stoneycase

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4933002 October 2, 2005 · William Gibson Jr., the 76-year-old foreman of the Texas grand jury that indicted Rep. Tom DeLay, says jurors saw abundant evidence. Included were testimony and phone records supporting a conspiracy charge against the Republican leader. listen for yourself....my favorite quote, “It was not a rubber stamp deal. It was not an overnight deal. If we needed extra information, it was provided to us,” Gibson said. care to spin the wheel, and try again? or are you suggesting that laws be amended in regards to grand juries? should mr earle have only had 1 chance, with 1 grand jury, and if that failed, "do not pass go, do not collect $200?"...maybe mr gibson is really just a partisan as well, hell, maybe the whole damn grand jury just hates white people...or maybe, just maybe, there is some merit to the charges that were brought against delay...you know what they say, the shortest distance between 2 points is a straight line, and the easiest explanation is often the most accurate... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

grand jury, anyone, anyone??... sure sure, "prosecutorial discretion" is a bitch. i live in santa barbara, our DA here used millions of tax dollars trying to prosecute Jackson on child molestation (for a second time, same DA tried in the 90's). now that it's re-election time, and that trial was a loss, and that money is spent, people are pissed about how the DA used his discretion - most are saying he had no business trying the case, and all are saying he had no business spending that much $ again...but i digress... if you're going to hold the position that grand juries are useless, and that a DA can just "indict anyone for anything" then, IMHO, you're making a baseless and naieve comment that's real purpose is to insinuate that this whole issue is based solely on "partisan politics". the collective opinion is that if you get indicted by a grand jury, after a prosecutor brings charges against you, than there is a at least a "good chance" that the prosecutor has "tangible evidence" you committed a crime. i seriously doubt mr earle walked into the grand jury and said "i dont like delay, he's a your typical crooked republican" and got the grand jury to return a multiple-count indictment. before you write everyone off for their knee-jerk response, consider the facts: an impartial grand jury returned an indictment against mr delay allowing mr earle to move forward with his prosecution. sure we should all remember "innocent until proven guilty" but i'd like to think that most people hold their elected representatives to a higher standard than the average joe. there is nothing wrong with citizens looking unfavorably upon the man considering the fact that a grand jury returned the indictment against him, and a judge has found at least one of the charges to have "merit". let him have his day in court, but don't wander around with your head in the sand wondering why everyone is distancing themselves or talking smack - they're looking at the facts and the progress thus far. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

is there any shame in high-tailing it the f*** out of there and leaving your g/f behind? lol, did that once. glad I did too, she was a bitch. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

two words: manual labor lots of it i received the hand, the belt, the ass whoppin, the soap, the lectures, the priest (and the confessional time), hell i even received the "we're taking you to the police station". none of these had the impact that manual labor did. seriously, treat the kid like a second rate inmate and send them outside with shitty tools, and an impossible task to accomplish. when they come in whining (as i would) send their ass back out there *without* the shitty tool you gave them in the first place. seriously. my parents would follow this up with "we're training you for your future, based on your actions, you'll be lucky to hammer nails/dig ditches for the rest of your natural life" i think, because my dad was career military, he was a big fan of the manual labor. i can recall many funny stories - him with beer in sun chair, me with push mower (not electric, not gas, PUSH) - him with another beer, in the middle of the night, while i'm drunk as hell and sick, trying to weed the garden (punishment for returning home drunk/late) - i was once sent into the backyard to "dig ditches". i wasn't allowed to return until i was "finished". i spent all day out there. at the end of it all, my reward was to fill the holes back in. i spent the rest of the night doing that, by flashlight (remember shitty tools!) and on and on. you can't whoop his ass like ditch digging or fence painting can ;) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

how about indirectly? through the removal of funds from "scientific and medical research"? i see the point, don't come with your hand out, and then shut your door on us. like i said, i wouldn't want to be rosenkranz, up there trying to argue against that point. so, ok, we won't come with our hand out. now what? whats the actual end result? seems like money is taken away from valuable research...all because the school had an anti-discrimination policy?... edit: you say "federal jobs", as far as i know this is all about the armed services discrimination against openly gay people. does that discrimination exist for "federal employee's"...i don't think so...i think we're talking about folks wearing uniforms carrying weapons here. not to be confused with Suzy Procurement Administrator. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

pretty much what Robert's said during oral: Rosenkranz: "The law schools' message is, they believe it is immoral to abet discrimination." O'Connor: "But they can say that to all" who want to hear that message. Rosenkranz: "But when they say that, students don't believe the message." Roberts: "The reason they don't believe you is because you're willing to take the money. What you're saying is, it's a message we believe in strongly, but not to the tune of a hundred million dollars." I'd have to say it's a damn fine point, I wouldn't want to be Rosenkranz, that's for sure. So the next move there is for the school(s) to put-up and turn down the money. I guess my question is though: if these stats are true(from CNN): Universities receive about $35 billion a year in federal funds, much of it for medical and scientific research. Shouldn't we be asking ourselves, are we OK with a general decrease in the level of scientific and medical research at college campuses... is it OK that because campuses believe in "anti-discrimination/equality/etc" policies and adhere to them by deciding not to accept federal funds, that our future research into the fields of science and medicine is reduced? will this happen? $35bn is quite a bit, though I doubt all schools will stick to their policies and decline, I imagine some will, maybe even some prestigious (ivy league) schools...what amount of money will they forego? how will that affect their physics/math/science departments? what will be the "net net" as a result? Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

the complaint was brought by a law school.... the law school had a policy - no recruiters/representatives/companies that discriminate in their hiring practices - in any shape or form. pretty straight forward - you don't hire black people, you don't show up on campus. you don't hire women, you don't show up on campus. you don't hire jews, you don't show up on campus. and so on and so forth. the military doesn't allow gays. this meets the law school's standards for "discrimination" (some of you may actually think this *isn't* discrimination...). therefore, the law school said, "thanks, but no thanks" to the recruiters. equal application of their policy they thought...obviously SCOTUS begs to differ... IMHO, the law school was in the right. even if they accept federal funds(why not make the arg that the law school must meet federal "standards for education" therefore they *must* accept federal money?). if you discriminate on the basis of nationality, religion, race, sex, or sexuality, then, IMHO you don't belong on a college campus looking for potential employees. take it to the classifieds, like the rest of the strip clubs/escort services ;) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

send me a pm if you still need this...i have office 00/xp/03 open office is fine too... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

Nothing wrong with discussing it right here. There's "decision", and then there's informed decision. In this case, they're worlds apart. If the passenger is an experienced jumper, that's one thing. But a student tandem passenger simply does not yet have the capacity (due to lack of genuine understanding of the added risk) to make an informed decision on that. yeah...i guess that's my only real hang-up as well. i just can't say with a straight face that a passenger understands the risks that well to make the informed decision you're talking about. but still... it's a good looking picture

It beats young, death, dum' and full of unused cum in every aspect, me thinks... haha! i was only, humorously, trying to point out - what's the point of going through life "cautiously" only to arrive at old age and be pissed off? but again, it's all in good fun, i *am* looking forward to my grumpier-than-hell-on-my-porch-yellin-at-snot-nose-kids days. grandpa always makes me smile when he says shit like "boy you must have rocks for brains". i can't wait till it's my turn...."son, it's too bad your ugly, cause and ugly and stupid don't go together well" :) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

please do-tell, why one would want to become "grumpy and old?" j/k ;) i'm actually looking forward to the time when i can yell, "hey you kids! get the hell off my lawn!" but seriously, what i don't understand here, with all the moaning and groaning is the "auto-disown" of the DZ, the TI, and Hanger. lisa goes so far to say she'd pack her shit and leave...what gives? are you all making the point that this one instance would "rule" your opinion of the 3? (dz, ti, hanger) why not pack your shit and leave when you see TI's turning loads and cutting corners with briefing's/gear checks/etc? why not bitch and moan when you see an AFFI instruct 2 newbs (

I've had my Inifinity since late 2003. Initially I put a bunch of jumps on it. Unfortunately my jumping activity slowed for awhile thereafter, but it has picked up in the last 6-8 months. All told, I'd say I've put 120 jumps, maybe more, on my Infinity. Buying this rig as new A-License holder was probably the best decision I've ever made. Let me tell you why: 1 - Service. Ordering was a snap. I went through my DZ, got the measurements from a rigger and put my order in. The cool part was I had used the website earlier to design the color combo. Having that added feature on the website lets you customize till your hearts content. I was so antsy to get the rig I couldn't stand it. I must have called VSE and spoke with Kelly at least a dozen times. He was *never* impatient, always very courteious, and extremely eager to get the rig in my hands. To me, this meant the world. As a newbie, it felt great knowing that the company building my rig was run by such a top notch guy. The rig showed up on time, and exactly as I had specified. 5 stars. 2 - Price. Not much to say on this subject, other than the obvious. As a newbie, I decided a mix of used/new equip would be best to save $. With the pricing on the Infinity I was able to go custom with some options, buy a new Smart reserve, and still have a couple hundred left over for a used main. No AAD. 3 - Packing friendly. I always hear lots of people complain about packing the first few dozen times. I can tell you I did the same, but when I received my Infinity, the complaining stopped. The d-bag fit my Sabre 150 nicely (snug but not impossible). The riser covers are easy to use (easier than Icon or Micron IMHO) when packing. The rig closes up nicely - the order is logical and the packing tray sets up nicely. Routing of the bridle is straight forward, and the BOC pouch + hackey + pilot chute are all great. 4 - Freefly friendly. If you're looking for freefly friendly, the Infinity has you covered. All in all, after some time, and over a hundred jumps, I consider this rig to be the best piece of gear I own. If you decide to buy one as a newbie, I guarantee you'll feel the same.

not to nit-pick, but you should be talking about the "laws of gravity" not the theory of it. but yes, i see your point bill. i wonder why the theory of evolution is always singled out when discussing the issue of theory vs fact and how our schools do such a "disservice" to the students by teaching a theory (evolution) as fact...why not harp on how classical electromagnetism (theory) is still taught in some HS physics classes as fact? (hint, when the kid goes to college they'll learn about QED) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electromagnetism i digress...please continue, this is a good thread worthy of continued reading. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

agreed. everyone's life is different, hell, you could almost make the argument that everyone's "reality" is different (i.e. what they wake up to, how their day goes, etc etc.). therefore, to me, there is no justification in removing *any* aspect of a woman's right to choose. the position is pro-choice, not pro-death. options people, it's all about options. i would think, that given the planet we all reside on, folks would come to the conclusion that life is not b&w. i don't have a daughter atm, but the government, the church, my neighbors, my senator, and my president, have absolutely no business taking away her right to choose because of their own moral dilemma. there was a bumper sticker i used to like that echoed this sentiment, it looked similar to this: Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

How about, "positive criticism please, rather than negativity grounded in ignorance." Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

see my above posts: if you want to change the bd/bath stats because they are inaccurate, you can. my guess is that will probably close some of the gap on your estimate. spence - sounds good, or let it die. i dont care either way at this point. next time i'll just keep **** to myself, for fear that i post something that isn't "100% perfect" Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

So, given our "7 samples" we can say with what level of certainty that the entire site is inaccurate? If your statement is a fair indicator of your level of understanding of statistics...IMO, the level is a tad low... But that's fine, if the data is unreliable to you than so be it. You can go on waiting for the perfect site to open with absolutely perfect numbers. In the meantime, myself and others, will take the estimates and use our god-given-intellect to reach some conclusions we would not have otherwise been able to reach easily. Don't worry though, I won't run out and get a loan based on the value I see presented, which you seem to think will be the case... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

I disagree. I'd say I have the ability to understand margin for error, while you do not. You seem to think the site should be right on, well below +/-10%. To me that's ridiculous, given the site is free and the amount of information is quite substantial(not to mention the fact that they are using assessor's office info in their calculations, how correct is that info for everyone??). You can point and argue all you want about how your value is off, but you and I both know, that your sample size of 1 value is no kind of indicator of the overall accuracy of the site. I also know that any user of this site has the ability to change and update the zestimate based on any "unique" information they have regarding their home (renovations, remodels, extensions, etc). Where else can you see how adding a BD to your 3/2 will affect the overall home value? Nvm, I'm sure you're answer will be: It doesn't matter, the values are all wrong. Ironically, I probably feel like you do in the same-sex marriage thread: I'm running my head against a brick wall that's hell bent on not listening, no matter the information I put forward. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

Ugh, well obviously that's not good. But to make the comparison that you are "shorting" yourself out of money by looking at the estimate is ridiculous. It's a freaking estimate. e-s-t-i-m-a-t-e. You seem to be implying that everyone will look at this and offer/buy for the value or sell/transfer on the penny, and/or use it to request a loan. Give me a break...Also in their defense they are displaying this potential error to you. They aren't hiding it. Take issue with the number fine, but to outright dismiss the site because YOUR estimate is low/high is making the assumption that all 60M home estimates will be wrong because of 1 (or a few, read: statistically insignificant) value. Your comment that they are displaying "nearly random numbers" is patently false. To me, it shows that you really haven't spent any time reading what I've wrote, or any of the additional information contained at the site. Which is fine, you don't have to. Your opinion is your opinion. Of course I tend to listen to, and be persuaded by opinions grounded in fact and large amounts of evidence. Not so much for the reverse. No, I do not work for them. Never have. Don't even know the owners. Nice try though! It's too bad that you want perfect for free. Guess you'll get to keep waiting... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

your idea of incorrect and unreliable are not the same as mine. no sense debating the point with you. but if i can trouble you to read a bit further, i'd like to show you that the site owners understand the inherent problems of what they're doing, and imho, they're doing a rather decent job of publicizing potential problems and providing plenty of info about how to overcome them or at least identify them factor them in... My Zestimate is too low — or too high. What gives? The Zestimate is really a starting point in figuring out the true value of a house. A variety of things can affect the accuracy of the Zestimate. For example, the number of transactions in a geographic area affects how much we know about prevailing market values of homes there. The more transactions, the more data and the more accurate the Zestimate will be. Also, we use public data for house attributes, and some areas report more data than others. The more attributes we know about homes in an area (including yours), the better the Zestimate. To correct for this, we offer a tool called My Zestimator™ that allows you to adjust the Zestimate according to specifics about a home. and here is where they provide a table that shows how well the "data coverage" is for each area (and therefore you can determine how accurate the zestimate will likely be, hint more stars = more accurate) coverage: http://www.zillow.com/howto/DataCoverageZestimateAccuracy.z out of curiousity, how many stars on the area you are looking at? (lets leave median error out for a moment) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

7-8% off...the site readily advertises they are +/-10% and the values are NOT appraisals. you all let me know when you find that perfect information/website out there... i honestly can't believe you all are bashing the hell out of this, but go figure...i should've put a HUGE disclaimer with the words directly from their FAQ. i didn't realize that everyone would type in an address and think the value displayed was 100% accurate within 1/10th of a cent...sheesh. but tell me, how quickly can YOU see the "approximate value" of ALL the homes in your NEIGHBORHOOD without a site like this? half an hour for a trip to the assessor's office? an hour? a week while you wait for a report back from the realtor? seems to me like you can give zillow their 10%, and maybe even then some, considering the amount of information they are providing, your ability to customize that information, and the speed at which it is being provided to you. JMHO. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

ok, i see most of what i wrote has fallen on deaf ears. thanks for looking though fellas. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

I know the FAQ requires more reading, so here's a cut/paste for you: It's true, we've never been to your house, never seen your expertise with colors and landscaping. Only you know those things. So we've given you a way to consider them in calculating a home's value. Use the "Value Any Home" search, then when you find a home, click on "Refine value of this home." The My Zestimator tool will walk you through the steps to adjust your valuation. ... We get this information from the tax assessor in your county so their records may not be up-to-date. To change the details about a home, or the tax value or assessment figure, you'll need to contact your county assessor's office. But not to worry — in the meantime, you can use the My Zestimator tool to calculate your home value with the correct information. BD/BA, Sq footage can all be changed using their tool. If you'd used Zillow correctly, you could've adjusted the displayed estimate. Within 1%, that's pretty damn close... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

Well of course the property value and ownership is public info (assessors's office), but honestly, how easily is that information accessed? Probably not as easy for everyone as it may be for you with the kiosk. Also, if you look more at their FAQ, and specifically how the estimate is created you'll see that they are actually taking into account a lot *more* than just the home's "value" when they calculate the "zestimate". I'm not trying to say their math/stats are superior, I'm just saying their estimate takes into account additional variables:(from their site) "When our statisticians developed the model to determine home values, they explored how homes in certain areas were similar (i.e., number of bedrooms and baths, and a myriad of other details) and then looked at the relationships between actual sale prices and those home details. These relationships form a pattern, and they used that pattern to develop a model to come up with a market value for a home." I'd have to disagree with you on the local realtor. Personally, I've always looked at the realtors (even my friends) as sales people first. Their "information" is actually just marketing, IMO. Of course they have access to info the general public may not have immediately (the sewage plant is a good example, or say school constructions) but overall, their use of the information is primarily focused on making transactions, not on providing unbiased information to consumers. BTW, I think your question is pretty much answered in their FAQ. The snippit I posted kinda sums it up: the zestimate is == assessor's office. The townships you speak of would probably see relatively accurate value's displayed (+/- 10%)

If any of you are like me, you're focused on purchasing/owning a home in the next few years. As a result, I'm always looking out and listening for new information, new tools, etc. A coworker of mine showed me this site: www.zillow.com It's rather interesting, and looks to be something entirely unique. It's basically a "free valuation" tool that lets you type in an address and bring up the residence on google maps. Already been done before, right? Wrong. It slaps an estimate on the address you provided and displays *all* the estimates for the homes in the surronding area. Pretty crazy, if you ask me. I can type in almost any address and get a good idea of the home's value, and the value of the houses in the surrounding area(s). Not something easily accomplished say, 5 to 7 years ago. Of course it has it's limits, and it's worthwhile to spend some time reading their FAQ to understand how estimates are calculated: http://www.zillow.com/howto/Zestimate.z So what do you all think? Have you ever seen any tool like this available for free? Any of you in the industry? I know you have tools like this, what are your thoughts on making this information widely available to the public? As a consumer, I'm all for it. The more information I can have, the better. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell