do i have to skydive before i base jump?

[TomAiello 25]

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... I just wanted to know how you came to this conclusion,without really knowing any #'s.(Unless you do have #'s)

I surveyed a sample of jumpers, and their logbooks. My samples aren't really large enough to be super convincing, but of the ones I've been able to catalog, it's actually more like 75% coming back legal. I think the big thing that people overlook is that folks will make 10 jumps in a day off legal stuff, but only 1 or 2 off of illegal sites.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[NickDG 23]

Hey, be careful you guys. I think we are fast approaching the day when BASE jumpers split off into two camps. The legal and the illegal. I am going to be careful with the following as I've already been accused by someone who misunderstood me (and BASE in general) that the reason we jumped in the first place was the illegality of it all.

BASE jumping is where it is today because the first generation said "Fuck You" to those who said BASE jumping was a bad thing and we shouldn't do it. Our freedom to BASE jump is rooted in illegal jumps and illegal jumps will always be your refuge.

Take a look overseas. BASE jumpers there are quickly backing themselves into coffin corners. We are starting to see legal sites being jumped in illegal fashion, i.e. don’t jump during certain hours, don’t jump when there's tourists about, be careful when you jump as the locals don’t like the helicopter noise when it comes to rescue you. This is wrong on so many levels.

Stop thinking about yourselves and start thinking about sport. We, as human beings, have an unconditional right to jump. Sure, it's okay to work with locals, but when they start dictating when and where you can jump that's too much, and it's dangerous. Too many already get hurt and killed when they jump in the available conditions rather than the best conditions.

The people who bend over backwards (call them the collaborators) to make sure their nice little scene stays intact are the ones making it harder for future jumpers. Our ability to BASE jump is a war against people who don't want us to BASE jump. Appeasement will only prolong the battle . . .

NickD BASE 194

[BASE813 0]

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it's actually more like 75% coming back legal

I guess then this depends on who and where you are. I would say I could sample a large amount of log books of people I know and I would hazard a guess that the legal jumps are in the low 10-20% region rather than the 75% you quote....

[JaapSuter 0]

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Our freedom to BASE jump is rooted in illegal jumps and illegal jumps will always be your refuge.

We are starting to see legal sites being jumped in illegal fashion, i.e. don’t jump during certain hours, don’t jump when there's tourists about, be careful when you jump as the locals don’t like the helicopter noise when it comes to rescue you. This is wrong on so many levels.

The one big difference between now and twenty years ago is the number of base-jumpers. If only three jumpers land in your corn-field every year, you won't care much considering it's only them crazy 'stunt-people' anyway. On the other hand, if every weekend you get twenty people landing in and trampling your grass, the stunt image is quickly replaced with a regular sport image. This obviously changes the way locals will accomodate you.

I love sticking it to the man as much as you, but we're all sharing the same planet, jumper and non-jumpers. When we land on high grass, we ruin it. Grass is a sought-after commodity in Switzerland, because so few fields are flat enough to mow. When we recklesly cut trees at an exit-point, we are breaking things that were there long before us. When we bounce in front of a local audience, we temporarily traumatize at least a few people.

If one can jump illegally without breaking and harming anything, go for it! But as the number of jumpers grows there will have to be regulation to minimize the impact.

Let's just hope we never need a governing body. It is in our best interest to keep these simple local requests a local affair. In my opinion, it's when we stop respecting the simple requests that we set ourselves up for bigger trouble and goverment regulation.

Jaap "I hope I didn't misunderstand you Nick" Suter

[manship 0]

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I surveyed a sample of jumpers, and their logbooks. My samples aren't really large enough to be super convincing, but of the ones I've been able to catalog, it's actually more like 75% coming back legal. I think the big thing that people overlook is that folks will make 10 jumps in a day off legal stuff, but only 1 or 2 off of illegal sites.

Hmmmm., well, perhaps there are other ways to look at this. For sure, if you look at my logbook, you can say your perception is true, by looking at each jump. BUT, if you look at each object, then the situation reverses, with Illegal being about 90%%. Or you can look at Winter Versus Summer. Summer will be about 98% legal and Winter about 98% illegal. Or by category, B will be 100% illegal, A will be 100% illegal, S will be about 99% legal, E will be about 99% legal.

So, kind of depends on what you want to mean by "most" I guess.

==========================================

I didn't invent skydiving, but I jumped with the guys who did.

[TomAiello 25]

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So, kind of depends on what you want to mean by "most" I guess.

I had just meant by total number of jumps.

If you are talking about total number of objects jumped, or what each jumpers majority of jumps are, or anything else, then there are going to be different things you observe.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[NickDG 23]

Hi Jaap,

Yes, re-reading my post it was a bit harsh . . . sorry. And you made some good points.

I'm just always thinking of my friend Jeff who I think was worrying more about getting caught than he was about his performance when he was killed in Yosemite.

And I think about Frank being chased down like a dog until he drowned.

And I think of all the rest who paid fines and served time.

And I get frustrated . . .

NickD
BASE 194

[JaapSuter 0]

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And I think of all the rest, and I get frustrated . . .

Yeah, it sucks.

But I guess they would much rather see us use our middle-finger on the existing illegal sites than risking tolerance at currently legal sites.

I only know a tiny fraction of base history, but I think Jan, Jeff, Frank and Dennis would prefer to see us jump their Cap legally rather than see another hundred years of clandestine risk-taking. Correct me if I'm wrong.

If and when that happens, regulations will come from a grey area. Some will be happy, others will be pissed off. Unfortunately I don't think concessions will be entirely avoidable. It is up to the base community to make sure regulation is put on solid ground and not on a slippery slope straight into the arms of an FAA regulated base association.

[cesslon 0]

has any1 actually answered the guy who started this thread ?

I'll answer it for him
to the person who wanted to know "do i have to skydive before i base jump?"
No you dont, but yes you should.
doing your first BASE jump isnt that hard (the falling part), living to make your second jump would be.

if you want to do BASE cos you think you'll like it, odd's are skydiving would be enough for now, take up skydiving get some experience, read Tom's article its
http://miller28.server101.com/discus/articles/tomagettinginto.html
and read Dwains
http://miller28.server101.com/discus/articles/gettinginto.html

and like everything in life, always get more then 1 oppinion.

and search this forum for a story recently about the d00d who had no experience, bought his BASE gear then free fell a 100 foot bridge

[BASE813 0]

[QUOTE]and search this forum for a story recently about the d00d who had no experience, bought his BASE gear then free fell a 100 foot bridge[/QUOTE]

or number 47 on "The List"

[BASE813 0]

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I had just meant by total number of jumps.

I still stand by the fact that most people I know (personally) certainly have a much lower percentage of legal v illegal jumps than you state................

I guess (again) this has more to do with where you are from and what sort of jumper you are?

perhaps I am wrong..............

[NickDG 23]

>>i have never skydived but i was told that i need to take a skydive class before i can base jump<<

http://www.basefatalities.info/

NickD
BASE 194

[gus 1]

I am running at about 15% 'not illegal' jumps. I would guess that's fairly representative of my jumping friends.

Gus

OutpatientsOnline.com

[Sean621 0]

Do 500 jumps with a lot on a 7 cell canopy (more than 200 square feet)...read the articles....then read this [url]http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_flat;post=1512703;page=6;sb=post_latest_reply;so=ASC;mh=25;

then meet some jumpers...then buy a lot of beer..then go see and help out on some jumps...then make a will then if you are still up for it go get on a course...oh yeah then stay alive.

http://www.extreme-on-demand.com

[BASE813 0]

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Do 500 jumps alot on 7 cell

I always think this is a much better guide then the 150 banded about............

[Faber 0]

i run a 1% of legal jumps i got both in easter this year after 3 years in the sport...
i like it that way...

Stay safe
Stefan Faber