ryoder 1,384 #1 August 13, 2007 http://news.yahoo.com/s/thenation/20070810/cm_thenation/4221949"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freethefly 6 #2 August 13, 2007 That is a shame. I signed the petition. I usually oppose the death penalty due to the number of people whom have been proven innocent after conviction but do favor it in certian cases such as the guy who killed his wife and unborned baby and dumped them in the San Francisco Bay in California some years back. This case does not warrent the death penalty."...And once you're gone, you can't come back When you're out of the blue and into the black." Neil Young Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #3 August 13, 2007 That's f'd up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #4 August 13, 2007 Remember you're judged by the company you keep.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BIGUN 1,053 #5 August 13, 2007 Quote Remember you're judged by the company you keep. I'm screwed. I maintain the company of skydivers. Nobody has time to listen; because they're desperately chasing the need of being heard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #6 August 13, 2007 The other side of the story: "Four young men, Kenneth Foster, Mauriceo Brown, DeWayne Dillard and Julius Steen were driving around on August 15th, 1996 with Kenneth Foster driving his grandfather's car. At certain points, Brown and Steen got out of the car to commit robberies on random individuals. Kenneth's participation in these robberies was limited; he acted soley as the driver of the drop-off and getaway vehicle..."Source It's hard to find actual details of the crime, amidst all the blogs from namby-pamby whining liberals crying to set him free. They seem to always omit the part that these hoods were intentionally driving all around town committing a whole series of robbery attacks. When you go out to commit robberies, you are responsible for the fact that injury or death may result to your victims, and anyone participating in the crimes, even as a get-away driver, is equally guilty. Fry the bastard. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #7 August 13, 2007 Quote When you go out to commit robberies, you are responsible for the fact that injury or death may result to your victims, and anyone participating in the crimes, even as a get-away driver, is equally guilty. Fry the bastard. We could have use guys like you on Libby's jury, or better yet, the Iran/Contra investigation!!!! Guilt through association! Fuck 'em all!!!! I'll remember this the next time you try to defend.....oh......anyone. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,623 #8 August 13, 2007 QuoteQuote When you go out to commit robberies, you are responsible for the fact that injury or death may result to your victims, and anyone participating in the crimes, even as a get-away driver, is equally guilty. Fry the bastard. We could have use guys like you on Libby's jury, or better yet, the Iran/Contra investigation!!!! Guilt through association! Fuck 'em all!!!! I'll remember this the next time you try to defend.....oh......anyone. What should happen to Bush and Cheney, then? How many dead in Iraq due to their actions?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #9 August 13, 2007 QuoteQuoteQuote When you go out to commit robberies, you are responsible for the fact that injury or death may result to your victims, and anyone participating in the crimes, even as a get-away driver, is equally guilty. Fry the bastard. We could have use guys like you on Libby's jury, or better yet, the Iran/Contra investigation!!!! Guilt through association! Fuck 'em all!!!! I'll remember this the next time you try to defend.....oh......anyone. What should happen to Bush and Cheney, then? How many dead in Iraq due to their actions? I've always thought that the Hague was the best idea. Shows accountability and gets those warmongering freeloaders off the public dole when they retire. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #10 August 13, 2007 QuoteWhat should happen to Bush and Cheney, then? How many dead in Iraq due to their actions? Fewer than there would have been if Saddam was left in place. As for the guy that drove his Buddies around all night so that could Rob and eventually Kill People.. Good Riddance. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #11 August 13, 2007 Quote Quote We could have use guys like you on Libby's jury, or better yet, the Iran/Contra investigation!!!! Guilt through association! Fuck 'em all!!!! I'll remember this the next time you try to defend.....oh......anyone. What should happen to Bush and Cheney, then? How many dead in Iraq due to their actions? Oh look... There's a worm... It's stuck on a hook... That's tied to a string. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #12 August 13, 2007 Quote As for the guy that drove his Buddies around all night so that could Rob and eventually Kill People.. Good Riddance. So, next time a friend of yours downs a few beers with you, drives home and gets busted for a DUI or kills someone, then you'll have no problem going to jail and sharing a manslaughter charge with him? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #13 August 13, 2007 QuoteSo, next time a friend of yours downs a few beers with you, drives home and gets busted for a DUI or kills someone, then you'll have no problem going to jail and sharing a manslaughter charge with him? You would honestly equate that with this.. A Guy Drives his buddies around where at Several times they get out of the car, Rob People and then INTENTIONALLY Kill someone?? Is the guy driving the getaway car also guilty of Bank robbery?? He is actively participating in the crime. I don’t see much difference here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #14 August 13, 2007 QuoteQuoteSo, next time a friend of yours downs a few beers with you, drives home and gets busted for a DUI or kills someone, then you'll have no problem going to jail and sharing a manslaughter charge with him? You would honestly equate that with this.. A Guy Drives his buddies around where at Several times they get out of the car, Rob People and then INTENTIONALLY Kill someone?? Is the guy driving the getaway car also guilty of Bank robbery?? He is actively participating in the crime. I don’t see much difference here. Where does it say that they were driving around intentionally planning to kill someone? Rob? Yes. Bust him for that and throw him in jail but killing him because of what the other guy did, and was executed for, is f'd up. In the scenario I posted, you know that driving under the influence is illegal so does that make you an equal accomplice for letting your buddy do it? Or did he make the decision to drive that weapon home on his own? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #15 August 13, 2007 QuoteIn the scenario I posted, you know that driving under the influence is illegal so does that make you an equal accomplice for letting your buddy do it? In most cases, yes. There have been bars sued for this, People have been found guilty of exactly that. But that is a world of difference from that and helping your buddies commit armed Robbery and someone getting shot. What you are missing here is there were BAD people out doing bad things. Armed Robbery. When You take a Gun and try to Rob Someone and someone gets shot, It is not a surprise. If you are driving the getaway car, You are Guilty of participating in that Murder. Edit: and the "Several" came from this statement QuoteAt certain points, Brown and Steen got out of the car to commit robberies on random individuals Please note that "Points, Individuals and Robberies are all Plural. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #16 August 13, 2007 QuoteWhere does it say that they were driving around intentionally planning to kill someone The answer to that is key to me Are there more details? If it wasn't planned, he's still responsible, but not as much as the guy that did the act directly. (i.e., this punishment might be too much). But he still has some form of participation in murder charge due. If he was part of a "planned" murder, then I would hold him, and the rest, as guilty as the man who wields the knife/gun/hammer/etc. If he was unknowingly part of a planned murder - ie. the killer planned it but duped the rest, then I don't know. He directly help create the conditions to enable the kill...... Still, less serious than the killer himself. It would matter greatly to me if the driver had found out someone was killed and then turns himself and the killer in vs he finds out and then continues to break other laws with the killer. (i.e., is he capable of being part of a murder in the future, or was this way beyond his tolerance for criminal activity - what is his future threat for enabling another to murder?) However - "armed robbery", in the end, the threat in that act is serious injury/death. So that implies intention to kill for the sake of robbery. It's hard to ignore that murder is a definite option in this guy's mind from the moment he drove up and let the first robbery happen. and the 2nd, and the 3rd ....... ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NCclimber 0 #17 August 13, 2007 QuoteWhere does it say that they were driving around intentionally planning to kill someone? Rob? Yes. Bust him for that and throw him in jail but killing him because of what the other guy did, and was executed for, is f'd up. Tha key law in this case says that if you are participating in one criminal activity and a different crime is committed, then you are an accomplice. Kenneth Foster had been driving some friends around, who had been robbing people. He knew one guy had a gun. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mardigrasbob 0 #18 August 13, 2007 Texas; go there on vacation, leave on probation! If you are a conspirator in a felony and a death occurs during the crime, thats your ass too! Texas is not the only state to have such statutes. This article by the Nation is not about Texas,or whether this young f%#K-up rates the needle, It is pure political dribble aimed at a complete abolishment of the death penalty nation-wide, and to rally the liberal rabble. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #19 August 13, 2007 To use a Bank Robbery analogy.. If a someone drives the getaway car for a Bank Robbery, And people get shot during the robbery.. Aren’t they all guilty of Murder?? I think so. this is the same scenario only it was random people they were robbing instead of a bank. Whether they planned to kill or not is not relevant. They were conducting Armed Robbery. The possibility that people will get shot is extremely real. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #20 August 13, 2007 QuoteIf a someone drives the getaway car for a Bank Robbery, And people get shot during the robbery.. Aren’t they all guilty of Murder?? I think so. I don't know all 50 laws on this subject. I'd would say that the killer is guilty of murder. Everybody else is guilty of accomplis to murder. QuoteThey were conducting Armed Robbery. The possibility that people will get shot is extremely real. I completely agree, that's why accomplis to murder should carry extremely severe penalties so discussion like this isn't necessary. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #21 August 13, 2007 Quote The answer to that is key to me Are there more details? If it wasn't planned, he's still responsible, but not as much as the guy that did the act directly. (i.e., this punishment might be too much). But he still has some form of participation in murder charge due. I agree, accountability in a lesser form. This is from the Free Kenneth Foster website linked in the OP. "....After the second robbery, Dillard would testify nearly four years later, Foster wanted to stop. Foster asked Dillard to convince Steen and Brown, because Dillard knew them better and Foster thought they would dismiss his own hesitation. The four drove on, looking for a club Foster wanted to check out on the way home – but he got lost north of downtown, and wound up on a dark road in an unfamiliar neighborhood, driving behind two cars. Thinking the cars might be headed to a party, Foster continued behind them, until they pulled into a driveway leading up to a darkened house. Foster drove a short distance more before turning around. When the four passed the house again, they were surprised to see a woman standing at the foot of the long driveway, gesturing to them. Brown wanted to stop and check things out – especially the young woman. "Kenneth [Foster] had stopped and Julius [Steen] rolled his window down. And she was ... like, 'Well, why the hell are you following us?'" Brown testified. "And Julius was like, 'We wasn't following you.' ... She started cussing at Julius. And Julius said, 'I am not trying to hear you,' and he rolled up the window," Brown continued. "While she was walking away, she was like, 'Well, you all just like what you all see. Take a picture, it will last longer,'" he said. "I wanted more than a picture, I wanted her number. So, I got out of the car." Indeed, as Steen rolled up his window, Foster started to drive away, he said, and had to stop quickly when Brown's door opened. The three men waited in the car while Brown followed the woman, later identified as Mary Patrick, up the driveway – more than 80 feet away from Foster's car. Then, Foster said, he heard a gunshot: "I sprung up [and] hit the gas – it was more reflexive than anything else," he recalled, as Brown ran back to the car. "[Brown] gets in the car [and we say], 'Hey man, what happened?' He was catatonic." Foster drove away. There are several different accounts of what happened in the driveway, but undisputed is that the encounter left one person dead. Patrick's boyfriend, Michael LaHood Jr., who had apparently been standing near his car when Brown made it to the top of the drive, had been shot through the head at close range. LaHood lay dead, face down on the concrete driveway outside his parents' home. Within an hour, police arrested Foster, Dillard, Steen, and Brown." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #22 August 13, 2007 QuoteIt is pure political dribble aimed at a complete abolishment of the death penalty nation-wide, and to rally the liberal rabble. Of course, this is completely true. Although the same people would call for the head of someone innocent that shot back in self defense. ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #23 August 13, 2007 the story that Brown claims, it's full of "I wanted to", "I tried to", etc fact, they were robbing people fact, they tailed someone for miles fact, one of them got out and killed a guy hard to call ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #24 August 13, 2007 Quote don't know all 50 laws on this subject. I'd would say that the killer is guilty of murder. Everybody else is guilty of accomplis to murder. In Texas, they are Guilty of Murder and face the death penalty. That is why this person is going to be executed. That is the Law there. People that don’t want die in the chair should not drive their Buddies around for them to commit Armed Robberies. If they do and someone gets killed they just might get killed too. Sounds fair to me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
idrankwhat 0 #25 August 13, 2007 Quotethe story that Brown claims, it's full of "I wanted to", "I tried to", etc fact, they were robbing people fact, they tailed someone for miles fact, one of them got out and killed a guy hard to call I guess that's the Reader's Digest version of the facts but that they are summarized as "hard to call" is my point. You don't execute someone for "hard to call". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites