mjasantos

Hi, This is quite an old issue, and I think it will become older and older ... ========== FAI NEWS: Olympic Parachuting Bid Moves Forward 04/02/2002 http://www.fai.org/news_archives/fai/000062.asp#000062 ========== FAI NEWS: Parachuting in the 2008 Olympics ? 23/04/2002 http://www.fai.org/news_archives/fai/000060.asp#000060 ========== FAI NEWS: Sport Parachuting and the Olympic Programme 03/09/2002 http://www.fai.org/news_archives/fai/000127.asp ========== Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Hi! For any Judge out there willing to comment the questions left at this thread, here is the highlight about the mentions to "grip(s)" in the Competition Rules for Formation Skydiving 2004 (Effective May 1st, 2004) - http://www.fai.org/parachuting/documents/fs4-8_2004.pdf. (...) 2.1. Formation: consists of jumpers linked by grips. 2.2. Grip: consists of a handhold on an arm or leg. As a minimum, a grip requires stationary contact of the hand on an arm or leg, as shown in diagram 7.2. (...) 2.6. A subgroup’s centerpoint: is the defined grip, or the geometric centre of the grips within a subgroup. 2.7. Total Separation: is when all competitors show at one point in time they have released all their grips and no part of their arms have contact with another body. (...) 3.3.6. Contact or grips are allowed between subgroups during the inter. 3.3.7. Where subgroups are shown, they must remain intact as a subgroup with only the depicted grips. (...) 7.1.5. Any side-body link-up requires an arm grip and a leg grip on the same person. 7.2. Visualisation for grip positions, (Ref: 2.2): ARM | LEG. ========== I do agree with John's reply. He might very well be on it, but I'm not a FS Judge and we all know that even Judges sometimes have different interpretations on the rules, that's why time to time the rules need clarification (both by doubts about interpretation and/or "new/never thought before" situations. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

OK! ... then, if that happens (a delay ) send them to me ... Now, "out of the record": if you know something, you'd better tell them to stop that countdown clock... . Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Hi Betsy! You should know this one... aren't you at Eloy? According to Skydive Arizona web site - http://www.skydiveaz.com - by looking at the countdown clock for having the brand new Skydive AZ "14 Ft Mega Blaster Wind Tunnel", we find that the tunnel start is scheduled for September 30, 2004, 04:00 pm local time (Eloy, AZ). Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

More stuff about the subject in here: http://www.gofastsports.com/brand/parachute.html Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

You need to understand that the key words here are R&D (Research & Development). These tests have not the goal to release the VX 39 to the general public making it available for anyone with more or less experience and willing to buy it. The canopy manufacturers now placed at the edge of the R&D regarding high performance canopies (Icarus, Atair, Precision, ..., just to mention some) have been doing things that would be considered beyond extreme by the majority of the skydivers and public, but required to keep improving technicals and safety of the skydiving gear. Test pilots push their limits everyday, but that's why they are test pilots: they do stuff that nobody else does... and if limits are always being pushed from where they are now, test pilots will quite often find themselves in situations that they have never ever experienced before. Nobody knows how far R&D can reach, but all of us need to understand that these kind of tests will bring benefits even for bigger sized canopies: the purpose here is not just the downsizing factor. Regarding Icarus, as for the VX 46 project, they have now a VX 39 project... and probably they won't stop here. Just remember that Atair test pilots already jumped but not landed a Cobalt 25, and Precision test pilots also jumped but not landed a XAOS 21... so it's likely that Icarus is and will be doing the very same track on the pursuit of the excelence required by canopy buyers. The real purpose of any canopy manufacturer while doing this kind of stuff, is well described here: Icarus’s motivation to pursue this type of testing results from our pursuit to lead the industry in parachute designs across the experience spectrum. Testing our design capabilities and theories at this level has a direct benefit to the entire Icarus range and parachute technology as a whole. (...) NOTE: Flying canopies at this level should only be conducted by factory test pilots under controlled conditions. http://www.icaruscanopies.com/canopies/EXTreme_VX/EXTremeVX46.htm The last paragraph of the quote shows these guys (Icarus or any other manufacturer) are not irresponsible or just nuts. They care as well about their test pilots and impose them restrictions whenever they feel things can go out of control or that their lives have a higher than affordable probability to be put at risk. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Congratulations for your cool and very detailed and informative post about this Perris Big-Way Camp! Nice pics too! It's clear that you all had a great time there! Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Sorry, but I missed this one about the SRC's: http://www.performancedesigns.com/src.htm If it looks complicated to install, you'd better check it with a rigger at your DZ, as any mistake here would have serious consequences. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Does this help? PD Slink Web page: http://www.performancedesigns.com/slink.asp PD Slink instructions: http://www.performancedesigns.com/docs/SlinkInstructions_1.pdf Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

You're right! It's almost impossible to imagine the feeling he's had while flying that little 21 sq ft toy!!! It's always cool to remember such achievements! Thanks for it! Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

MT1-X is the name for this old canopy (370 sq ft) often used by military for HALO and HAHO jumps in the mid 80's. Actually I jumped it from 1987 to 1991. There was also the MT1-S, a similar one but with slightly different specs. I think the manufacturer was ParaFlite. When the assembled system had a MT1-X for main and a MT1-X for reserve, the assembly was called a MT1-XX. The designation comes from having a MT1-X for both the main and the reserve. It was a HUGE pack!!! The reason was an operational one: if, while jumping in operations, you had a malfunction with your main, you would still be able to continue the mission with your team, because your reserve chute was also an MT1-X. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Hi, The standard (recommended) packing method for MT-1X canopies used to be the "Roll Packing" one. I jumped this type of canopy in the military (for HALO & HAHO jumps) and that was the method riggers used to pack it. Sorry that I can not find a link showing how to do it, but my best advice would be that you talk with a rigger... they know what "roll packing method" is. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

From Go Fast! Sports Web Site: http://www.gofastsports.com/ News & Updates Section VX-39 Go Fast Athlete Luigi Cani to fly world's smallest parachute in World Record Attempt on May 12, 2004! Teammate J.C. Colclasure will be flying alongside with the helmet cam - video coming soon! ============================== Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Hi, You may have a look here: Randoms A - H http://www.mariosantos.com/uk_us/randoms_a-h.htm Randoms J - Q http://www.mariosantos.com/uk_us/randoms_j-q.htm For the codes of the colors used, have a look here - http://www.mariosantos.com/uk_us/continuity.htm Have FUN and a good training! Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

I think you misunderstood me here about what I meant to say. Sorry, I'm not an US/English speaker native. The message was the same as SkymonkeyONE said, about the strategy he'll likely adopt while testing this VX 39 (similar to the one he used for the VX 46): "Luis Cani ended up jumping the VX-46 with a LOT of lead after his first "safe" landings in an effort to see what might be the maximum viable wingload. Those weighted tests were to work out the math on what smaller main he might be able to get away with." I have no doubts that he's using lead... what I meant to say was that, most likely, he would start testing his VX 39 with less WL and then, jump after jump, increase it... of course I don't know which is the max WL he will achieve on this one. Sorry again... I just wanted to spread this awesome news. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Wrong!! USPA got it corrected already. http://www.uspa.org/news/index.htm Cani Lands Smallest Parachute (05/12/04) Brazilian jumper Luigi Cani reportedly landed an Icarus VX 39 (square feet) at Perris Valley Skydiving, near Los Angeles, May 12. Several jumpers have landed a VX 46, but Cani and Icarus Canopies believe this is the smallest parachute jumped and landed to date. The smallest known commercially available parachute is the Atair Onyx 55. ============================== Link to Onix page: http://www.extremefly.com/aerodynamics/canopies/onyx.html ============================== Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

I think you are right and as Xaosrules said USPA is wrong... I've just copied the news and didn't confirm the data in it. Actually they should know it... In my research I found several canopies smaller than the VX 69, although some of them have not yet been released for commercial purposes. It's true there is a XAOS-27 58 sq ft commercially available, but it's also true that recently (as you said) Atair released its Atair Onyx 36 cell 55 sq ft canopy - http://www.extremefly.com/aerodynamics/canopies/onyx.html. As far as I know, now that you brought it to my attention (I'll take it to USPA attention too) currently this is the smallest commercially available canopy size. As posted here - http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_view_flat;post=318459 - Atair test pilots have already jumped but not landed a Cobalt 25!!! "catfish and eric have been jumping the cobalt 25. opens great at terminal, hyper responsive. flies straight in twists. wing loading from 8:1 to 11:1.... no plans for landing it any time soon. Just to remember that toy, here are the photos: http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=3963; http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?do=post_attachment;postatt_id=3964; Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

That could have happened, although if this was the 1st time he landed the VX 39 "beast" we could think that he tried it at a lower than maximum wing loading. On that link about the VX 46, where they mention a suspended weight of 160 lbs for a wing loading of 3.5 on the VX 46, we also don't know if that suspended weight included lead or not. However, as you mentioned, it is also known that Luigi jumped the VX 46 at over a 4.7 wing loading: http://www.dropzone.com/interviews/JimSlaton-AdvancedCanopy.shtml [Jim Slaton answering an interview] With your team mate Luis Cani flying a 46 sq Ft canopy and talking about trying something smaller, how small do you think we could go? Luigi & me spend a lot of time experimenting with wing loadings and airfoil types. I have seen Luigi load himself up with weights and fly the VX46 at over a 4.7 wing loading! However, Luigi is one of the best canopy pilots in the world and has one of the best testing grounds as well. There comes a point with aerodynamics that you start sacrificing one type of performance for another. When you reach a high enough wing loading for your airfoil type, you begin sacrificing lift for speed. The smaller the wing and the higher the wing loading, the more airspeed you need to create lift. All pilots need lift for a safe and productive landing. This is why parachutes flown at very high wing loadings don't always out swoop their competition and don't always land pretty. Overloaded canopies are not always efficient and are very tricky to land. However, just because they are not efficient doesn't mean they can't be landed safely. Technological advancements in canopy designs have open new doors for pilots flying at higher wing loadings with smaller wings. Future designs will make this opportunity even more epic! I feel Luigi Cani could successfully land an Icarus Extreme down to 28 sq feet! This is a bold statement, but I know he can and probably will. Keep in mind Luigi makes over 1000 jumps each year and trains daily in high performance canopy landings. He has some of the best aerodynamic engineers in the world behind him and is backed with the support of some of the biggest canopy manufactures in the business. ============================== What will be the next smaller but landable canopy? A VX 28? Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Well... by reading here - http://www.icaruscanopies.com/canopies/EXTreme_VX/EXTremeVX46.htm - on his VX 46 he had a wing loading of 3.5, for a suspended weight of 160 lbs. Using this data for current wing loading under his VX 39, we would get something like a 4.10. Simply AWESOME!!! This time I have to say: good landings! Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

From USPA News: Cani Lands Smallest Parachute (05/12/04) Brazilian jumper Luigi Cani reportedly landed an Icarus VX 39 (square feet) at Perris Valley Skydiving, near Los Angeles, May 12. Several jumpers have landed a VX 46, but Cani and Icarus Canopies believe this is the smallest parachute jumped and landed to date. The smallest known commercially available parachute is the Icarus VX 69. http://www.uspa.org/news/index.htm ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Hi Vanilla, Training 90's, 180's, 270's, 360's, 540's or any other type ot turns with your eyes closed, is suited best to give yourself the confidence you need on making a correct turn (both in place and with the right angle). The turn speed will be variable from person to person... each one should go just the fastest he/she can while maintaing total control of it, regarding both the "in place" thing and the angle of the turn. This "eyes closed" drill is also designed to help your feeling of your own center point, the one which is the center of your turns. This is because, many times, when you start doing turns in a Formation Skydiving team, there is a tendence to turn around your chest rather than your belly, because of excess of using of your head while visualizing your references. When you are able to do good turns with your eyes closed, your confidence will be higher and it will be easier to perform with your eyes open, which is the normal while freefalling. This will help you as well on your super-positioned moves, those ones requiring both (simultaneously) rotational and transactional movement. Confidence is the key for good turns. By turning with your eyes closed, you'll have to feel your "internal compass" and trust your body without using your eyes. To replace your vision while doing it, you'll have to use a lot of visualizing and trust yourself. At the begining it will seems odd or even strange... but when you get it, and go with your eyes open, you'll see the difference: much easier than before. You can also train those eye closed turns on creepers, both alone or with your team. Do you remember one of the phases while creeping, the one where you go from transition to transition with your eyes closed? It suits the same purpose: visualize, trust yourself, both your body and your "internal compass". Just another remark: by turning with your eyes opened and referencing someone to help you on your turns, could be erratic as well. Just imagine that those people you're referencing are not turning in place: you'll be adjusting your turn to their moves out of place. Actually you'll be doing a superpositioned move, rather than a turn in place. On a team, the goal is that everyone turns in place, when required, as for example in blocks 7, 9, 14 and 15. This way the proximity remains the same. If someone doesn't turn in place, it will create an "internal drag" ("skew" effect) in the formation, as some of the teammates could be adjusting their turns to finish close and some don't. That's why you skydive with your eyes open. But if every team members can turn in place with eyes closed, they'll be able to do it as well with their eyes open and finish those turns close to each other, saving time and with a clean flight. Hope this helps a bit. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Skydive Portugal Events 19.06.2004 - 27.06.2004 THE HEAT IS ON - Introducing the Beechcraft 99 http://www.skydive-portugal.com/events.html ===================================== What's New: the mystery becomes reality ... Europe´s first Beechcraft 99 jumpship .. at our DZ June 19 -27. If you think our Super Otter was not fast try the 99 ....make sure your legstraps are tight before take-off. http://www.skydive-portugal.com/start.html ===================================== Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Looking at the Fatalities Database in 2004 (still a very small sample), we verifiy that 5 out of the 11 fatalities reported this year, are due to low & hook turns. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/fatalities/search.cgi?fatal_category=Landing Looking at each of them, we find out that: - On those five accidents, 3 were hook turns and 2 were low turns; - They hit jumpers at any experience level (rookies, intermediate and experienced skydivers); we had jumpers with 150+, 450, 600, 4000 and 5000 jumps; - They happen anywhere in the world... we had these at UK, Australia, South Africa, USA and Netherlands. The sample is too small yet and hopefully will remain like this... but if we could get numbers putting together the 3 or 4 years, I'm sure we would get similar data. Here is a summary for 2004: - 150+ jumps / Hook Turn / UK; - 4000 jumps / Hook Turn / Australia; - 5000 jumps / Hook Turn / South Africa; - 600 jumps / Low Turn / Netherlands; - 450 jumps / Low Turn / USA. I would divide this type of accident in 3 categories: 1) The mistake of trying to come back to the DZ after a bad drop and turning low for landing is probably the one who gets skydivers with less experience... those with experience would choose an alternative zone for landing safely rather than try to make it back and then turn low. 2) Intermediate jumpers: they are not beginers or students anymore... they look forward to become experienced and do whatever "pro's " do... that impulse to "imitate" those pro-swoopers sometimes has bad consequences, usually because they were not prepared yet for such manoevers... if the first ones go OK, they get over confident and then is when the mistake happens (an altitude misjudgement, pushing their limits too much beyond or something else goes wrong). 3) Experienced skydivers: they know how to do it and have done it many, many times... but just the fact that the manoever is tried will add some sort of risk... and they come real fast... the more fast they come, the less margin for errors... and swoopers know it. Be safe out there and... Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

Hi, I think your question could get several types of answers: - by the pleasure of feeling the rush and the adrenaline; - sometimes by mistake (on trying to reach the DZ from a drop out of it; - sometimes for show-off; - sometimes to push the "envelope" to or beyond the limits; - etc. ... Basically you have those who do it on an intentionally and planned way and those who do it but were not planning to. Regarding the outcome of those low turns, you also have the ones who walk away from it and those who don't (many of them... within this category, unfortunatelly some go to the statistics). You should do whatever you feel comfortable with... of course, the most you will learn and the most you get current as a canopy pilot, the most you will push your limits... just don't go beyond... preferably stay "short-limit" on your fast approach skills and swooping capabilities, but never go beyond them... this will guarantee, at least, that you won't be just another number in the statistics... it may sound rude to tell it, but all of us know what's the feeling when some of our friends, or someone we used to know, passed the way as a consequence of such a stupid accident. Those fast approaches are spectacular... when everything goes fine! But sometimes, a mistake (e.g. a bad evaluation on your altitude, or the type of circuit your practising, or doing it the same way as you were used to with another canopy but this time with a new one where you're not current yet, etc.) or something unexpected happens (another skydiver getting into your circuit, turbulence, etc.)... and this type of mistakes or unexpected usually has very very tough consequences... And for what I've seen in statistics, they happen to experienced, intermediate and beginners. No one is out of the odds of a mistake happen when doing such type of manoever. Both the excess of confidence or the lack of knowledge on how to do it, could saddly end the same way. Many people says that at the very end, the skydiver reaction while doing such type of landings, is a survival one... and there's no margin for errors: you went 2 or 3 feet lower than you should, touching the ground where you shouldn't, and that's it. These approaches give pleasure to both those doing them and those watching them, when both the circuit and the swoop are awesome... but they hurt both phisically and emotionally when these fail. Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal

From USPA Web Site: http://www.uspa.org/news/index.htm U.S. to Hold 2nd Canopy Piloting World Cup (04/09/04) On April 9, the International Parachuting Commission of the Federation Aeronautique International awarded the 2nd World Cup of Canopy Piloting to USPA . The Florida Skydiving Center will host the meet in Lake Wales from October 29 through November 3, 2004. Lyle Presse will be the meet and course director. Brazil also submitted a bid but it was declared ineligible for not following the strict procedures established by the IPC at its 2003 meeting. ===================================== Blue Skies! ----------------------------- Mario Santos Portugal