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gary350

500th!!!!! Dead Americans, That Is. . .

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So what you and Faber are saying is that a President who had only been in office for 8 months is to blame for all of Al Qaedas problems and therefore deserved to die? I really hope this isn't what you are saying because if it is, it is one of the most dispicable comments I have ever heard on this web site.



NO!! That is not what I'm saying. I did not say they should kill the president. WTF do you take me for. I said killing innocent people is no way to achieve their goal and that the source of their problems would be a better target. I DID NOT SAY THEY SHOULD KILL THE PRESIDENT!!!! You are deliberately twisting my words and the words of someone whos first language is not english in order to make us out to be evil USA bashers.

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I said killing innocent people is no way to achieve their goal and that the source of their problems would be a better target


So what is the source of their problems? I am really curious as to your answer. I will not assume you mean the president. But who/what is the source of the problems?

BTW, killing innocent people is what terrorism is about. Otherwise, it would be a war.

Ciels-
Micehle


~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

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Well for your information, the did hit the Pentagon and they killed over 100


im werry aware of that yes

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people who's only crime was they went to work that day


sorry i didnt know that Pentagon was a public place were NO military or like is located.

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I knew someone who was murdered by this despicable terrorist group


im sorry to hear,who would you like killed instead???

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you to sit there and make a statement like you just did is way over the top.


perhaps as many other comments on this tread

Stay safe
Stefan Faber

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So what you and Faber are saying is that a President who had only been in office for 8 months is to blame for all of Al Qaedas problems and therefore deserved to die? I really hope this isn't what you are saying because if it is, it is one of the most dispicable comments I have ever heard on this web site.



NO!! That is not what I'm saying. I did not say they should kill the president. WTF do you take me for. I said killing innocent people is no way to achieve their goal and that the source of their problems would be a better target. I DID NOT SAY THEY SHOULD KILL THE PRESIDENT!!!! You are deliberately twisting my words and the words of someone whos first language is not english in order to make us out to be evil USA bashers.



Well, you know what Ian? I'm going to not comment any further on this. I'm going to let everyone who is reading this thread decide for themselves what Faber was saying and you are defending.

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Andrew, stop looking to twist what I am saying.

Ciels-
Michele



How is it twisting what you said? It's right there for
everyone to see.

You said that when innocent people get killed that is terrorosm. Over 8000 innocent Iraqi people have been killed in Iraq due to the occupation to date (source previously quoted). How is that not terrorism, by your definition?

My point is that one mans terrorist is another mans soldier and vice-versa. There is no clear delineation, no matter how black and white our leaders want to try to portray it.

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Using trite sound bytes like "because they hate freedom" does no justice to such a complex issue.



You're right. We all know the real reason. It's because they're all crazy!
lol



To whomever posted, angry about people saying he didn't know why he was fighting: Wether or not you know why your fighting is irrelevant... you fight because you got papers telling you to. But consider this:

There are a number of American soldiers who get activation orders without knowing where they're being shipped off to or whom they will be comfronting when they get there... basically, as a soldier, it does not matter if you know the WHY.

While "there", you saw a lot of things and you say "That's why! Don't tell me I don't know why!"



My Karma ran over my Dogma!!!

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So what is the source of their problems? I am really curious as to your answer. I will not assume you mean the president. But who/what is the source of the problems?

BTW, killing innocent people is what terrorism is about. Otherwise, it would be a war.

Ciels-
Micehle



Theres is no way I can claim to have knowledge in deapth enough to answer your question directly. But I will ask one of my own. Is it so unreasonable to believe there is "a source" of the problem and that attacking it/them would have better served the cause of the hijackers than killing those poor people on 9/11?

As for terrorism, I know what it is.

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To whomever posted, angry about people saying he didn't know why he was fighting: Wether or not you know why your fighting is irrelevant... you fight because you got papers telling you to. But consider this:

There are a number of American soldiers who get activation orders without knowing where they're being shipped off to or whom they will be comfronting when they get there... basically, as a soldier, it does not matter if you know the WHY.

While "there", you saw a lot of things and you say "That's why! Don't tell me I don't know why!"



Man, this hit the nail right on the head. Excellent post.

It's very surprising to me that aren't more (any?) soldiers questioning the reasons why they are being sent to Iraq. Is it the military doctrine that you just don't question things? I can understand that to an extent, but when your fellow soldiers are dieing in the hundreds, does that not make you question the validity of why you are over there?

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Theres is no way I can claim to have knowledge in deapth enough to answer your question directly. But I will ask one of my own. Is it so unreasonable to believe there is "a source" of the problem and that attacking it/them would have better served the cause of the hijackers than killing those poor people on 9/11?


So you, despite making a judgment about who should/should not be killed, without knowing the reasons AQ determined those targets, decided that there were better targets? What problems are the AQ addressing? What problems do the AQ have? If you don't know that, then why did you make your statement? I'm a bit befuddled on your logic here. Can you help clear it up?

As to your question, yes, there is never a justifiable reason to target, attack, and terminate nearly 3000 people who are not in a war zone, and who are not enlisted in the military.

Ciels-
Michele


~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

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I just read this and fell out of my chair... previously in the thread didnt you say it was good for Clinton to release political tension by cheating on his wife now you are lecturing about sin???? Im sorry but the bullshit on this thread is getting deep, i have to go change shoes Amazon



I just consider these sins a bit greater than a sexual liason.. Hypocrites on the right view things differently I guess.

blow job vs killing thousands of people.... perspective....interesting.

The rest of the world think americans have way too many sexual hangups when the religious whackos get going on things like that... but they get a little more upset and disgusted by a country that can just write off... collateral damage in the name of liberating people??? The bullshit was transposed from TEXAS to Washington DC.. IT will take years to get the stench off our government.

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Well for your information, the did hit the Pentagon and they killed over 100 innocent people who's only crime was they went to work that day.



Who is an "innocent person" in the eyes of their enemy? Working at the f*cking Pentagon to boot! You act as though they nailed the salvation army... and not the US Army.

Listen, I'm not actively engaged in a war agaisnt the states. If I was however, beleive me, the Pentagon would be a millitary target and those people who work there, I would not consider "innocent".

This is cold but it is true. Of all the lives lost that day, those in the Pentagon were the least-trajic. What Faber is saying is that if someone declares war on a country, it is less trajic that they destroy millitary targets instead of civillians. Do you not agree?



My Karma ran over my Dogma!!!

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Michele, you are very articulate and I'm afraid I lack the skills to properly express what I mean.

As someone pointed out earlier, they would not attack if there wasn't a reason or something was pissing them off. That is the logic I am working with.

The target selection thing I was referring to.. I just think they went for shock value rather than actually hitting whatever it is they think they need to lash out against. I'm sorry if that is unclear, its the best way I know how to put it.

As has been said before, one mans terrorist is anothers freedom fighter.

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they would not attack if there wasn't a reason or something was pissing them off. That is the logic I am working with.


O.K., I can follow that.

But what do you think those reasons/somethings are? I really do want to understand this, if I can. ;) Worry not about articulation. Sometimes I think that I just string a bunch of words together, but then my thought gets lost in there! LOL!!!

Ciels-
Michele


~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek
While our hearts lie bleeding?~

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As to your question, yes, there is never a justifiable reason to target, attack, and terminate nearly 3000 people who are not in a war zone, and who are not enlisted in the military.

Ciels-
Michele



What about the 8000 Iraq civilians killed to date? It's incredible that you can criticise him for being contradictory and yet be so contradictory yourself.

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But what do you think those reasons/somethings are?
Ciels-
Michele



I wish I knew. I really do. I can only speculate that the US uses economic policies that create hardship for the people of the countries where most of the hate is coming from. Someone out there must know why and I'd really like to get their opinion.

I'd also like to get yours. Why do you think someone would attack your country in such a horrible manner?? Personal opinion will do, I don't expect you understand it. After all if I don't get it how can I ask you to?:P

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I see people from warzones,i see KIDS that dont have any family,becours of war.now how often do you see that?



Every time we see family of a fireman, policeman, soldier, or 1000s of innocent wives, kids, brothers, sisters and parents of those who died on the 911 terror attack.

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What about the 8000 Iraq civilians killed to date? It's incredible that you can criticise him for being contradictory and yet be so contradictory yourself.



That is just "collateral damage" not real human beings... unworthy...

OBL declared war on the US as a stated goal to get the US out of his HOME COUNTRY.. a country that is the keeper of the most Holy sites in his and their religion....he hates the people who nurtured his early years.Just think about how tight of an iron grip the SAUD family, and the internecine rivalries. His family could make great sums of money due to their business but he can never have the power he wants because he is not a member of the Royal family.
WE support his enemies that have bought him off for years. and he sees us as his greatest enemy.

The CIA and the REagan Administration fostered his growth as a Freedom fighter (terrorist). Thru their surrogates in the Pakistani Intelligence community billions of dollars were funneled into doing anything to drive the Soviets in Afghanistan out. It was COLD WAR politics.. run by the same people that are in the current Administration. IT was funded with massive sums of DRUG MONEY... heroin from Afghanistan...Cocaine from Columbia... The US built this problem and OBL and the Mujahadeen learned all to well. They toppled one superpower and think they can do it again.
If we had actually stayed on the war on terror and hunted all these maniacs down worldwide the rest of the world would still be with us... helping us in our fight, built on the good will brought about by the heinous attack on the Twin Towers.

Instead the administration squandered that with a personal vendetta on a long time thorn in their side.. who they had ALSO fostered and nurtured. So many of the petty dictators were useful as long as they were our little bitches... and now like Noriega and others Sadaam is gone.. OBL will be a much harder target now. We have given him what he wanted.. millions of new followers.

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But what do you think those reasons/somethings are?


muslims has serval times asked USA to back off and not to interfeer whith how they live,USA dont stop to do so.Thats why many arabs are mas at USA..

just to say one of the things...

I do belive that USA some how needs to show muslim cuntryes that if they want help they have to follow some rules.

A BIG mistake is to call all enemyes for terroists,when it then show that they aint,then (in this case)USA looks bad.

only thing i/many in the world ask about is: be honnest about theese things..If USA had said "that sadam-guy needs to stop what he´s doing to his people down there"then more cuntryes/UN would have helped,but as USA says they has weappons they cant have(by the way doubbel moral),and they are terroists whith out letting inspectors doing their jobs first,then it cant be tolerated to go to war for such a reasson.

I think what happened 9-11 were werry sad,i feel for freinds and familyes of the victims.

Stay safe
Stefan Faber

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I see people from warzones,i see KIDS that dont have any family,becours of war.now how often do you see that?



Every time we see family of a fireman, policeman, soldier, or 1000s of innocent wives, kids, brothers, sisters and parents of those who died on the 911 terror attack.



What, you mean you saw them on TV? That's the extent of the interaction between the majority of the population of the US and the victims of 9/11. It's a rather different story in Iraq though.

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So, in essence you think USA deserved 911 ... thanks


I never think that killing other people is right.but i do understand why some one wants to kick ass in USA,just sad they didnt manneged to kill the right people instead of inocent people.



So you hoped Al Qaeda would murder the President of the U.S.? I hope I'm not reading this correctly.



He thinks that it's ok to kill Americans, but not ok to kill terrorists? How can anyone justify this?



never pull low......unless you are

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