Death Penalty for drugs in Singapore?

[Lindsey 0]

If you took a person and held him in captivity against his will, that'd also be against the law. However, we hold people in jail. The rules change once you've been convicted of a crime....

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A conservative is just a liberal who's been mugged. A liberal is just a conservative who's been to jail

[Bigwind 0]

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Then I guess it is never right to interfere in what anyone else does ever if it doesn't directly affect you. Sounds like a complete lack of empathy to me.

is that why America pokes its nose in the affairs of other countries?

Something that Britain has never done, right?

not since you took over as the worlds police

[seedy 0]

Isn't your stance based on a cultural perspective and not an absolute? What makes one cultural perspective more valid than any other?

I intend to live forever -- so far, so good.

[ReBirth 0]

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"Premeditated killing" implies "murder," which is defined as unlawful killing. By definition, it was not an unlawful killing.

Premeditated killing is killing with forethought and planning. That's what state execution is. The fact that you're making the correlation between that and murder is something that you need to rationalize for yourself. Particularly since you seem to be defending it.

[RhondaLea 3]

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"Premeditated killing" implies "murder," which is defined as unlawful killing. By definition, it was not an unlawful killing.

Premeditated killing is killing with forethought and planning. That's what state execution is. The fact that you're making the correlation between that and murder is something that you need to rationalize for yourself. Particularly since you seem to be defending it.

First issue: To me, you are a legal "wuffo." Your use of this phrase in this way is much like a skydiving wuffo talking about "pulling the string" or saying "the chute didn't open." As I think I said, as a legal concept...yada yada yada.

Second issue: I don't need to rationalize anything. We have established societies and their rules to protect the members of those societies. If a person does harm to another member of a society--local or global--then measures are in place to deal with that harm. (I've already said how I feel about drug laws, but as I also said, when you choose the action, you choose the consequence.)

I do have some issues with the death penalty, because if you find out later that a man is innocent, you can let him out of jail, but you can't let him out of the grave.

On the other hand, there are situations...well, I'm of the opinion that some people are just better dead, and I would not hesitate to carry out the sentence with mine own two hands.

Anyway, on the proofread, I find that I'm repeating myself a little too much for my own comfort. Please don't make me do it again.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[kallend 1,683]

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"Premeditated killing" implies "murder," which is defined as unlawful killing. By definition, it was not an unlawful killing.

Premeditated killing is killing with forethought and planning. That's what state execution is. The fact that you're making the correlation between that and murder is something that you need to rationalize for yourself. Particularly since you seem to be defending it.

First issue: To me, you are a legal "wuffo."
rl

"Watch out, here comes the old appeal to authority defense".

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[lawrocket 3]

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"Premeditated killing" implies "murder," which is defined as unlawful killing. By definition, it was not an unlawful killing.

Premeditated killing is killing with forethought and planning. That's what state execution is. The fact that you're making the correlation between that and murder is something that you need to rationalize for yourself. Particularly since you seem to be defending it.

You are both right, but you are just viewing it from different perspectives.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[dmcoco84 5]

I think thier thought on that matter is if you sell drugs you are not only breaking the but you are destroying the loves of everyone you sell to. So they see selling drugs as worse than murder because you affect a lot vs. 1 or 2.

I don't agree but what can ya do..........

Coco

[RhondaLea 3]

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"Premeditated killing" implies "murder," which is defined as unlawful killing. By definition, it was not an unlawful killing.

Premeditated killing is killing with forethought and planning. That's what state execution is. The fact that you're making the correlation between that and murder is something that you need to rationalize for yourself. Particularly since you seem to be defending it.

You are both right, but you are just viewing it from different perspectives.

Okay, you tell me: how is a legal execution a "premeditated killing"?

And is "different perspectives" just another way of saying "spin"?

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[jakee 1,280]

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Okay, you tell me: how is a legal execution a "premeditated killing"?

And is "different perspectives" just another way of saying "spin"?

Simple, you are viewing it from a legal perspective in terms of what is and is not illegal.

ReBirth was using the phrase in terms of what is right or wrong with no implication of illegality, merely immorality.

At the end of the day they did kill him and it was premeditated as those terms are defined in the english language.

In legal usage they may have added connotations but, again, we are not in a courtroom and we are not arguing about legality. Premeditated killing is therefore a perfectly acceptable description of what happened. They thought about killing him, then they did.

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[ReBirth 0]

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First issue: To me, you are a legal "wuffo." Your use of this phrase in this way is much like a skydiving wuffo talking about "pulling the string" or saying "the chute didn't open." As I think I said, as a legal concept...yada yada yada.

Fine...I'm a legal whuffo...when did I ever claim to be using a legal term? I'm using the english language.

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Anyway, on the proofread, I find that I'm repeating myself a little too much for my own comfort. Please don't make me do it again.

Well, you are making me repeat myself. State sponsored execution is premeditated killing. It is planning and carrying out the killing of another human being with forethought and intention. The fact that some artificially created bodies of rulers are empowered and permitted to carry out premeditated killing doesn't make it ok, whether you knew they had that power in advance or not.

If I tell you I'm going to kill you if you don't stop posting, and you continue to post, and I kill you...well, then it's your own damn fault, right? I told you the consequences in advance.

[RhondaLea 3]

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Okay, you tell me: how is a legal execution a "premeditated killing"?

And is "different perspectives" just another way of saying "spin"?

Simple, you are viewing it from a legal perspective in terms of what is and is not illegal.

ReBirth was using the phrase in terms of what is right or wrong with no implication of illegality, merely immorality.

At the end of the day they did kill him and it was premeditated as those terms are defined in the english language.

In legal usage they may have added connotations but, again, we are not in a courtroom and we are not arguing about legality. Premeditated killing is therefore a perfectly acceptable description of what happened. They thought about killing him, then they did.

No. They didn't think about killing him. They passed a law that said "Smuggle drugs and die."

Action ---> Consequence.

I don't see that "premeditated" is ever used except in a legal context, and the intent of calling it a "premeditated killing" is to equate the death penalty with murder.

In my book, that's spin.

If you want to say that you think the death penalty is state-sanctioned murder, just say that. Don't be cute, don't be coy. Manipulation of the language is only clever when no one sees through it.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[ReBirth 0]

I'm not manipulating shit....you are. Murder is a legal term as well, and state sponsored execution does not fit that term. Murder, by definition is an illegal act. State sponsored execution is not illegal. However it is premeditated. Crack a dictionary and look up the word. Here's the first definition:

To plan, arrange, or plot (a crime, for example) in advance

A crime, for example, yes, but not the only use of the word. Whatever you think you're seeing through, you're making up in your own mind. Unless the state is randomly walking up to prisoners and shooting them in the head, then executing prisoners is premeditated. It is not an act of war, it is not an accident, it is premeditated, it is planned and arranged.

I take it you find the idea of premeditated killing to be wrong. So do I. You're trying to manipulate language and not use the word premeditated so that you can continue defending the fact that states commit that act (without calling it what it is.)

[Shotgun 1]

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I know nothing about heroine, but I can't believe that 14 ounces is a monstrous amount of it, and this guy is being hung for it.

14 ounces is a lot of heroin, definitely enough to not be considered "personal use." It sucks that the guy was executed over it, but I would imagine that he knew it wasn't a very good idea to be trafficking drugs in Singapore.

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So, If you knew if you got caught with a big bag of heroine, that you would be executed, without hesitation, by the government, would you sell drugs?

I find prison and all the associated legal hassles to be enough of a deterrent that I wouldn't sell drugs. And, well, I have no desire to sell drugs anyway.

But yes, I do think the death penalty for drug dealers would curb the flow of drugs in the US at least a little bit. I certainly wouldn't vote for it though; I think law enforcement should have better things to do with their time anyway.

[Falko 0]

I side with ReBirth.

1) Legalize drugs in that they will be made available to addicts through a doctor, just like any other medicine. Legalizing does not mean "making available publicly". I'm not saying it's ok to buy your personal dose of heroin like a pack of cigarettes in a shop just because you feel it's a good day to try a new drug.

But I'm all for controlled output to addicts under medical supervision, that's what will lower drug-related crime significantly!

2) Against capital punishment, in Singapore and everywhere.

Ich betrachte die Religion als Krankheit, als Quelle unnennbaren Elends für die menschliche Rasse.
(Bertrand Russell, engl. Philosoph, 1872-1970)

[RhondaLea 3]

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I take it you find the idea of premeditated killing to be wrong. So do I. You're trying to manipulate language and not use the word premeditated so that you can continue defending the fact that states commit that act (without calling it what it is.)

I think murder is wrong.

I don't think that the legal execution of a person who has been lawfully adjudicated guilty of a crime is murder.

By your definition, and only by your definition, I think that "premeditated killing" is acceptable, with certain limitations, as I believe I mentioned earlier.

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[ReBirth 0]

That's fine...but it's not my defintion. I got it from the dictionary.

[narcimund 0]

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We have established societies and their rules to protect the members of those societies.

What a lovely warm and fuzzy belief.

First Class Citizen Twice Over

[RhondaLea 3]

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We have established societies and their rules to protect the members of those societies.

What a lovely warm and fuzzy belief.

That's the theory.

The implementation hasn't worked out as well as it might.

Are you ready to revolt?

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[RhondaLea 3]

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That's fine...but it's not my defintion. I got it from the dictionary.

I can find a bunch of definitions of "premeditated," but I can't find a single dictionary definition of "premeditated killing."

I did however google it, and I posted a link to the results. Every instance implies "murder."

One of the prerequisites of argument is the definition of terms. I don't and won't accept your definition, so I guess that means we can't argue this issue anymore.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[artistcalledian 0]

round and round and round and round and......

i think in about 5 posts time, everybody posting in the topic is about to dissapear up their own arses

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drive it like you stole it and f*ck the police

[ViperPilot 0]

This guy went into Singapore knowing the law and knowing he was subject to it (or at least he should have). He broke their law, thus he has to abide by it. I have no problem w/ some d bag drug smuggler get the axe, especially when he broke laws that already said he'd get it.

[Gravitymaster 0]

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This guy went into Singapore knowing the law and knowing he was subject to it (or at least he should have). He broke their law, thus he has to abide by it. I have no problem w/ some d bag drug smuggler get the axe, especially when he broke laws that already said he'd get it.

I"d argue the guy was guilty of suicide. Makes more sense than claiming it was premeditated murder.

[Wopelao 0]

Ah, the usual liberal response. The guilty party is not responsible...

[ReBirth 0]

Again....who said it was premeditated murder? It is premeditated killing. A lot of people getting their hackles up when I use that accurate and specific term. Almost as if they think premeditated killing is wrong while trying to hold onto the idea that state run execution is ok.