Russian Nuclear Sub Incident Kills 20 plus

[Gawain 0]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081109/ap_on_re_eu/eu_russia_submarine

...talk about situations which few can imagine. On a vessel...no way off...emergencies must be confronted, no matter what.

So I try and I scream and I beg and I sigh
Just to prove I'm alive, and it's alright
'Cause tonight there's a way I'll make light of my treacherous life
Make light!

[jimmytavino 16]

hmmm ...

sad to hear of the loss of life..

jt

[Rookie120 0]

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maybe a disgruntled passenger, civilian OR enlisted,, who yanked the fire suppression activator,,

Or maybe the fire suppression system malfunctioned. It's not the first time that has happened. I don't know about on a sub but things do malfunction every now and then. Hope the sailors RIP.

If you find yourself in a fair fight, your tactics suck!

[TheAnvil 0]

How horrible. The Russian submarine service has seen a lot of tragedy over the past decade. This and the Kursk. Have to feel for those sailors.

Vinny the Anvil
Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL
JACKASS POWER!!!!!!

[jakee 1,259]

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How horrible. The Russian submarine service has seen a lot of tragedy over the past decade. This and the Kursk. Have to feel for those sailors.

And the decommisioned K-159 in 2003.

Who'd have thought that poor training, poor construction and poor maintenance would have this kind of effect?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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How horrible. The Russian submarine service has seen a lot of tragedy over the past decade. This and the Kursk. Have to feel for those sailors.

And the decommisioned K-159 in 2003.

Who'd have thought that poor training, poor construction and poor maintenance would have this kind of effect?

Sarcastic remarks regarding a tragedy such as this are tasteless and uncalled for.
If you MUST be a smartass about it, at least have the decency to wait until after the victims are laid to rest.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[jakee 1,259]

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Sarcastic remarks regarding a tragedy such as this are tasteless and uncalled for.
If you MUST be a smartass about it, at least have the decency to wait until after the victims are laid to rest.

Are you the morality police now?

I'm not taking the piss out of the sailors, it's the crumbling infrastructure of entire Russian military (and government) that make them unfit to operate nuclear submarines. At this stage, if they keep putting them to sea, quite a few people are almost certainly going to keep dying.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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Sarcastic remarks regarding a tragedy such as this are tasteless and uncalled for.
If you MUST be a smartass about it, at least have the decency to wait until after the victims are laid to rest.

Are you the morality police now?

I'm not taking the piss out of the sailors, it's the crumbling infrastructure of entire Russian military (and government) that make them unfit to operate nuclear submarines. At this stage, if they keep putting them to sea, quite a few people are almost certainly going to keep dying.

No shit, Dick Tracy. Did you figure that out all by yourself?
Show some respect for others and you may someday earn some for yourself.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[jakee 1,259]

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No shit, Dick Tracy. Did you figure that out all by yourself?
Show some respect for others and you may someday earn some for yourself.

You're just not even bothering to read are you? Just any excuse to have a go. Pretty pathetic really.

Tell me, how is it disrespectful to those sailors to criticise the dicrepit state of the Russian Navy as a whole that probably led to them losing their lives?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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No shit, Dick Tracy. Did you figure that out all by yourself?
Show some respect for others and you may someday earn some for yourself.

You're just not even bothering to read are you? Just any excuse to have a go. Pretty pathetic really.

Tell me, how is it disrespectful to those sailors to criticise the dicrepit state of the Russian Navy as a whole that probably led to them losing their lives?

There is nothing wrong with criticising the Russian Navy. There is nothing wrong with criticising the environment those men lived in that led to their deaths. AS LONG AS IT IS DONE IN A RESPECTFUL MANNER. Your original post showed as much respect for those men as if you had pissed on the graves.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[jakee 1,259]

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AS LONG AS IT IS DONE IN A RESPECTFUL MANNER. Your original post showed as much respect for those men as if you had pissed on the graves.

You just keep seeing what you want to see there, Sparky. Now run along before you bust a blood vessel or something, you seem awfully tense today.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[christelsabine 1]

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How horrible. The Russian submarine service has seen a lot of tragedy over the past decade. This and the Kursk. Have to feel for those sailors.

And the decommisioned K-159 in 2003.

Who'd have thought that poor training, poor construction and poor maintenance would have this kind of effect?

Sarcastic remarks regarding a tragedy such as this are tasteless and uncalled for.
If you MUST be a smartass about it, at least have the decency to wait until after the victims are laid to rest.

Sarcastic remarks?? Where?

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[Amazon 7]

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Lev Fyodorov, a top Russian chemical expert, agreed that the Freon pushed oxygen out, causing those inside to die of suffocation. But he wondered why the individual breathing kits that everyone on board is supposed to have did not keep people from dying.

"People on board the sub may have failed to use their breathing equipment when they found themselves in an emergency," he told the AP.

Failure to use EP tends to be disastrous in a lot of emergencies. I guess it all depends on how much warning they had or if they just panicked and did not go for the breathing apparatus.

[alw 0]

Eternal Father, strong to save,
Whose arm hath bound the restless wave,
Who bidd'st the mighty ocean deep
Its own appointed limits keep;
Oh, hear us when we cry to Thee,
For those in peril on the sea!

---------------------------------------------
Every day is a bonus - every night is an adventure.

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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AS LONG AS IT IS DONE IN A RESPECTFUL MANNER. Your original post showed as much respect for those men as if you had pissed on the graves.

You just keep seeing what you want to see there, Sparky. Now run along before you bust a blood vessel or something, you seem awfully tense today.

Whatever you say, schoolboy. You have a lot of growing up to do.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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Who'd have thought that poor training, poor construction and poor maintenance would have this kind of effect?

Very sarcastic post. Someone with respect for the deceased would have stated more along the lines of, "It is a shame those men died, but it is of no surprise considering how poorly they were trained, the ships constructed, and the poor maintenance."

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[normiss 622]

Also apparently quite accurate as well.
It serves no disrespect to the souls lost, although it does show how much disrespect for them their own government had.
Very sad really. Standing up to serve a country that can't return the favor.

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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Also apparently quite accurate as well.
It serves no disrespect to the souls lost, although it does show how much disrespect for them their own government had.
Very sad really. Standing up to serve a country that can't return the favor.

I guess I'm the only son-of-a-bitch here that has enough respect for lost sailors to feel a sarcastic smart-assed remark is out of place while addressing the incident so soon after it happened.
Oh wel, it's like the schoolboy said...respect has to be earned. And so far he is in negative numbers.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[vortexring 0]

Yeah, you respect the dead Ivans so well you're now happy to crack jokes a couple of sentences later. . .

'for it's Tommy this, an' Tommy that, an' "chuck 'im out, the brute!" But it's "saviour of 'is country" when the guns begin to shoot.'

[Belgian_Draft 0]

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Yeah, you respect the dead Ivans so well you're now happy to crack jokes a couple of sentences later. . .

No joke. My remarks were and are sincere.

HAMMER:
Originally employed as a weapon of war, the hammer nowadays is used as a
kind of divining rod to locate the most expensive parts adjacent the
object we are trying to hit.

[alw 0]

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How horrible. The Russian submarine service has seen a lot of tragedy over the past decade. This and the Kursk. Have to feel for those sailors.

And the decommisioned K-159 in 2003.

Who'd have thought that poor training, poor construction and poor maintenance would have this kind of effect?

Let me add a little perspective to this thread.

USS Thresher (SSN-593) Commissioned 3 August 1961 - Died 9 April 1963

USS Scorpion (SSN-589) Commissioned 29 July 1960 - Died May 22/May 27, 1968

There can be no question of the skill, dedication, commitment, and bravery of any man of any nation that serves in the submarine service. His flag of loyalty does not matter.

I have the utmost respect and highest regard for the Russian Submarine Force. They were and are worthy adversaries any have suffered a loss in their family that is felt in the heart of every submariner the world over. I feel the deepest sorrow for the families and loved ones of the yard workers and sailors that have perished in this accident.

There but for the grace of God go I.
USS Narwhal SSN 671/USS W.H. Bates

---------------------------------------------
Every day is a bonus - every night is an adventure.

[nanook 1]

I agree with your sentiment.

If that was their only other accident since the Kursk, then their safety trends are improving considerably. the cold war was rough on the Nuclear sailors. Lots of accidents.

_____________________________

"The trouble with quotes on the internet is that you can never know if they are genuine" - Abraham Lincoln

[normiss 622]

The cold war was devastating to the Russian Naval forces.
This particular sub was initially started construction in '91. One has to wonder how rusty she became sitting in an abandoned dry dock.
A terrible tragedy and shame.
A sailor's worst possible fears on a boat.
At least surface ships give you some chance, I always felt for the submariners.

[jakee 1,259]

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I agree with your sentiment.

If that was their only other accident since the Kursk

It wasn't. See my first post. Granted, that was on decommissioned sub being towed, but the cause of the accident was most likely gross negligence.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,259]

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There can be no question of the skill, dedication, commitment, and bravery of any man of any nation that serves in the submarine service. His flag of loyalty does not matter.

For the latter three, yes, absolutely. For the first point, no. A person's skill and competence depend on how well he has been trained, drilled and led. All the will in the world can't make up for major deficiencies in those areas. But that's a side issue anyway.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?