any of them? Nope. But I blame Saddam for the hundreds of thousands of dead and tortured. I think the hundreds of Chinese coal plants are China's doing and if they don't have a desire to clean up the environment then that's their fault. The US invaded Iraq with faulty intelligence but I have zero problem with Saddam being out and democracy being in. The major difference is that you don't see any good. You only see a chance to blame America in all of those situations. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stitch 0 #31 December 23, 2008 Okay, then explain to us all the ways the U.S. taxpayers have benefited from the Iraq war."No cookies for you"- GFD "I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65 Don't be a "Racer Hater" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #32 December 23, 2008 QuoteOkay, then explain to us all the ways the U.S. taxpayers have benefited from the Iraq war. There's not a psychopathic murdering dictator running around. I guess an end to the genocide and all that other pesky stuff doesn't directly effect you, therefore it doesn't matter. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stitch 0 #33 December 23, 2008 The $ 300+ billion we've poured into that war effort doesn't matter ? "No cookies for you"- GFD "I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65 Don't be a "Racer Hater" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #34 December 23, 2008 Quote The $ 300+ billion we've poured into that war effort doesn't matter ? If money is more important to you than that dictator being gone... I guess so. What about the $700B handouts? -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stitch 0 #35 December 23, 2008 The bailout would have probably hurt the taxpayers a lot less if we weren't having to pay to prop up Iraq, too. This country was in no shape what so ever to take on two major military campaigns with a faltering economy. Afganistan was an expected response after 9/11. But Iraq could have waited. There are dozens of countries all over the world with dictators that mistreat the citizens. Do you think we should go on a personal crusade to set the world right no matter what the cost ?"No cookies for you"- GFD "I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65 Don't be a "Racer Hater" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #36 December 23, 2008 QuoteThe bailout would have probably hurt the taxpayers a lot less if we weren't having to pay to prop up Iraq, too. This country was in no shape what so ever to take on two major military campaigns with a faltering economy. Afganistan was an expected response after 9/11. But Iraq could have waited. There are dozens of countries all over the world with dictators that mistreat the citizens. Do you think we should go on a personal crusade to set the world right no matter what the cost ? The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. I think we should do whatever we can to help people in every part of the world. I know we went into Iraq with bad intelligence, but I'm also happy Saddam's gone and a democracy is standing up. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stitch 0 #37 December 23, 2008 Quote The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. ***DO WHAT??????? The economy has been on a steady downward slide since 1999. You must live in candy land or something. The economy didn't just up and jump in the toilet in 2008. "No cookies for you"- GFD "I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65 Don't be a "Racer Hater" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #38 December 23, 2008 Quote Quote The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. ***DO WHAT??????? The economy has been on a steady downward slide since 1999. You must live in candy land or something. The economy didn't just up and jump in the toilet in 2008. Real estate was still booming and the Dow didn't peak until 2006. Some parts may have been struggling, but it wasn't a on a constant downward slide. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
stitch 0 #39 December 23, 2008 Quote Quote Quote The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. ***DO WHAT??????? The economy has been on a steady downward slide since 1999. You must live in candy land or something. The economy didn't just up and jump in the toilet in 2008. Real estate was still booming and the Dow didn't peak until 2006. Some parts may have been struggling, but it wasn't a on a constant downward slide. The only reason real estate was booming was the banks were loaning to anybody and everybody. Now see what a wonderful business practice that was."No cookies for you"- GFD "I don't think I like the sound of that" ~ MB65 Don't be a "Racer Hater" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #40 December 23, 2008 Quote Quote Quote Quote The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. ***DO WHAT??????? The economy has been on a steady downward slide since 1999. You must live in candy land or something. The economy didn't just up and jump in the toilet in 2008. Real estate was still booming and the Dow didn't peak until 2006. Some parts may have been struggling, but it wasn't a on a constant downward slide. The only reason real estate was booming was the banks were loaning to anybody and everybody. Now see what a wonderful business practice that was. I couldn't agree more. That doesn't change anything about our current conversation. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,634 #41 December 23, 2008 QuoteQuoteThe bailout would have probably hurt the taxpayers a lot less if we weren't having to pay to prop up Iraq, too. This country was in no shape what so ever to take on two major military campaigns with a faltering economy. Afganistan was an expected response after 9/11. But Iraq could have waited. There are dozens of countries all over the world with dictators that mistreat the citizens. Do you think we should go on a personal crusade to set the world right no matter what the cost ? The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. . What a difference 5 years makes when you piss away a few hundred billion $$$ on an unnecessary and flawed war.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
akarunway 1 #42 December 23, 2008 Quote Quote Quote The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. ***DO WHAT??????? The economy has been on a steady downward slide since 1999. You must live in candy land or something. The economy didn't just up and jump in the toilet in 2008. Real estate was still booming and the Dow didn't peak until 2006. Some parts may have been struggling, but it wasn't a on a constant downward slide. Read this in it's entirety and get back to me. You are one stupid motherfucker>http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/12/21/business/21admin.php I hold it true, whate'er befall; I feel it, when I sorrow most; 'Tis better to have loved and lost Than never to have loved at all. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pulse 0 #43 December 23, 2008 QuoteThere's not a psychopathic murdering dictator running around. I guess an end to the genocide and all that other pesky stuff doesn't directly effect you, therefore it doesn't matter. There are still plenty of psychopathic murdering dictators out there. Are we going to go after all of them? Are our leaders going to lie to us each time we go after another one? As for genocide, how do we decide which people to 'save' and who not to? Also, you did not answer the question. How does this second part of your answer benefit the taxpayers?"Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riddler 0 #44 December 23, 2008 QuoteBut I blame Saddam for the hundreds of thousands of dead and tortured. We sure could've used your enthusiasm back when Pol Pot was murdering a million of his own people in the Khmer Rouge, and I don't hear you pining over the millions that have died in Africa from genocide, diamonds, etc. Most Americans don't give a ratt's butt about the atrocities going on in the world, unless we have another reason (like oil) to invade. Then it becomes a convenient excuse.Trapped on the surface of a sphere. XKCD Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #45 December 23, 2008 Quote Quote Quote Quote The economy wasn't in the dumps in 2003. ***DO WHAT??????? The economy has been on a steady downward slide since 1999. You must live in candy land or something. The economy didn't just up and jump in the toilet in 2008. Real estate was still booming and the Dow didn't peak until 2006. Some parts may have been struggling, but it wasn't a on a constant downward slide. Read this in it's entirety and get back to me. You are one stupid motherfucker>http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/12/21/business/21admin.php Go fuck yourself. That article says nothing about a constantly sliding economy. It talks about what lead up to the current crisis. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #46 December 23, 2008 QuoteQuoteThere's not a psychopathic murdering dictator running around. I guess an end to the genocide and all that other pesky stuff doesn't directly effect you, therefore it doesn't matter. QuoteThere are still plenty of psychopathic murdering dictators out there. Are we going to go after all of them? Should we turn our head and pretend it isn't happening? Quote Are our leaders going to lie to us each time we go after another one? I hope not. QuoteAs for genocide, how do we decide which people to 'save' and who not to? Also, you did not answer the question. How does this second part of your answer benefit the taxpayers? Sometimes decisions are made that don't necessarily benefit you directly. That doesn't make the decisions wrong. As far as the war on terror, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. I would say that's benefitted a few people. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites FallingOsh 0 #47 December 23, 2008 Quote We sure could've used your enthusiasm back when Pol Pot was murdering a million of his own people in the Khmer Rouge, and... So Saddam should've been left to his genocide because other's have done it in the past? Pol Pot wasn't stopped so we shouldn't stop anyone in the future? Quote... I don't hear you pining over the millions that have died in Africa from genocide, diamonds, etc. The thing is, you'd just be bitching about us needing to mind our own business. If you don't think we had a right to be in Iraq then why do you think we have a right to go to Africa? I think we should do more, but you obviously have a problem with our involvement in anything of the sort. You can't bitch at me for being glad Saddam is gone and then claim we should go into more countries. QuoteMost Americans don't give a ratt's butt about the atrocities going on in the world, unless we have another reason (like oil) to invade. Then it becomes a convenient excuse. Oil was never an excuse. Our Iraqi imports have remained the same or decreased since 2003 and generally hover just below 4% of the national total. If you're going to fall back on crap like that then we're not going to get anywhere. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Pulse 0 #48 December 23, 2008 Quote QuoteThere are still plenty of psychopathic murdering dictators out there. Are we going to go after all of them? Should we turn our head and pretend it isn't happening? I think the key word was said before, 'containment'. I've come to think a 'cold war' situation is not really a bad thing. QuoteAs for genocide, how do we decide which people to 'save' and who not to? Also, you did not answer the question. How does this second part of your answer benefit the taxpayers? Sometimes decisions are made that don't necessarily benefit you directly. That doesn't make the decisions wrong. As far as the war on terror, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. I would say that's benefitted a few people. So you're saying this doesn't necessarily benefit the tax payers. Interesting. The idea that 'we' haven't been attacked in 7 years means nothing. If you mean 'we' as in an attack on American soil. You're right, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. But prior to 2001 we hadn't been attacked since 1993. Prior to 1993, excluding the Oklahoma bombing, it seems we went much longer without an attack on American soil. If you mean 'we' as in the western world. There have still been plenty of attacks elsewhere. But, to use your logic, you don't see those. So they are of no consequence to you. So again, who exactly is this benefiting? How many people have we saved? For what?"Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites FallingOsh 0 #49 December 24, 2008 QuoteQuote QuoteThere are still plenty of psychopathic murdering dictators out there. Are we going to go after all of them? Should we turn our head and pretend it isn't happening? I think the key word was said before, 'containment'. I've come to think a 'cold war' situation is not really a bad thing. QuoteAs for genocide, how do we decide which people to 'save' and who not to? Also, you did not answer the question. How does this second part of your answer benefit the taxpayers? Sometimes decisions are made that don't necessarily benefit you directly. That doesn't make the decisions wrong. As far as the war on terror, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. I would say that's benefitted a few people. So you're saying this doesn't necessarily benefit the tax payers. Interesting. The idea that 'we' haven't been attacked in 7 years means nothing. If you mean 'we' as in an attack on American soil. You're right, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. But prior to 2001 we hadn't been attacked since 1993. Prior to 1993, excluding the Oklahoma bombing, it seems we went much longer without an attack on American soil. If you mean 'we' as in the western world. There have still been plenty of attacks elsewhere. But, to use your logic, you don't see those. So they are of no consequence to you. So again, who exactly is this benefiting? How many people have we saved? For what? First of all, your self-serving 'only if it benefits me' attitude is disgusting. If you want to stick your head in the sand then go for it. Don't expect it to be an effective foreign policy. Second, you're on crack if you think we were attacked once prior 9/11. Google USS Cole, WTC, OKC, Khobar towers, the embassy bombings of '98... -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Pulse 0 #50 December 24, 2008 QuoteFirst of all, your self-serving 'only if it benefits me' attitude is disgusting. If you want to stick your head in the sand then go for it. Don't expect it to be an effective foreign policy. Second, you're on crack if you think we were attacked once prior 9/11. Google USS Cole, WTC, OKC, Khobar towers, the embassy bombings of '98... I've lost a few friends in this war. Yet what if that was a son, daughter, mother, father. What about the relatives of the 100,000-plus civillian's killed in Iraq? When I hear people talk about "winning" in Iraq. What do they mean? What are we winning? It would be nice if you actually answered a question. You ignored the part where I mentioned attacks "on american soil". The only one here were the WTC in '93. Everything else was outside american borders. And there are STILL plenty of attacks outside of american borders. Why the hell would you even bring up OKC? That was brought down by Americans. One could say we haven't had an attack on our mainland for seven years. But we had gone longer than that in the past so....it's kind of business as usual. Or you could say attacks against westerners are still occuring so....business as usual. This shows how narrow-minded people who use this line of thinking are. Just because I've gone six years without a speeding ticket doesn't necessarily mean my driving has improved."Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Prev 1 2 3 4 5 Next Page 2 of 5 Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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FallingOsh 0 #47 December 23, 2008 Quote We sure could've used your enthusiasm back when Pol Pot was murdering a million of his own people in the Khmer Rouge, and... So Saddam should've been left to his genocide because other's have done it in the past? Pol Pot wasn't stopped so we shouldn't stop anyone in the future? Quote... I don't hear you pining over the millions that have died in Africa from genocide, diamonds, etc. The thing is, you'd just be bitching about us needing to mind our own business. If you don't think we had a right to be in Iraq then why do you think we have a right to go to Africa? I think we should do more, but you obviously have a problem with our involvement in anything of the sort. You can't bitch at me for being glad Saddam is gone and then claim we should go into more countries. QuoteMost Americans don't give a ratt's butt about the atrocities going on in the world, unless we have another reason (like oil) to invade. Then it becomes a convenient excuse. Oil was never an excuse. Our Iraqi imports have remained the same or decreased since 2003 and generally hover just below 4% of the national total. If you're going to fall back on crap like that then we're not going to get anywhere. -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pulse 0 #48 December 23, 2008 Quote QuoteThere are still plenty of psychopathic murdering dictators out there. Are we going to go after all of them? Should we turn our head and pretend it isn't happening? I think the key word was said before, 'containment'. I've come to think a 'cold war' situation is not really a bad thing. QuoteAs for genocide, how do we decide which people to 'save' and who not to? Also, you did not answer the question. How does this second part of your answer benefit the taxpayers? Sometimes decisions are made that don't necessarily benefit you directly. That doesn't make the decisions wrong. As far as the war on terror, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. I would say that's benefitted a few people. So you're saying this doesn't necessarily benefit the tax payers. Interesting. The idea that 'we' haven't been attacked in 7 years means nothing. If you mean 'we' as in an attack on American soil. You're right, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. But prior to 2001 we hadn't been attacked since 1993. Prior to 1993, excluding the Oklahoma bombing, it seems we went much longer without an attack on American soil. If you mean 'we' as in the western world. There have still been plenty of attacks elsewhere. But, to use your logic, you don't see those. So they are of no consequence to you. So again, who exactly is this benefiting? How many people have we saved? For what?"Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallingOsh 0 #49 December 24, 2008 QuoteQuote QuoteThere are still plenty of psychopathic murdering dictators out there. Are we going to go after all of them? Should we turn our head and pretend it isn't happening? I think the key word was said before, 'containment'. I've come to think a 'cold war' situation is not really a bad thing. QuoteAs for genocide, how do we decide which people to 'save' and who not to? Also, you did not answer the question. How does this second part of your answer benefit the taxpayers? Sometimes decisions are made that don't necessarily benefit you directly. That doesn't make the decisions wrong. As far as the war on terror, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. I would say that's benefitted a few people. So you're saying this doesn't necessarily benefit the tax payers. Interesting. The idea that 'we' haven't been attacked in 7 years means nothing. If you mean 'we' as in an attack on American soil. You're right, we haven't been attacked in 7 years. But prior to 2001 we hadn't been attacked since 1993. Prior to 1993, excluding the Oklahoma bombing, it seems we went much longer without an attack on American soil. If you mean 'we' as in the western world. There have still been plenty of attacks elsewhere. But, to use your logic, you don't see those. So they are of no consequence to you. So again, who exactly is this benefiting? How many people have we saved? For what? First of all, your self-serving 'only if it benefits me' attitude is disgusting. If you want to stick your head in the sand then go for it. Don't expect it to be an effective foreign policy. Second, you're on crack if you think we were attacked once prior 9/11. Google USS Cole, WTC, OKC, Khobar towers, the embassy bombings of '98... -------------------------------------------------- Stay positive and love your life. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Pulse 0 #50 December 24, 2008 QuoteFirst of all, your self-serving 'only if it benefits me' attitude is disgusting. If you want to stick your head in the sand then go for it. Don't expect it to be an effective foreign policy. Second, you're on crack if you think we were attacked once prior 9/11. Google USS Cole, WTC, OKC, Khobar towers, the embassy bombings of '98... I've lost a few friends in this war. Yet what if that was a son, daughter, mother, father. What about the relatives of the 100,000-plus civillian's killed in Iraq? When I hear people talk about "winning" in Iraq. What do they mean? What are we winning? It would be nice if you actually answered a question. You ignored the part where I mentioned attacks "on american soil". The only one here were the WTC in '93. Everything else was outside american borders. And there are STILL plenty of attacks outside of american borders. Why the hell would you even bring up OKC? That was brought down by Americans. One could say we haven't had an attack on our mainland for seven years. But we had gone longer than that in the past so....it's kind of business as usual. Or you could say attacks against westerners are still occuring so....business as usual. This shows how narrow-minded people who use this line of thinking are. Just because I've gone six years without a speeding ticket doesn't necessarily mean my driving has improved."Any language where the unassuming word fly signifies an annoying insect, a means of travel, and a critical part of a gentleman's apparel is clearly asking to be mangled." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
