JJohnson

I did say "if you find yourself unstable". I would not classify unstable as being presented properly to the relative wind. I stand by my statement. There is a time and place for wrapping the student to prevent a side spin and getting out of one. Prevention is a lot better than cure. Yes you want to exit perfectly. But if you think that is going to happen everytime....lots of luck. I'll use me as an example. At 5 foot 4" it doesnt take much for a student to be bigger than me. Hell the average circus midget can take me in a one on one basketball game. So I take a 6 foot 4" student who is the tall lanky type. With a wingspan that dwarfs mine, all he has to do is throw his legs or arms out to one side and he can roll us over. Laws of physics cannot be changed: He has first dibs on the relative wind and he can displace more air than I can. So now all of the sudden we find ourselves with a potential side spin scenario. It was caused by the exact position you said couldn't. Do I wait to see if it develops? Or do I quickly go with it, roll us over and arch out of it? I'm going with path of least resistance. I'm not trying to start shit with you, but sometimes I can't dictate the exit. When that happens and I think the potential for a side spin is there....it takes nothing to roll it on the back and to the belly. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

The side spin starts because of the instructor being arched and the student being opposite. If you find yourself unstable, wrapping them or molding to their body shape prevents or stops the side spin. Once you roll to your back it is easy to then flip the pair of you over to belly to earth. This is right out of Strong's video tape. Do not confuse this with trying to wrestle the student out the door to try and get them arched... JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

As a very wise man told me, winning the battle with students is done on the ground. Anything in the air is reactionary to the situation. If you can relax the student and prepare them for what they are going to go through, they are more likely to do what you instructed them to do. In my limted experience women do a better job at listening then men students. Something about men's need to control everything and when they cannot they go rigid at the door in that "fight" mode. Any exit I had that went wrong....(not having belly to relative wind)...was dealt with by wrapping myself around the student, making us go back to earth. Then arching it out to go belly to earth and getting the drouge out. This is only a general statement and doesnt cover everything....but I have had some really scared students....and they have all done a great job once I put them at ease. The worst ride to date was a heavy girl who was convinced she could swim to the video guy. 8000 feet of bucking bronco. The video guy was laughing so hard he couldn't operate his bite switch. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Exactly what Dave said...and I jump a Cobalt as well and I can assure you that once I level out my risers the spinning dive stops immediatly and the line twists come out fast. They came out so fast once that it actually spun me the other way into one line twist. As soon as I even out the risers, the canopy planes out instantly. I'm jumping a 120 at about a 1.55 to 1 loading. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

What did you do? Route a cable through the three ring? What system? Please explain. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Rock told you that? I swear I said it to you. Damn there goes another chance to claim some decent advice. Maybe I told Rock.... JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

I ride with no helmet for a few reasons. I don't wear full leathers either. Sometimes just boots, jeans and a t-shirt. Depends on the weather. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

1) Get real! Getting paid to skydive is like getting paid to have sex! Does it get any better? Let me sum this up.....I was gonna jump outta the plane anyway...so you are saying that if I strap this stranger to me....and get to work on nailing perfect exits in a variety of circumstances....get to geek a camera.....get to teach a newbie about playing in my world....get to watch someone have airgasms and have them thank me for it...get to spiral a canopy until someone else pukes....work on a whole new way of landing.....a side effect is I get to hang out at the DZ and wait for people to show up and not have to mow my lawn.....PLUS you are going to pay me for it? I have the best job above Earth. The day it isn't fun is the day I quit doing it. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Ouch. That was bad. Almost as bad as getting a viagra pill stuck in your throat and having a stiff neck all day. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Bind head-up? Are we tying our feet or hands together...or both? I don't know if I can reach my hackey with my teeth. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Hey man, I was the one who told you to try it....and the person who gave me the suggestion is Gravity Girl....from Byron. Now don't leave the plane blindfolded or anything....and this is a solo jump...but just close them for a few seconds....5 to 10. Feel the wind on the parts of the body you are trying to fly with. It works.... See you this weekend hopefully. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

How about a line from their ankles attached to the harness that we can pull to get their legs up? JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

And thank you for the jump my dear. Funny, when I quit I was a raging idiot. The sun shining too bright pissed my off. Now everyone seems to think I have gotten more mellow. I found I hate smelling tandem studentys that smoke as well. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Just yesterday I had three students in a row that were like jello. They could not get their legs up even a few inches. I spent from 5000 feet to 1000 trying every trick in the book. I am begining to think I am cursed with extremley out of shape people. At 5 foot 4 inches I really cannot use my legs to grab theirs. I have been able to loosen the leg straps, but some people even then cannot get the leg straps down their thighs even a few inches. Is the general public really that poorly conditioned? However I do find that turning our bodies on landing to slide in backwards does a good job as a last resort. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

I have two failed marriages and I thank you for letting me know why. It's been bothering me for years. Damn fags. Glad I quit smoking last year, maybe my third and current marriage will last. Some Brit friends of mine told me that smoking fags will eventually lead to the dreaded "spotted dick" syndrome. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

I was taught the use of RR landings as a student. As it was told to me, if you break a steering line are you going to chop an otherwise good canopy for a chance that your main may malfunction? This led me to start using my RR early on. Using them even on close spots, to get comfortable with the feel. Doing RR turns right on opening, so that if needed I could use them to avoid collisions and not waste time unstowing breaks. Sure as shit within 50 jumps, a pressure knot wouldn't let the right toggle unstow. RR landing no problem. I'm pretty tame on swooping, so I don't use them much for that. But I say be ready to use them for landing from early on. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Thank you all for your input. I should add that this was an off landing in a bean field. The student was a bit "round" and did have her legs up. She relaxed her grip on her legs as we hit the top of the 2 foot tall beans. That was all it took. Since this incident, I am way more demanding on my students getting their legs up. I use pretty much alll the tricks in the book and these do work in 99% of the situations. Again my thanks. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Never be in a hurry to throw the drogue. Speed can be your friend. Trying to out-fly a larger student is much easier when you have airspeed to work with. If you are a smaller person, like me understand that most of your battles with students are won before you ever leave the plane. I have thus far, not had even a nervous student screw me up in the air. Prevention is way better than cure. Expect the exit to go wrong and be prepared to recover from it. If it goes right...BONUS. I love doing tandems and treat each one as the only one. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

I always have them try it up high, so I know what I'm in for. Hard for me to use my feet to grab theirs cause I'm like 5 foot 4 inches with stubs for legs. I'd be starting line up at the midgets basketball team. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

This girl had a jumpsuit on and was holding her legs up. But I watched her relax the grip and lower them as we came in. It was her second tandem as well. She was laying on the ground in pain ansd says: "My parents are going to be so pissed, espicially when I tell them I'm coming back out to finish my student work." Tough girl JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Sadly this weekend I had my first student get injured. She was unable to totally get her legs up and on landing broke her ankle. I feel really badly about the situation and could go the rest of my life without ever hearing those sounds again. I have had more than a few students not be able to get their feet up. One guy couldn't even get his legs to budge and I surfed him in. Some of them I have been able to kick their legs and get them up. Some have managed to grab their pants legs or grippers and pull the upper legs, but still not straighten their feet out in front of them. Some of them can grab the harness over their heads and swing their legs out at landing. Very few students are willing to try and work the leg straps down a few inches so they are in a more seated position. Heck some freak out when you loosen the side straps. Any other great ideas? JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Every day we seem to sell pieces of our freedom and rights away to ensure a little more lazy security. Sad isn't it? JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

Students should always be in a helmet, tandem students in a frap hat. Why? Cause first jump students don't know their way around our enviroment. They are prone to walking into the door bar on the Otter, even on the mock-up. I keep them out of hard hats cause I don't want to be head-butted by one. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

I would be very interested to know just what kind of changes go through our body from the time we arrive at the DZ until the time we land. What the chemical levels are and how they change. I would be willing to bet that nearly everyone experiences elevated levels of adrenaline....unlike taking your car out for a spin....I think we would find that our version of normal is not quite as normal as we think. No matter what our jump numbers, we are more aware of the dangers involved and we run through them in our minds nearly every jump....without ever thinking about them. Unlike going out for a drive. JJ "Call me Darth Balls"

I jump neither canopy but would choose the Sabre2. I had problems with Icarus years ago and won't deal with them anymore. I never had problems with PD. But the key word in this thread is DEMO, DEMO, DEMO.... JJ "Call me Darth Balls"