Nullified

***I am pushing the envelope on what is a safe wing loading for a new jumper. I plan on renting for a little while before I use my new gear (wont be here for a few weeks anyway). But I also want to take a control course. Quote Very cool of you to be looking for a canopy control course so early on. Too bad more people don't do that. As for Scott Miller's camps, I can't speak of him highly enough. So, what exactly do you mean by pushing the envelope on what is a safe wing loading...? A canopy control course is a very smart thing, but don't forget that there really isn't any substitute for experience. Be careful. Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Nullified said: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Look at the new Alabama CRW record. A 9-stack. I don't know the particulars of who came from where, but if this is a mostly local talent record, I think it's much more admirable than if Chris Gay were to take his buddies down there and build a quadraplane diamond and claim a 16-way record. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Again, I agree. Taking the talent that was there to build and break or set a new record isn't easy. But the question you need to ask yourself, what or was there a record before? If not, why not start smaller and build from it. This will allow people that want to join in later down the road to do so. But it's going to get to the point in size that local jumpers and talent aren't going to be able to handle it. That's when out of state jumpers with the talent are asked to join in. I don't see a problem with that. By bringing in more outside talent than locals, the record loses any indication of the talent available in a particular area. All that really matters then is, how many people are willing to travel to so and so state. Why not just call a record attempt, "The Jack Jefferies Record", or "The Wright Attitude Posse Record" or, "The Chris Gay Dogs Record?" I'm sure if a "big name" organizer like Guy Wright, or Roger Ponce send out invitation to hold an event in New Hampshire, they would get the folks there. Just the idea of getting 150 way any where is exciting. To me it doesn't matter if it's in New Hampshire or Arizona. So, am I limited in my travels to be on big ways because I don't live in the state that is holding the event? It is exciting, and a beautiful thing...no matter where it happens. So then, why not just call it a big-way boogie somewhere, without it having to take place in a state where it will be a new record? Everybody, I'm not trying to criticize anybody. I do appreciate everything that goes in to these records. But indifference to the percentage of locals involved is like saying, anyone can participate in the Miss California Contest, so long as you're hot...and a girl. *** Can I ask both Nullified and rjf98, what is your history with big way events? Quote I don't have any experience as a big-way participant. Biggest RW jump I've been on was a 16-way. If someday I'm invited to be on a CRW state record, I promise you that I won't unless there are a greater number of locals involved than non-locals. There are plenty of other big-ways happening out there. In closing, I'm not taking this poll in order to send a message or bust balls, or anything else like that. Just curious, that was all, and putting my thoughts out there. I wish everyone the greatest success and safety. Time for a nice fountain Coke! Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

In my traveling experience if the DZ or state has the talent, then most times they are on the jumps. The major problem that I have seen it the past, is when a local doesn't have the talent, and they are mad cause they aren't on the jumps. The organizers don't care where you are from, they just care if they get the record. People pay lots of money for travel and jumps to make a record happen. Just because someone is from that state and again, doesn't have the talent, doesn't mean they should be on the attempts. I agree. If somebody doesn't have the talent, they shouldn't be on the jump. Thing is, if breaking records is the goal, shouldn't those who have the talent be allowed? Look at the new Alabama CRW record. A 9-stack. I don't know the particulars of who came from where, but if this is a mostly local talent record, I think it's much more admirable than if Chris Gay were to take his buddies down there and build a quadraplane diamond and claim a 16-way record. Why? Because he and his buddies have already proved that they can do it. I bet several of the participants in the 9-stack record wouldn't have been able to participate in the record had it been a much larger formation, organized by somebody who is just interested in snatching up records. By doing that, you are eliminating local people who otherwise could've participate in 'their' state record. As the local talent grows, so will the state record. To me, that's what a state record is all about. I'm completely impressed by the people who are setting the records, don't think I'm not. I appreciate the talent and the planning and work that goes in to them, and yes I love watching it all come together no matter who's involved. But look at from a slightly different perspective than what you pointed out earlier. You enjoy traveling and jumping with your buddies and breaking new ground. What about the locals who may be able to participate in a 40-way state record, but don't have the talent to participate in a 100-way state record, where 60 of the participants are visitors? They're being excluded not because they don't represent some of the top talent locally, but because they don't represent top talent on a national level, which is where the participants are being pooled from. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

***Q. What "official" body in the state of California ratifies California skydiving records? A. There isn't one. That's why these records are unofficial, and have no set rules about who may participate etc. Quote Wouldn't it be as simple as having a USPA representative present to verify that the predeclared goal was attained? I'm asking, not challenging. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

In the event of a state which has no DZ, I guess he who brings the DZ makes the call! I understand the feelings regarding enjoying traveling and jumping with buddies, and I'm not suggesting that you / we shouldn't be able to do that. That's why I didn't vote for 100%. My thinking is, a state record should represent local talent. Somebody mentioned The Olympics, and I'm wondering how many people representing each country were not citizens of the country that they were representing? Before I start being seen as a requirement nazi (!) I really want to be clear that I'm not suggesting a 100% requirement. Just that a State record should feature local talent. I mean, you could conceivebly get the same group of people traveling from state to state snatching up every state record. Somebody mentioned that these state records aren't actually official. Is this true? If that's the case, then I don't really see the need for any minimum requirement. If something is to be official though, then I would really like to think that the majority of the participants are locals. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Guess what, make them meet a locals requirement and most of those big records will go away. Then, depending upon where you live and skydive, you can suck and still set the record...at least for a year or so Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Probably should've stated this in my original post; My idea of local means that you either live in, or jump at a DZ within that state frequently. I voted 75%, though I nearly voted 100%. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Unless I'm misunderstanding, Angela wasn't upset that somebody was giving her rig the visual once-over. She got angry when somebody began physically fidgeting with her rig un-announced. I don't think that anybody would get upset at somebody else for pointing something out to them, or for offering a gear check. Quite often I have people warning me that there's "Stuff" sticking out of my rig. I explain why, that's it's safe and I thank them. A couple of times, someone has come up to me and without saying a word, started pushing the three rings of my bridle retraction system inside my rig. Well intentioned? Sure. Helpful? NOT AT ALL. Detrimental, in fact. Ask before you touch. Now I know that this wasn't Angela's situation, but the point is, if you're going to touch someone's gear, let them know before you do. That being said, gear checks are life savers and I'd personally never turn one down. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Just curious what people think. When setting a state record, do you think that there should be any minimum percentage of locals participating in the attempt? And I understand that a lot of people who jump at DZs aren't necessarily residents of that state, so please elaborate on what definition of "Locals" you believe to be appropriate. Thanks and stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

If my rig was lying on the ground or hanging up and I saw somebody poppoing my flaps and such, I'd be pretty upset. Why would I tolerate it when it's on my back? Gear checks are a beautiful thing, but just going up to someone and silently popping flaps is arrogance. Well intentioned or not, it's wrong. Get permission first. And as for the whole, "Since when is your privacy more important than my safety..." thing, unless something is visually wrong, that remark doesn't hold water. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Brian, Just in case you weren't aware, The Ranch does have a mentoring program. It really just began this year so word hasn't gotten out to everyone yet (probably), but we do have one. When you graduate, ask about it at Manifest. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

I jump a brand new (~60 jumps with it now) 143, trimmed sequential that I'm loding at 1.33:1. I've just recently started carving it in which makes the landings really easy, but for the most part, I've been landing it from straight in, full flight and I hadn't had any problems with it that way. What I've found works for me is, initiate the flare a few feet higher than I would with my Sabre2, make it almost a stab of a flare down to a little beneath my shoulders, and then finish it with a smooth but quick (not a stab) motion, bringing my toggles to their full extension. There's definitely less room for error with these canopies, but I have no complaints. I'm in love with my Lightning. I like what Dragon2 said, "If I can land it...anyone can". I think the people who consistently slam in have just accepted that it's going to happen and that's why it does. Well, to all, safe and pleasent landings! Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Well, that's the thing. I keep hearing about how badly they land, but for the most part, I see people landing them quite well...myself included. I'm trying to figure out how these canopies have gotten such a bad rep. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Tonight at a party, I had what could be described as an argument with a freeflyer regarding landing Lightnings. I know the Lightning has a bad rep regarding landings, but don't get it. I've had several 'hard' landings, but these were the cases; First jump on a Lightning, I face planted. Once while borrowing a friends who had extra links on the rear risers, I stalled the thing when I flared. And, anytime I'm the bottom guy landing a formation. Aside from these situations, I've had consistently beautiful landings. We had a CRW camp this year, and several of the participants consistently had very nice landings, and pretty much all of the instructors and coaches not only had nice landings, but several of them were getting some impressive swoops with their Lightnings. So, I'm wondering, amongst you more experienced Dogs, what are your feelings about landing Lightnings?? Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Well, the green light was on. If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Brian, don't feel so bad. The first four loads were very nice. It wasn't until load five when the winds suddenly lost their mind. And, towards the end of the day, it calmed down. As for the 170 main, if you're interested, I've got a Sabre2 170 burning a hole in a plastic bag. I don't want to sell it, but I VERY rarely use it and you're more than welcome to use it until you find something to buy. Got about 200 jumps on it. Cut away once from a wrap, no damage. Fid me at the DZ or e-mail. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

I jump in NY State, and we have an Otter flying all winter. We may only have a handful of people and be able to only get up 4 or 5 loads, but the atmosphere becomes much more intimate during these winter periods. The bonfire can be as much fun as the skydiving. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

My favorite skydive to date was in May of this year. My friend docked on my tail, and after about 10 seconds of wooowooo sounds passing back and forth, things got ugly. I was looking over my shoulder and saw his legs hanging and his hands holding my tail. The moment he released me, he fell through my lines, collapsed my canopy and got rolled up pretty tightly in canopy and lines. After a couple violent revolutions, I cut away and allowed him to survive. The cool part of it though, was the look of confusion on his face as he dropped through my lines. I'll never be able to picture that look on his face and not laugh. Yeah, I know. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

I'd like to know where you've been jumping? As others have said, if you get into the plane and you have questions about the weather, you don't get your ticket back. Now, if there is a problem with the plane that might be a different story. At least at my home DZ, if you get on the plane and then decide that maybe you shouldn't have, you'll pay for the ticket. But, if the weather has changed since you've taken off such that ground will radio the pilot about it (Winds), they will refund your ticket. Stay safe If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Ask her to seriously consider all of the things in life that she's wished that she'd done and hadn't. You could bring her to the DZ and have her watch what's going on. I've had a couple friends who wouldn't skydive, but after watching for a few hours, they've gone up and done a tandem. If all fails, make the decision that you can live with. You know your Mom better than we do! Good luck, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

***I'm not quite sure I agree with the throw-outs for students.Quote In my opinion and from my experience, I think it's best to teach students on the gear most like what they'll be jumping when off student status. After several jumps reaching 'here' for something, why would you want to then suddenly make them reach 'there' for it? About midway through my AFF, I got sick of being grounded because of wind. I decided to do a Tandem just to get back in the air. At pull time, I reached back and grabbed the golf ball and tried with all my might to throw it out perpendicularly to my body. After a few seconds I managed to deploy it, but they're designed to pulled towards your head (At least the tandem equipment we have is), and didn't take well to being yanked in a direction away from my body. When you become more experienced, different gear becomes a bit less of an issue, but when you're learning and very low time, I believe it's detrimental to make such a signifigant change as deploying from your chest to deploying from above your ass. Keeping things consistent is important and safe. Later. If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Fuck the facilities, Fly The Fantasy! Stay safe. If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

No, not chipped ice. I think it's the long term effects of hypoxia that are fucking with my memory! Anyway, I want to be on that load with you. Maybe Kim could deploy during the Mr. Bill and the two could transition to a downplane?? See ya'. If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

Is this really going to work? Wouldn't the trim of the canopy keep it from ascending? I know, I've watched people 'ascend' on low cloud days, but they've got a vehicle helping, not just the wind. I've seen people get dragged in the wind, and I've seen people running or walking with an inflated canopy above them, but I've never seen somebody get pulled back in to the sky. Just a thought. Stay safe, Mike If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.

John, IAD exits are fun. I did a bunch of them last year when several of our AFF and Tandem instructors were going for their IAD and static line ratings. Have fun. If you're gonna' be stupid, well, then you're most likely stupid.