stoneycase

Just wanted to thank everyone for chiming in. I'm normally the last person to start a thread, on anything, let alone a personal situation. So I certainly appreciate the serious (and fun) responses. Thanks. Since posting this, and reading the responses I've done the following: 1 - Called the landlady, left a VM: "So sorry" 2 minutes of apologizing "Jane bounced a check to me" 2 more minutes of apologizing "If possible can u wait 1-2 business days for her cash deposit to clear" "If not, again I'm very sorry and I'd like to make sure all fines and fees are paid accordingly by Jane" "You know this is not the way I like to operate, I hope this doesn't adversely affect your view of myself or Arthur, we very much enjoy our current living arrangement, though we are frustrated with Jane." 2 - Formulated a plan for tonight The plan: 1 - get beer 2 - get calm 3 - talk to jane: apologize for profanity. not apologize for overall anger/position. ask for cash/cashiers check for next month. tell her i've contacted irma. again re-emphasize that this looks really bad on her part and the lease renewal is coming up (basically spell it out that i will not be looking for her to renew) and if it all fails, then notify her she will be receiving a notice via certified mail from me (thanks lawrocket, you're talking to a guy who was once pre-law, so i appreciate the point in the right direction)

You rule. I knew that CA has tough "check bounce" laws/regs but I wasn't fully aware I could collect on my own, above and beyond the actual fees I incurr. If this goes south tonight, which it may, your letter will be in the mail first thing tomorrow AM. Haha, $25, that's a jump ticket. So there is a silver-lining to this story...

Man, you must be on the same brain wave I'm riding at the moment. Your 4 pointer basically sums up the reasons why my fuse was lit, and the blood was boiling: 1 - seriously folks, as corny as it sounds, my word is my bond when it comes to money. even my good friends know this. if i say i'm going to pay someone back, or i'm going to do something involving $, i do it, and i do it on time. 2 - yup, a pattern of not caring. the response to the cox bounce was something along the lines of "so is that a problem?" 3 - EXACTLY. you can be late/not go to class to take care of this. there are 2 other people invovled for christ sake. the world does not revolve around you... 4 - This probably frustrated me the most and sent me into the big tailspin. Telling me right from the get-go that "I thought this might happen" and having hte check bounce YESTERDAY (again I was unaware until this afternoon)...If she would have come to me and said, "I think the check might bounce" I would have kicked into overdrive and put a solution into place right then - transferring funds from my own alt accts or whatever. By coming to me up front she would've shown some spine, some character, and personal responsibility. Telling me after the fact she knew it was a problem, and then telling me I'm over-reacting or being rude...well I come from a military family, I don't hold anger in - it comes out in typical military fashion - at loud volume with *extreme* emphasis, often using long strings of profanity. ;)

jesus christae man. that's what i calling leaving you in the lurch...well it puts it in perspective for me. at least i've got a rich bitch willing to go get cash and put it into my bank acct on the same day (after she gets out of class, of course...) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

ah the sexual favors response...i knew that was coming :) hell, i'd probably even suggest it myself, if one of you were posting this as an issue... but, alas, i do not think i would have been quite as witty and come up with the "if she's gonna fuck you, it might as well be in a good way." that may be a new sig... the spanking, also an excellent idea!! + pics/video, i could make a website...(j/k i don't dip the pen in the corporate ink, and i dont turn my life into an epside of the Real World, at least not anymore) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

Now this I can definitely sign-on to. I like. That was my whole point for getting angry on the phone: make this into a HUGE issue, make it a pain in the ass, make her *feel* my pain over the problem. Cash or Cashier's check, that's the way the process is going to work from now on. I also like the employer/employee analogy. I think it goes well here. I think I will apologize, slightly, for using the profanity - but I agree, I won't feel sorry for being agitated or angry. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

;) Well I'll certainly admit I've bounced a util check before (only once), but I've never bounced a rent check... But you're story, at least to me, seems far different: 1 - you were out of town, my problem wasn't 2 - you apologized, i got a "you're rude, be calmer" response... It does suck I got hosed. It's my "good word" at stake here. My check to my landlord, in this case, is my word 'on paper'. I wish I could validate your hypothesis, but really, we accepted her as a roomate for othe reasons: 1 - we had a time crunch 2 - she came from money (so i assumed money wouldn't be an issue, way to go dumba$$ james...) 3 - she would working and going to school (not a homebody) Her looks, of course, weren't a negative, but I have reached the age (barely) where I've begun to realize that nice butt/legs are not the "end all be all" they once were. I tried Karen, honestly I tried. I just throught wrong. I figured girl with rich parents = no problem paying bills. What I've discovered is girl with rich parents = girl with no money mgmt skills. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

I do like your point here: get a communication line open between myself and the source of the $. But I'd have to agree with Lisa on the additional lease. CA, especially, has some rather complicated and "sticky" housing laws/regs. Although I do have a "renter's manual" I could read through to be certain, I'm fairly sure that I wouldn't be able to get away with something like this. Now that being said, the point is still valid: I need communication b/w myself the $ source. Since the middle man/woman is a complete and total waste of space, I need to take the extra step to make sure the machine continues to run as it should. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

Yeah...originally I was thinking: Don't call the landlady, get the cash deposited, it'll be available the next biz day. The rent check to landlady hasn't cashed/deposited yet, hope it doesn't get in tonight or tomorrow AM. But now, I am thinking more along the lines of what you are saying. A short voicemail (as that's normally what i get to the landlady) explaining that if she could hold the rent check for 1-2 additional business days that would ensure funds would be available. Of course, indicate that the problem was not on my end, but on Jane's. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

I guess that's the kicker for me...I try not to stereotype, honestly. And it isn't easy, dealing with guys and girls from So Cal on a regular basis, and a lot of them with $$ (the area i live in is fairly wealthy, with a fairly expensive Univ of CA nearby). I find the exact same thing you do. I had hoped Jane would be different. She seemed to be different in certain aspects (cleaning up after herself, buying little things for the house, respecting others, etc) but in the most important aspect: paying bills - she's failed horribly. Honestly, I'm fairly certain that she just "assumed" mom and dad would deposit on time. I'm sure she never bothered to check. I mean why should she? She only wrote me a check for $725, that I deposited that same day (I even told her this, it's also SOP for me). At the heighth of my frustration, I thought about telling Jane to have Daddy call me, so Daddy and I could have words. I'm figuring now that would be a a bad idea, since I'd probably just tell him he's a p.o.s. and his laziness has cost me money, time, and sanity. (or perhaps i cost myself that last one...eh, w/e) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

If the man Walt says my response was Ok, than that's good enough me. No Walt, ya don't know me, but I've read a ton of your posts - and I like your style(and stories, lol). For the pic requesters...let me see what I can do...no promises. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

You know that was one of the first things that crossed my mind: Spoiled little rich girl is still getting moms and dads money. She has no concept of spending money that you actually *earn*/money mgmt. But she does have a part-time job, so she must, at least partially, understand...I hope... I do plan to provide her with copies of all bills related to fees. Problem is, I have to pay them *now* and then collect from her - wonderful... I'm also planning on no longer accept personal checks from her. If her dad wants to send me a check then fine, but he and I will need to speak first over the phone. Otherwise, it's cash or cash equivalent (cashier's check, direct trans from bank to bank, etc). But I like your point, no sense stewing over it, a solution is in place - just move fwd. Which for me, means going home for beer. (speaking of, any of you try the 5L Heine keg yet? I def reccomend!! best tasting Heineken I've had, ingenious little tap too) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

hahah, i figured that might be a problem...here's the nutshell version: roomate writes check to me for rent i write check to landlady i find out today roomate bounced her check to me roomate seems to think it's a non-issue, i disagree, strongly should i A - tear her f***ing head off, this is the second time she's done this B - take a chill pill, and understand that we're all "special" in our little way and i should be "flexible" and "sympathetic" to her plight. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

Ok, so I need some help/advice/input from an unbiased 3rd party. Here's the situation: I rent a house from a landlady who I've known for a year. The house is 3bd/2ba. Rent is $2175/mo, not including utilities ($725/room). I have 2 roomates. The landlady stipulates in the lease that she will only accept 1 check for rent, by the 3rd of every month. I am always the one to write the check, as I am the "high wage earner" of the house (by quite a lot, 1 roomate is in college, another works at Starbucks) and I am the one who speaks directly to the landlady on a regular basis. All 3 names are on the lease, with 3 separate signatures. I moved into this house in March of 05. Since then one roomate has moved out, and another young girl has moved in. My other roomate, a great guy and good friend, has been with me for over 3 years (came with from another pad in same area). The young girl that has moved in, lets call her "Jane" is the problem. In January she bounced a check to our Cable Co, Cox. We pay our bills with 3 checks. That is, one bill comes in, 3 equal checks go out. I do it this way to ensure nobody ever owes anyonelse any money. I'm sure the utility companies hate us, but I've never heard any complaints. I think they just want their money...Anyway, the check she bounces is for $67.XX. Not a big deal I tell her, we'll wait to see the fee on the next bill, and you can just pay the $67.XX, plus fee, plus current bill (her share, of course). Come 1 Feb I have in my hot little hands a check from my buddy for $725, and a check from Jane for $725. I take the checks to my bank and deposit them. I now have $2400-$2500 in the account, plenty to cover rent. I dont have any other outstanding bills, so I'm feeling good. Rent's covered again, I can continue with my measly existence. I go drop off my $2175 check to my landlord by leaving it in her mailbox, as always. That was 2 Feb. Well lo and behold I go to the ATM today to deposit other funds (on an unrelated issue) and I print a receipt. My account is WAY WAY short and no longer above $2175. I start stressing. I get back to work, check online, sure enough, a $725 check has bounced. My bank withdrew the funds and charged me a nominal fee. SHIT! So I call Jane and leave a rather unhappy voicemail: "Jane we have a huge huge issue. I'm not sure if this is your check, but I can only assume that it is, since you bounced the check to Cox. This is really really bad, I'm very pissed off. There are now 3 sets of fees coming my way: the one I already have from my bank, another from my bank when Landlady cashes my check, and a 3rd form the landlady herself (per terms of lease)." I get off the phone, and call my bank: "What is the name on the check that bounced??" Bank Lady: "Jane E. Doe" MOTHERFUCKER!!! I hang up. I call Jane back. This time Jane answers: "Jane did you get my voicemail?" "No I saw that you called, I haven't listened yet" "Well we have a huge issue, your check bounced" "Yeah I thought that might happen, my dad called me and told me he thought he deposited my money late." "WTF" I scream, what do you mean you thought this might happen?? Why didn't you tell me?? Bla bla, can't remember what she said "Jane this is a huge deal, the lease is up at the end of next month. This is my rent, Arthur's rent, OUR house! What are you doing writing me a $725 check when you don't have the money??" "Well I thought I did, I thought my Dad deposited on time." "Why didn't you check online? You already use my computer regularly...and you have your own...and you have the telephone. What the hell were you thinking??" "James, you're being really rude, there is a calmer way to handle this." "Jane, I can't believe you are expecting sympathy from me here. I told you very clearly when you moved in my priorities were 1 - pay all bills on time with good money and 2 - keep house clean/good condition by not having tons of people over and being respectful of myself and Arthur. You can't seem to do either. I suggest you get UP OFF YOUR ASS and fix this!!!" "James I am up off my ass, what do you want me to do?" "I want you to stop fucking around, go down to my bank, deposit $725 in cash or via cashier's check, and hope that our landlady hasn't deposited my check yet." "Well I have to go to class now, so I can deposit the money when I get out of class." I just hang up, completely frustrated with blood boiling at damn near 100deg C. To put this in perspective, this girl is 22, and still going to College. She's young, blonde, attractive, and living off mom and dad. She's from So Cal, comes from plenty of money (Mom & Dad driving BMW/Benz), and does not live off "ramen noodles". I on the other hand, work for a living, I'm 25. I'm trying to make a career. Trying to balance work, fun, responsibility, etc. To me, my word, when it comes to business and money is the most important thing on this planet. I do what I say *always* to ensure that things like this NEVER happen. So my question is this then: Was I far too tough on my roomate by 1 - getting angry on the phone 2 - using profanity 3 - making demands (reasonable imho) 4 - assuming that my landlady will be extremely unhappy with this Or, was my response adequate? 1 - I relayed the importance of the situation 2 - I *emphasized* this was not something to be swept under the rug 3 - I provided solutions to solve the problem 4 - I made sure Jane understood this could have additional implications I'll be headed home at 430-500PST, and I'm sure Jane will be there. I've either got to calm myself, apologize, and let her know that I'm sorry but that this is something upsetting to me, or I've got to re-emphasize that this is wholly unacceptable and demonstrates extremely poor judgement on her end. My feelings are, of course, I am justified. My plan is to re-emphasize, hope for the best, no longer accept checks from her (except for util bills), and indicate to her that I will not be looking to keep her on as a roomate come 31 Mar/1 Apr. Stop me, Congratulate me, or request pics. ;) Multi answers are available!! (phew, blood pressure decreasing as a result of writing this post, thanks dz.com!) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

jeff - you know, i started a response, and it just turned into a PA. so look, here it is: I think you have some fear/everyone-is-out-to-get-me/paranoia issues to work through. really. I came into this discussion to: 1 - highlight the failures that i felt lead to this tragedy 2 - provide additional info/details, since i live in the area. sadly, i found more people arguing that "if X employee(s) had a weapon, this wouldn't have happened" than people arguing and critically examining the actions of law enforcement (which is what i believe to be the salient point here). so i'm done, i've wasted all the time i intend to waste.

I can certainly understand the position, even being a male...but, and I have to ask, aren't the 2 issues you're talking about: partners and frequency, indicators of her overall "behavior", or just "behavior" in general? Should these 2 issues be shelved separately, from say, her behavior as it relates to drinking? how about her behavior as it relates to work/job/career? as horrible as this may seem, i make judgement calls on people based on their behaviors and actions, not on what they look like/sound like. as a result of this, it's pretty easy to see that i might make a judgement about a man or a woman (but since i'm a guy, i tend to pay more attn to women than men...) using their partner choice and frequency as evidence. rather than think of it as labeling her a "slut" or a "prude", shouldn't we be able to look at the behavior and say "she is sexually active/overactive/inactive"? but here's the kicker - as far as treating someone with respect/disrespect, i completely agree: their choice of partners and frequency really shouldn't have any bearing. problem with that is you're talking about sex, and everyone's feelings toward sex are different. (you've got the religious zealots, the s&m folks, the in-the-middle folks, and so on...) so if i have strong feelings about sex, and i'm looking at the sexual behavior of another woman, it would be naieve to think my strong feelings won't play a major role in determining how i judge her actions/inactions. i'm not saying it's right, i'm just saying it's the reality. partner choice and frequency are behavior(s) and action(s). i judge people based on behaviors and actions, rather than their looks. sex is a hot topic with most people, and they have strong feelings about the subject. their strong feelings make a noticeable impact on any decision/judgement that is reached. (you know, i struggled with trying to think of a way to get rid of judge/judgement in this response, as i dont think it really suits well. i'm not trying to say i sit in judgement of others, i'm just trying to say that i make "decisions". i.e. he/she is shy, angry, depressed, etc) is the can of worms fully open yet? lol.

here's a question for you jeffrey, merely a hypothetical: the type of deterrent you're talking about, the idea that people are armed, and therefore dangerous and not to be taken advantage of...how is this deterrent any different than having a well trained/armed security guard/staff? from my point of view, the deterrent is still there: individuals are armed and dangerous, therefore the surrounding area/people are not be f***ed with. i ask that question, because when presented with the option, the choice should be rather clear - if all you desire is the deterrent effect you speak of, there is no need to have 100 people armed, right? wouldn't you agree that you can create an effective deterrent through other means (involving less people)? honestly, i would think a postal sort facility, such as this one in goleta(handing high volume in a large bldg), would have at least ONE armed guard. it's a given that they have building security (card/barcode), so why was the human element missing? hell, the strip mall across the street has security... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

don't make me pull out the pat robertson... or the ann coulter... when was the last time, oh nevermind, it isn't worth it. go on, please sir, tell me how ms sheehan hurt you... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

haha, i can most certainly 'get down' with that. it's honest, and right to the point. blues! btw, the hoverounds comment = coffee on my monitor... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

I'll let the man respond. That wasn't what I got from his posts...but i do like the blind/DL example. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

i love how the argument against the "disruption" has changed into the traditional argument against sheehan. btw, "violate the decorum of the event", check again my friend no "violation" ever occurred (so sayeth the chief of the capitol police, or perhaps you disagree??) so, did you all just give up on your position that the t-shirts were disruptive? or is it just easier to do the targeted attack on a lady so controversial she has a book of 'talking points' from either side of the aisle. if so, i'd like to threadjack and turn the attn to good ol' pat robertson. i know he speaks for all conservatives...did i ever tell you how much i hate pat robertson. i mean damn, if that guy isn't an idiot...bla bla bla bla.... oh, and but but clinton...but but clinton...but but clinton... (there, got that out of the way for you) Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

wish I could help you Kallend... this is slightly helpful though, for easy comparison of state laws: http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/1998/schools/gun.control/ this, though, is far more useful when trying to answer your question (notice i say trying): http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/StateLaws.aspx?ST=CA your attn to the Possession section:It is unlawful for anyone convicted of a felony, or who is a drug addict, present or former mental patient, ever committed for mental observation, or acquitted by reason of insanity to own or possess any firearm. People with certain misdemeanor convictions involving force or violence may not possess or own any firearm within 10 years of the conviction. A person who has been adjudicated as a juvenile offender or delinquent for any offense which would be classified as a felony or misdemeanor involving force or violence if committed by an adult may not own or possess any firearm until age 30. A minor may not possess a handgun except with written permission or under the supervision of a parent or guardian. so although it's not really answering the question directly (this is CA state, not the US Constitution) it certainly goes to show that, yes, indeed we are 'actively' denying/limiting the rights of the mentally ill. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

you must've missed the part where it was pointed out: "Rules dealing mainly with what people can bring and telling them to refrain from reading, writing, smoking, eating, drinking, applauding or taking photographs are outlined on the back of gallery passes given to tourists every day...However, State of the Union guests don't receive any guidelines" Ya probably also missed this part: "The officers made a good faith, but mistaken effort to enforce an old unwritten interpretation of the prohibitions about demonstrating in the Capitol," so, what "rules" are you talking about? but but Clinton...but but Clinton...but but Clinton... Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell

awww....too bad for jeffrey on this one. even the capitol police have given up... "U.S. Capitol Police Chief Terrance Gainer said an apology was made to Bill and Beverly Young, and the congressman has been told that Capitol officers will receive better training. He said they are operating under outdated guidance on House rules regarding demonstrations. "Just wearing a T-shirt is not unlawful," Gainer said. Wearing a T-shirt and engaging in actions meant to draw attention to the shirt is against the law, he said, but neither woman was doing so" http://www.cnn.com/2006/POLITICS/02/01/sheehan.arrest/index.html that's gotta hurt...i mean you're defending the actions of the police while the police chief is apologizing, insisting they need better training. care to read further jeffrey? "The officers made a good faith, but mistaken effort to enforce an old unwritten interpretation of the prohibitions about demonstrating in the Capitol," http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,183514,00.html Again, the only thing that really can hold *any* weight would be written policies on attire for the event. But... "Rules dealing mainly with what people can bring and telling them to refrain from reading, writing, smoking, eating, drinking, applauding or taking photographs are outlined on the back of gallery passes given to tourists every day. However, State of the Union guests don't receive any guidelines, Hanley said. "You would assume that if you were coming to an event like the State of the Union address you would be dressed in appropriate attire," she said." It's just not your day, is it? Care to revise your statements about a T-shirt being inherently disruptive? How about the "respect is due" issue, want to revise that one as well? ...

valid question. problem is, you 1 - assume a t-shirt is disruptive 2 - assume an opposing argument is disruptive in your first sentence. imho, wearing a t-shirt isn't disruptive. but i can see the attire argument, on it's face, holding water. of course, if that was the case, i would assume the offender(s) in question would be stopped before ever entering the "main" area(wherever that may be, depending on the event). respect, of course, should be provided to *any* speaker, especially a speaker holding an elected office. but, honestly, are we just to assume that had ms. sheehan stayed, she would have been *automatically* disrepsectful to mr bush? because it seems, on it's face, that this was the assumption of the capitol police when they removed her: get her out now, before she is able to make a scene. the assumption is that the t-shirt is the tip of iceberg (perhaps she has a sign hidden, maybe an egg to throw, or maybe she'll stand up and yell), rather than assuming that the t-shirt is just her way of publicizing 'the cause'. i'm all for maintaining the dignity of the office, the value of the speech, and the significance of the event. hell, i'm even for providing respect to a man i deeply disagree with. my main problem is that without any real 'evidence' of disruption or disrespect both women were removed. they were removed because it was the easiest, fastest method to make sure nothing worse happened. i think, in all reality, in probably came down to the capitol police thinking, "if i remove her now, i risk violating her rights. if i dont remove her now, i risk her making scene and me losing my job" here's a question (for those of you that watched the televised event): in your opinion, what would be more disruptive - having a speaker, such as mr bush, speak about a controversial issue (pick one) and then be applauded energetically by his followers, while the opposing party sits stone faced, silent, not even rising out of the chair (keep in mind you're watching this on TV and it's rather easy to tell the different groups apart) OR having 2 women sit silently in the crowd, each wearing a controversial t-shirt. to me, watching the dems sit silent, scowling, still in their chairs, while the repubs are applauding and providing standing ovations was far more disruptive than either woman. Does whisky count as beer? - Homer There's no justice like angry mob justice. - Skinner Be careful. There's a limited future in low pulls - JohnMitchell