gus 1 #1 March 22, 2004 Just got my new Wings yesterday but couldn't immediately see how to store the excess brake line. For the moment I've put a bungee on the guide ring but I was expecting a bit of tape/elastic on each riser to stow the excess. GusOutpatientsOnline.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fudd 0 #2 March 22, 2004 So far I just put the excess up together with the bottom tuck in the lower elastics. I think I might ask a rigger to sew on some elastics to tuck away the excess at the back of the riser. After gettin excess brake line around my fingers a few times I learned to look before I grab. That There are only 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #3 March 22, 2004 Before you push the top break horn through its keeper hook the loop of excess break line over the top of it. Then hook the two loops of excess break line created by this move under the bottom horn before pushing that through its keeper. Your break line will then be neatly s-folded along the side of the break and kept tight and away from any snag risk. I think there’s a pdf on the sunpath website showing a very similar method, but it should be good for any Velcro-less toggle set up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
masher 1 #4 March 22, 2004 Why don't you contact Wings and ask them? Shouldn't that sort of thing be in the manual? If it isn't, I'd be getting them to put something on for free...-- Arching is overrated - Marlies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gus 1 #5 March 22, 2004 Thanks Matt, I'll try that tonight. QuoteWhy don't you contact Wings and ask them? I will but I have them working on something more important at the moment. QuoteShouldn't that sort of thing be in the manual? Yes! But how to store excess brake line is not explicitly mentioned in the manual I have. GusOutpatientsOnline.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #6 March 22, 2004 Gus I store my excess line looped into the bottom elastic that also holds the toggle keeper. it has worked for me for year and a half now. with no issues. this is also SunPaths way for risers that dont have the extra bit of elastic on it. I also have the big Vectran line too and it works fine. Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
pkasdorf 0 #7 March 22, 2004 Re: [gus] Wings owners: where do you stow your excess brake line? - NEW [In reply to] Quote | Reply -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Before you push the top break horn through its keeper hook the loop of excess break line over the top of it. Then hook the two loops of excess break line created by this move under the bottom horn before pushing that through its keeper. Your break line will then be neatly s-folded along the side of the break and kept tight and away from any snag risk. I think there’s a pdf on the sunpath website showing a very similar method, but it should be good for any Velcro-less toggle set up. www.SkydiveUWE.co.uk ****************************************** That's what I do. If the manufacturer ever tells you about a better way, let me know. HISPA # 18 POPS # 8757 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skygod7777 0 #8 March 22, 2004 i don't stow mine, i just let it flop in the wind. i just make sure i look before i pop my brakes to make sure my hand isn't caught in the brake line or anything, i've been doing that for about 700 jumps, and i haven't had a problem yet later Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nutz 0 #9 March 22, 2004 QuoteI think there’s a pdf on the sunpath website showing a very similar method, but it should be good for any Velcro-less toggle set up. My Sunpath velcro-less risers have a seperate elastic loop to store the excess in. "Don't! Get! Eliminated!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #10 March 22, 2004 QuoteBefore you push the top break horn through its keeper hook the loop of excess break line over the top of it. Then hook the two loops of excess break line created by this move under the bottom horn before pushing that through its keeper. Your break line will then be neatly s-folded along the side of the break and kept tight and away from any snag risk. I've seen this method your describing cause a knot if the toggle is pulled through the loop. it can happen stowing this way. there are two seperate ways shown on the sunpath site. I am not a big fan of this one. Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #11 March 22, 2004 ooo - educate me as to this possible mal. What happens where now? I'm not sure what you mean by "if the toggle is pulled through the loop". Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billbooth 10 #12 March 22, 2004 Improper (or not) stowing excess brake line on "Velcro-less" toggles was implicated in 3 fatalities last year, as well as many, many breakaways. It is a very important subject. It is inconceivable that a manufacturer would put out a toggle system without any provision for excess brake line stowage. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #13 March 22, 2004 Exactly, I hate it when people don't stow their line or stow it badly. The way I described is one of the "proper" ways to stow the excess. I can't see how doing it that way can cause a mal - all possible problems appear to be accounted for, but of course that does not mean it can't happen. If skymedic or anyone else knows of a way that the described method can cause a problem could they say how so I can amend the way I stow the line. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jmfreefly 0 #14 March 22, 2004 Quoteooo - educate me as to this possible mal. What happens where now? I'm not sure what you mean by "if the toggle is pulled through the loop". I am with you. It is pretty inconceivable that this mal is possible that way -- maybe I am just missing how. I have, on the other hand, seen several pics of mals that are due to freefloating excess looping over the toggle, and as the toggle is released, it ties a knot. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_flat;post=470530;page=1;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;mh=25; EDITED TO ADD: --- Direct to pics: http://www.skyger.de/article.php?sid=159 --- I stow my excess that way, and there are only 3 downsides that I see: 1) it makes a funny wear point on my lines where the lines go around tip of the toggle tab 2) the keeper elastic gets stretched a bit funny (and if you have someone else pack the rig and they don't do that, you have a higher chance of a break being dislodged. But, I almost always stow my own toggles for a packer) 3) it makes that a 'thicker mess' to try to pull the slider over, if you pull the slider down past the toggles. j Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skymedic 0 #15 March 23, 2004 pulling through the loop was how I tied a not in my main stowing it that way. it slipped over the toggle during packing or during deployment..not sure which. but I stowed it the proper way and just pulled the toggle wrong and ended up with a knot. maybe I am not describing it well...wish I had a digi cam to describe it better. sorry. Marc otherwise known as Mr.Fallinwoman.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #16 March 23, 2004 Ah - now I know the mal you're talking about. That cannot happen the way I stow the breaks as there is absolutly no excess flapping round. The way I do it, the break line is held down in a very similar orientation to how it is on my old rig with a velcro keeper. After I loop the excess over the top horn (not pushing the line into the elastic keeper - just hooking it round the horn and pulling it to the side) I repeat the process with the bottom horn. This way I half the length of the excess by looping it over the top horn, then secure the folded line tight against the riser by looping it under the bottom horn. I hope thats description makes it a little clearer. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jmfreefly 0 #17 March 23, 2004 ack.. misread how you do it. I use the bottom tab, and follow it around. It is ultra secure, and can't exhibit the mal described, unless somehow the excess works itself out and around the toggle keeper -- which is near impossible in my view. Attached is a drawing.. albeit poor drawing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #18 March 23, 2004 I don't see a mall from that but I have heard people suggest it may cause excessive wear on the break line. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hkf 0 #19 March 24, 2004 I have a wings, and have just checked the manual, I could not see anything there about stowing the excess. I put the top horn in first, then double the excess over and push it through the bottom elastic, and then hold it in place from below whilst inserting the bottom horn to keep it nice and tight. It may be a bit fiddly the first few times, but the lines seem to get a memory for it and it becomes easier. I can believe it may wear the brake lines a bit quicker, but these are easy to replace, and should be inspected regularly anyway. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jmfreefly 0 #20 March 24, 2004 Yeah, that was #1 on my earlier post. I am sure it probably does make it wear a bit quicker, but it is much cleaner. A mitigating factor to this downside is that you always look at it when you pack, so you should be able to easily track its wear. Although my lines are HMA and Vectran on my canopies, so they don't show wear as well.. j Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflajankie 0 #21 March 24, 2004 QuoteJust got my new Wings yesterday but couldn't immediately see how to store the excess brake line. For the moment I've put a bungee on the guide ring but I was expecting a bit of tape/elastic on each riser to stow the excess. Gus Hi there, Here is a few of pictures of how you can stow the excess line. on Wings risers.Skydivers are a bunch of insensitive jerks... And that's why I don't skydive anymore! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gus 1 #22 March 24, 2004 Thanks Ankie GusOutpatientsOnline.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites