Thanatos340 1 #76 December 28, 2005 QuoteSo according to this statement Darius is an idiot. Correct? Anyone putting the general Public at risk for their own Ego rush is an Idiot in my opinion. I do not know Darius or the situation where he was racing or if there were other cars around. I am not making any sort of personal attack just stating the opinion of someone who once considered himself a Street Racer on people in general who race off Traffic Lights on an Open Public Road where others are put in danger. Saying All Street Racers are Idiots is a lot like saying all Base Jumpers are Idiots. Both are inherently dangerous and illegal activities that can be done relatively safely if the proper precautions are taken. Every Situation is unique. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
yardhippie 0 #77 December 28, 2005 QuoteI'm fully aware of what you're talking about (many of my friends were participants in a similar scene in Chicago a long time ago)... and while I would say that it is the lesser evil of the "street racing" scene, I still have no respect for it at all due to the lack of driver skill involved. where do you get your information that street racers have no skills? From the few "kids" as you call them driving around town with too much money tied up in their wheels and wings? If you follow that type of logig then anyone on here with low jump numbers has no skill. Lets stay off the stereotypical high horse. People racing on the street put themselves and others at risk. That in no way correlates to their skill level. I raced on the street before I ever started racing at the track. I performed all my own work. I bought all my own stuff. I learned to drive from those around me. And when I finally got sense enough to go to the track I took runner up in points for the first and second halvs of the season, and 3rd over all classes. I dont belive that I am the only exception to your idea that street racers have no skill. Oh, and I no longer race (street or otherwise), I have new hobbies now. just my .02 Goddam dirty hippies piss me off! ~GFD "What do I get for closing your rig?" ~ me "Anything you want." ~ female skydiver Mohoso Rodriguez #865 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hexadecimal 0 #78 December 28, 2005 Did I say none of them had skill? No. I said "due to the lack of driver skill involved". There isn't much driving skill involved in rowing through the gears in a straight line hoping you have more power than your opponent... and nobody can dispute that statement. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #79 December 28, 2005 QuoteI still have no respect for it at all due to the lack of driver skill involved. Street Racing is more about Building the best car that Driver Skill. True most any idiot Stand on the GAs and try to keep it straight. But Drag Racing in general requires a Hell of alot more skill than Most people would realize. Again.. Wins or Losses are determined by 100ths or even 1000ths of a second. Reaction times are critical. The advent of Delay Boxes, Throttle stops, Stutter Boxes, Rev Limiters, Trans Brakes and other such things have taken alot of the driver skill out of the picture and is the reason I stick to Foot-Brake Classes. I dont need a Computer driving for me even if the Computer is more consistent. Warren Johnson once said that on a Perfect Pass where nothing goes wrong.. The driver has 23 different actions to make. every one must be perfect and in his case this takes place in 6 Seconds while pulling several Gee`s. Skill. Talent and Balls. How much talent does it take to Skydive?? I mean anyone can just fall out of a Plane, Right? My Daughter Started Racing at age 8 in a Junior Dragster. By the time she was 10 she was a better driver than I will ever be and had finished #6 in the Nation (Better instinct and Better reaction Times). By 11 She was Running 8:90`s in the 1/8 mile at 80+mph (Faster and quicker than many of these Hot Rod Mustangs you see running around). Unfortunately, She was Burnout from racing by 12 and is taking a few years off. Watching her progression really showed me how much Skill and Talent was involved in becoming a better Driver. I have never said that Drag Racers are any better than Road Racers. I Freely admit that Road Racing takes a great deal of Skill. But until you spend a while drag Racing and learning the subtleties of the Sport.. I wouldn’t be so quick to say that it doesn’t take skill. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
funks 1 #80 December 28, 2005 QuoteThere isn't much driving skill involved in rowing through the gears in a straight line hoping you have more power than your opponent... and nobody can dispute that statement I am sure whomever has the brightest fluorescent lights underneath their car also has an advantage in addition to the power. Having the most aftermarket parts stickers on your car probably doesnt hurt either. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #81 December 28, 2005 QuoteYou've never been in the car with him have you? I know I haven't. And odds are, I probably never will if he's behind the wheel. His descriptions indicate that he pushes it beyond my personal comfort level. All I know is that in over 16 years of driving I've never had a crash or a moving violation. Sure, I drive like an old man, prefering to keep my highway speed on cruise control at around the speed limit. I also admit that I am not particularly fond of weaving in and out of traffic. I'm never the fastest car on the road, but usually around the 4th or 5th fastest. I wear a helmet when I roller blade. I guess I'm not cool, but I also like the thought that if I screw up, I've got extra protection. Maybe I have nothing to prove to myself. My Mercury Sable is a totally uncool car but it's got a 5-Star safety rating and I got a great deal on it. I DO find a nice challenge in seeing what kind of mileage I can squeeze out of it and doing my best not to sink money into it for maintenance that can be avoided with some care. I just come from a different perspective. Darius said, "I do not live my life by any ones rules and how they think I should live." That's fine, but there are consequences for it. I don't like a number of the rules I live by, but I see the purpose and reason for them, and I'd rather not face the consequences. Even more so, I'd rather my wife and son don't face those consequences. Darius also wrote, "I would never want to live in a 100% controlled world where I give up my freedom and the things I enjoy for safety." That's also fine with me, but when it's the safety of others that is being risked, that's where I draw the line. Would you strap an infant into a car seat for one of your races? If not, why not? If so, why would you put someone who has no choice into that situation? Ironically, it's the same situation as everyone who is sharing the road with you. Your desire not to live by the rules DIRECTLY implicates everyone else on the road who have ZERO choice but to play by YOUR rules. It's a bit ironic, isn't it? You bring others into your rules and your realm who don't want to be there. In fact, they don't even know that there are playing by your rules, which is a recipe for disaster. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hexadecimal 0 #82 December 28, 2005 You're talking about professional drag racing, not street racing. The difference is night and day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Thanatos340 1 #83 December 28, 2005 QuoteYou're talking about professional drag racing, not street racing. The difference is night and day. Not at all. It is the exact same. The same Drivers were at the Street Races that you saw at the Track. In fact it was always crystal clear at the track which cars were also races on the Street. They would have N/T on the windows and only make solo passes during Test and Tune. The N/T was so that the Tower would not call out their Time. A Street Racer NEVER wants anyone to really know how fast their car really is. They would hone their SKILLS and get their Cars ready for going back to the Street Races where they could make some real Money. Same Cars. Same Drivers. Same Skill Set. In fact many of the street racers were Much better drivers than some of the Track Only Pro and Semi-Pro Drivers. They found that Street Racing was a Better was to pay for their Toys. My Whole point in this thread is a)Drag Racing takes alot more Skill than most people will ever understand (Alot like Skydiving) and B) Not all Street Racers are Idiots that put the general Public in danger. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #84 December 28, 2005 Not just directed at you but everyone. Why do we skydive? I mean what if you have a double mal and fall threw someone’s roof and kill their baby? Why do we BASE jump? Why would you not just skydive at least it is safer right you have two canopies at least. Why do people swoop? I mean why would you do a 270 or some even do 720s to build up speed when you could land under a big safe canopy? I mean what if you run in to a student on your hook turn and kill him? The answer IT’S FUN. I find regular racing boring. Drag is straight line…. Boring for me. Oval tracks are a joke. I think the most skilled drivers are street racers. Yes we have some who don’t even belong behind a big wheel but it takes more skill to have to react to situations you don’t know then to race around an oval track. It makes it more fun that you can get caught. F&F was the worst thing that could have happened for racing. I was learning how to do maneuvers from my brother in his Supra back in 1988 yes I was 12. So think what you want I didn’t just one day decide I want to be like Paul walker. You might look at me like I am an idiot, but I look at it this way. Either you get it or you don’t. That’s always the case. I hear people say why would any one ever swoop, I can’t explain to them why I want to learn to swoop or why I get it I just know I do.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hexadecimal 0 #85 December 28, 2005 I'm not sure you're getting my point... and you basically agreed with me in the post I was responding to if you read it again. What skill is involved when you purposely hide the potential of your car hoping that someone with a less capable car will "race" you? I'd be more inclined to respect them if they were racing identical cars. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
funks 1 #86 December 28, 2005 QuoteYou might look at me like I am an idiot, but I look at it this way. You said you get off driving 120 mph in and out of traffic. People look at you like an idiot for two reasons: 1. For actually doing it 2. For admitting you do it and acting proud of it QuoteEither you get it or you don’t. What is there to get? You forget you are talking to people who are generally considered extreme, or adrenaline junkies. You dont think we dont get what you are saying? Problem is you jeopardize innocent lives with what you say gets you off. That is called being a fucking jackass. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hexadecimal 0 #87 December 28, 2005 QuoteWhy do we skydive? I mean what if you have a double mal and fall threw someone’s roof and kill their baby? This isn't helping your argument. How many times have skydivers fallen through someone's roof and killed their child? None. How many times have "street racers" caused fatal accidents while weaving in and out of traffic at dangerous speeds? Many. I'd love to see your street racing friends on a closed course, since they're obviously going to teach me a thing or two seeing as how they're the best and all... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BDashe 0 #88 December 28, 2005 No blowers on my mustang, but i didn't blow my cash on all the bullshit aero stuff. In addition to some fun engine mods, Ive got an eibach/tokiko suspension that drives the boxters NUTS. Ive got a road right near my house that has plenty of turns. Nothing is more fun than gluing myself to the bumper of a porsche in em. I love takin on the outside, downshift and pop the clutch and get my fat ass to slide right by, the torque from a V-8 is such a beautiful thing...SRY rice guys, i just love the sound and raw stock power out of my 4.6So there I was... Making friends and playing nice since 1983 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #89 December 28, 2005 If you're going to compare street racing to skydiving, at least make it accurate. Street racing on the highway is the skydiving equivalent of swooping the main landing area with the canopy traffic from an 80-way in the air at the same time. It's stupid, and you're putting others lives at risk for a cheap thrill and to get attention. QuoteYou might look at me like I am an idiot, but I look at it this way. Well, not just me, but most people look at you like you're an idiot when you race down the road in traffic. Quote Either you get it or you don’t. Yep, and obviously you don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #90 December 28, 2005 QuoteYou might look at me like I am an idiot, I don't look at you like an idiot. I never have. It's not a word I would use to describe you or even most street racers. QuoteWhy do we skydive? I mean what if you have a double mal and fall threw someone’s roof and kill their baby? The odds of that happening are exceedingly low. 99 percent of the time, mistakes in skydiving kill the user, and not someone else. The same is not true in street racing. You guys often take someone out with you, be it a pedestrian, another motorist, or a passenger. Heck, you guys often take someone out and come through relatively unscathed. Is there a chance that you'll double mal and plunge through someone's roof and kill a sleeping baby while skydiving? Sure there is, much like there is a chance that I'm not actually who I say I am, but an undercover agent seeking out street racers to put in the can. Yeah, the chance is there, isn't it? But it's not probable or likely. The probability of killing someone besides you in street racing, on the other hand, is pretty in-you-face apparent. That's a big difference, isn't it? QuoteWhy do we BASE jump? Why would you not just skydive at least it is safer right you have two canopies at least. Because it's a risk you'll accept, and you'll likely not take out anyone else doing it. I've got no problem with that. QuoteWhy do people swoop? I mean why would you do a 270 or some even do 720s to build up speed when you could land under a big safe canopy? I mean what if you run in to a student on your hook turn and kill him? Because swooping is fun. And if you end up hitting somebody else and kill him because you wanted that thrill, many would sound off about the irresponsibility of what you did. But still, there's a difference there in that skydivers know to keep their heads on a swivel and clear their airspace. In fact, there are nice swoop ponds and expert landing areas for swoopers to land in. Swoopers are set aside from the rest of the canopy pilots because of the clear cognizance of the risks involved with swooping in a regular landing area. You made my point there quite nicely. Some 50 jump chump strays into a swoop area? Well, he was a promising freeflier, and a swell guy, but the dumb ass should've been more careful, and he just took out a great swooper. Now, let's say the swooper says, "Regular swooping is boring. Swoop pond is a straight line. Boring for me. Swooping a course is a joke. I think the most skilled swoopers are the ones that swoop the student and main landing areas. Yes, we have some swoopers who don't belong on a Manta, but it takes more skill to react to situations you don't know then to swoop a pond. It makes it more fun that you can get grounded." Sure, there's that fun and excitement of trying to avoid all of those students in the landing area. Hell, even those folks doing accuracy for their pro ratings come in at weird angles and it'd be fun avoiding that, as well as those sudden S turns to bleed off altitude. A REAL ace would swoop the main landing area at a big-way camp. There would be over 40, 80 canopies to avoid there. "THat was sweet! The thrill of just making it through that was awesome, dude. And that girl who panic turned herself into the ground to avoid me should had enough skill to know flat turns." QuoteEither you get it or you don’t. I get the thrill part. I don't get the reckless risk to others part. Some just don't get it... My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lawrocket 3 #91 December 28, 2005 QuoteStreet racing on the highway is the skydiving equivalent of swooping the main landing area with the canopy traffic from an 80-way in the air at the same time. It's nice to know someone else also saw that example. My wife is hotter than your wife. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scoop 0 #92 December 28, 2005 I found an article that might interest you. I was invited to work that shift but declined and would have been in crew with these guys. For some unknown reason I decided I didnt want to work that night (Im a volunteer and both the officers are friends of mine and full time officers.) The driver in this instance is one of the areas finest response drivers and unfortunately, as this proves, SHIT HAPPENS. You can be as cool calm and highly trained as you want but as in this instance things do go wrong. I dont want to go into any detail as it would all be speculation. Its still under investigation but it appears the woman pulled out in front of the police vehicle. Upon impact her car ripped iinto three pieces and she was killed instantly. Through some amazing good fortune and possibly to do with the stab vests spreading the loads of the seatbelts across there bodies the offciers got out with minor injuries and went home that night. The worst thing about it was realising what had happened and that they would be investigated to see if any criminal charges should be raised I think you should take a moment to read this before you go and ruin an innocent life. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/kent/4368962.stm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bigwallmaster 0 #93 December 28, 2005 Yeah. . . . I'll run my Pantera (dyno'd at 570 hp) against that shit any day. I guess I should note that the car weighs nothing; about 1300 lbs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hexadecimal 0 #94 December 28, 2005 QuoteYeah. . . . I'll run my Pantera (dyno'd at 570 hp) against that shit any day. I guess I should note that the car weighs nothing; about 1300 lbs. What did you do, remove the engine? Last I checked, the Pantera weighed closer to 3,000lbs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
twofast 0 #95 December 29, 2005 QuoteI guess I should note that the car weighs nothing; about 1300 lbs. roflmao. maybe 1,300 [B]KILOGRAMS[/B] Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Casurf1978 0 #96 December 29, 2005 Quote The answer IT’S FUN. A street racer killed a few people in Newport beach a few weeks ago. Hit a car at over 100mph, I'm sure the parents of the dead kids would agree with you that it's a lot of fun. A few years ago one of my friends was killed by a street racer on the 405 late at night. Little fucker clipped my friend's car and he rolled it. Bastard is still alive. Personally I would like to put a bullet in him. Raceing is fine and all, but not on public streets. You want to go 100+mph, go ahead, but dont endanger innocent people while doing it. You make some pretty intresting comparison to skydiving and base jumping, but come on. Those are pretty far fetched. I do like the comparison of swooping the main landing area when 80+ people are preparing to land. That pretty much sums up street raceing on public streets. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
StearmanR985 0 #97 December 30, 2005 Not a reply to you specifically Casurf just the thread. It seems this thread sure took a turn from what I thought was intended by the original poster. I suppose it was inevitable but now that all the "Nay Sayers" and "Holier than Thou" people have come out, perhaps this belongs in that political forum (the one a very rarely visit) I enjoy banging gears once in awhile, and yes, on the STREET. Though my version is a bit more casual than most as I use my judgment when giving a little run. In other words, I run when I feel it is safe enough for me to do so and I run for fun. I have been doing it for just over twenty years and it's still a kick in the pants. A few weeks ago, a 4.6L GT Mustang came up beside me and...... Nevermind, the story will probably get lost in all the bickering.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
twofast 0 #98 December 30, 2005 QuoteA few weeks ago, a 4.6L GT Mustang came up beside me and...... lol, i don't think you need to bother typing the outcome. care to share any specs? i love gn's/t-types. although i'm partial to turbos in general. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
justinb138 0 #99 December 30, 2005 Quote I suppose it was inevitable but now that all the "Nay Sayers" and "Holier than Thou" people have come out, perhaps this belongs in that political forum (the one a very rarely visit) Are you referring to the people that have enough respect for the lives of other people to not race each other down the highway in traffic? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Darius11 12 #100 December 30, 2005 Fuck what people say dude. Type your story and ignore them. There are always people who act like there perfect in their PC world, and there are always people who are ready to judge they all need a long mirror. Then there is always people that will just say what they think others want to heir so that they will be more liked. FUCK THEM DUDE. I would love to heir about the ass whopping.I'd rather be hated for who I am, than loved for who I am not." - Kurt Cobain Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
