LouDiamond 1 #1 March 9, 2003 I strapped my Garmin V to my chest strap today after having marked the peas as a way point and aquiring butt loads of sats. I lost all sats while in the A/C and figured it was a bust. However,once on the ground I was happy to see that the GPS had indeed re-aquired the sats while I was in flight and while under canopy. Even thought the antenna was under my body it was able to pick up sats pretty much from exactley where I got out. Some of the average speeds and max speeds are some what suspcious when compared to my pro track data. I don't know what may have caused the variences but my max speed on the gps was 233 mph, Moving average of 13 mph and over all average of 5.2mph. Pro track data showed a max speed of 89mph and low of 62mph. I jumped the unit a total of 4 times today and each jump has a bread crumb trail from exit to landing. The Garmin world source software can supposedly tell you elevation and speed for every crumb, but I have yet to play with it with BM data. There is a vertical speed field, a speed field and elevation but I am unable to see them since it is on my chest and they zero out on the ground. Once I DL the data to my computer I will see if I can capture the data from those fields with the software. So far it looks like a chest mounted GPS with the short antenna works fine. I think it may actually be benificial that the GPS looses the sats while in the A/C so that you don't get a bread crumb trail or data on the climb to altitude. Once I figure out how to extrapolate the data I want I'll let ya know what I find."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spizzzarko 0 #2 March 9, 2003 I did a BM jump with my Garmin 76S. I acquired the sats in the plane (Caravan) by sitting next to the door. I just erased the track log just prior to getting out, then shoved it down the front of the suit. The GPS said I went a lot further than I think I did. The decent speeds where pretty jacked up also. I think this is due to the pressure differentials on your stomache. I have sewn a pocket on my lower left leg of the suit. Unfortunately the WX in Colorado has been bad, so I havn't had a chance to jump it. I will try it out tomorrow if the WX is better. Have a nice day. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spizzzarko 0 #3 March 10, 2003 Sorry Lou, I didn't get a chance to try out the GPS. Maybe in a couple of weeks when I'm down in AZ. If I can find a digital camera, I'll try to take a picture of the pocket for you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #4 March 10, 2003 no worries, I jumped the GPS chest mount again today. Still have to DL the data and see what ,if anything , I can do with it."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
encinoadam 0 #5 March 10, 2003 Um, how does pressure relate to GPS accuracy? GPS uses satellites... ProTrack uses pressure. No? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #6 March 10, 2003 Quote Um, how does pressure relate to GPS accuracy? GPS uses satellites... ProTrack uses pressure. No? Some GPS units have atmospheric pressure sensors to give more accurate altitude information. I don't really trust GPS altitude over short distances. With 9 satellites locked the whole way, I did a 100 foot vertical ascent (as marked on a sign and confirmed with a barometric altimeter) up about a 50% grade. The GPS said that I had descended 12 feet. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #7 March 10, 2003 what type of GPS unit did you use that gave you such poor readings? I have used both a hand (skydiving) altimeter, my Suunto vector watch and my Garmin V GPS at the samer time to cross check altitude readings and they are both very accurate, more so than a hand altimeter."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #8 March 12, 2003 OK, heres an update. I downloaded the GPS data to the Garmin mapsource program via serial cable and reviewed my tracks(BM flights). The software breaks it down to specifics that i think most people may be interested in.the whole flight is broken down into legs. The data starts with the index number , data time group,altitude, leg length,leg time , leg speed,leg course and position in geo coords. It also tells you the length in miles, elapsed time and average speed. I've attached a screen grab of the tracks overlayed onto the map. My observations from the data I gathered on the jumps I made this past weekend. I made a total of 5 flights, the distance and speeds break down as follows: length: 2.9 miles;avg speed:27.4mph length: 3.7miles;avg speed:31.4mph length: 3.9miles;avg speed:39.2mph length: 4.8miles;avg speed:37.2mph length: 5.0miles; avg speed:56.4mph Some of the anomolies that I noted in the data were that most of the altitude readings start in the high 9 thousands. I attribute this to not having satelites prior to exit and reaquiring them while in flight. The speeds tend to flucuate in the begining of the flight and then settle out into normal consistent speeds. For example I believe one of my higest speeds for one portion of the flight is listed at something like 500 mph but then the following speeds are in the 30-50mph range, all within a few mph of each other consistant all the way down to the deck. Since the altitudes are given I can tell which portion of the leg was actual BM flight and which was under canopy. This allows me to measure only the actual BM flight data and not canopy flight for calculation purposes. One of the things that I was a little skeptical about was the distances but I jumped with a fellow BM who was in a SF who agrees that we were farther out than anticipated on one of the jumps and I will admit it was one of those flights where I actually thought for a moment that we wouldn't make it back. The GPS data confirms this belief and once I was able to see the data overlayed onto the map it coincided with the geographical references I remember seeing on the ground prior to departing the plane. Now I don't believe the data I gathered to be entirely concise since there are some noted anomolies. I think this may be rectified if I were to mount the GPS in a location such as my leg or mount the external antenna to the back of my helmet. I plan to continue tinkering with the GPS data and relocation of the unit for several more flights to see if I can gather a better idea of the best way to collect data in a consistent and reliable way. Personaly, I find this type of data more meaningful than that supplied by the protrack. "It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #9 March 12, 2003 Scott= newfound techno geek! Better watch it Craig! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #10 March 12, 2003 Quote Scott= newfound techno geek! Better watch it Craig! Sup Monkey Lip, who you call'n geek?You ever get answers to the questions I asked you awhile back? PM me with the details."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #11 March 13, 2003 Quote Quote Scott= newfound techno geek! Better watch it Craig! Sup Monkey Lip, who you call'n geek?You ever get answers to the questions I asked you awhile back? PM me with the details. scott = tchno geeek? hum pimp comes into mindLeroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #12 March 15, 2003 I installed the topographic version of the Garmin software on the computer and there is the added terrain detail but other than that it looks pretty much the same. I may revert to the normal software since you were able to get a a linear graph showing altitudes all the way down to the deck(see attached jpeg). I plan on getting some more readings today to see if I can tweak some of the problems and basically gather more data. I'll let you see what I was able to get when I get back. "It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #13 March 15, 2003 thats not a free copy of a military program is it? lolLeroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #14 March 17, 2003 AH NO dude, It's for sale in just about every outdoor store in the US. Did several more GPS jumps this weekend and the data isn't as promising looking as it was last weekend. It appears that it took longer to acquire the sats this time and the data gathered was lower in the flights and the distances shorter as well. I believe this may be due to the cloud cover and overall weird day, who knows. I'm still in the collection phase of this test so we shall see. As soon as I have some data I'll post it"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #15 March 17, 2003 QuoteAH NO dude, It's for sale in just about every outdoor store in the US. Did several more GPS jumps this weekend and the data isn't as promising looking as it was last weekend. It appears that it took longer to acquire the sats this time and the data gathered was lower in the flights and the distances shorter as well. I believe this may be due to the cloud cover and overall weird day, who knows. I'm still in the collection phase of this test so we shall see. As soon as I have some data I'll post it i know of a site that has a HUD for helemts... maybe we can converge a gps to allow u to view the data live?Leroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #16 March 17, 2003 OK, you buy it and I'll fly it and tell you about it "It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #17 March 26, 2003 Made another 6 jumps this past weekend with the GPS. I was able to get more sats than I've ever had before but it didn't seem to help me much in the air. I am still noticing that it takes until about the high 8s to reacquire the sats and the unit to start reading. Once again, I think this would be fixed if I mounted the external antenna to the back of my helmet or other area directly exposed to the sky. Some of my numbers were a bit strange again but my distances seemed realistic and so did my speeds. I am working on a pillow for the unit that will allow me to observe the screen while in flight, much like a pillow for an alti. While far from perfect, I think it is a useful tool to track jumps. It also allows you to catalog the data since dates and times are given througout the flight as are speeds and distances. Once overlayed on the map there is no doubt as to where you were flying. I flew directly over a road for a good ways and it is depicted on the map when I downloaded it."It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #18 March 28, 2003 That's cool. Are you ready for a SkyFlyer yet? PM me. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #19 March 28, 2003 Quote That's cool. Are you ready for a SkyFlyer yet? PM me. PM coming my monkey"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spizzzarko 0 #20 April 3, 2003 Lou, I told you I would get back with you. I made 3 jumps down at coolidge on Sunday with the GPS. All three times I would take the unit (I said Unit, uh-huh-huh uhhh) out of the pocket I have sewn into the lower left leg on the calve, and accuire sat's in the aircraft. I used the little porthole window next to the little back left seat in the Mullins King Air. After endurring the endless barrage of questions to include, "What's that thing for man? Is it for if you get lost man? It's really easy to find the dropzone man. It's over by the hangar man..." It got a 3d reading as to where the aircraft was. As soon as I put it back into the pouch it lost sat's, but it was still tracking the altitude with the barometric altimeter. After the jump, it showed the usual bread crumb trail, fairly accuratley at that, and I was able to see a graph of altitude over distance. The 76s has a page where it will plot altitude gains and losses. It is tracked in the track log, so I just clear the track log prior to exiting and it plots fromn the top down . I'm not sure if the Vista does that, but it's kind of neat. The best thing about it is that you can tell exactly how much altitude you have lost untill it re-accuires the sat's. I was losing about 3 or 4 hundred feet, untill it stared to plot any distance's. I don't have any fancey computer software to download the info like you do, so I can't upload the info for everyone to see. As far as where I'm attaching the unit, I'm getting better accuracy with it being on the back leg of the suit. I got some pretty funky readings just shoving it down the front of my jumpsuit. It was saying I went 6 miles out and 6 miles back. Maybee with a few more jumps on my GTI I could do that... hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah sorry, that was kind of funny. I'll try to get a hold of a digital camera and take a few pictures of the pocket I made foe the GPS unit, so every one else can get bombarded with stupid questions on the airplane. That's all I have to say about that. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #21 April 3, 2003 Quote "What's that thing for man? Is it for if you get lost man? It's really easy to find the dropzone man. It's over by the hangar man..." I'm glad to see I'm not the only one getting the dumb questionsI pretty much ignore the GPS on the ride up since it doesn't get sats and I also don't get the bread crumb trail of the A/C flight to altitude. With the software you can see the altitude gain/lose and time between each track. It's enough data to make a geek lose his mind. Hit me with a PM and I may be able to hook a brutha up with some cool props"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
leroydb 0 #22 April 3, 2003 QuoteI did a BM jump with my Garmin 76S. I acquired the sats in the plane (Caravan) by sitting next to the door. I just erased the track log just prior to getting out, then shoved it down the front of the suit. The GPS said I went a lot further than I think I did. The decent speeds where pretty jacked up also. I think this is due to the pressure differentials on your stomache. I have sewn a pocket on my lower left leg of the suit. Unfortunately the WX in Colorado has been bad, so I havn't had a chance to jump it. I will try it out tomorrow if the WX is better. Have a nice day. what does pressure have to do with the GPS? G.P. SateliteLeroy ..I knew I was an unwanted baby when I saw my bath toys were a toaster and a radio... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spizzzarko 0 #23 April 4, 2003 Several of the newer Garmin GPS units are using a barometric altimeter in coordination with the satilites to give a better fix on the altitudes. It is really an automatic process. The Baro takes over when there is little or no satilite info. It may be a gee wiz thing for hikers and people driving, but I think it really helps people like us out for our uses of the device. It's actually more accurate than your wrist mount (or at least mine). Personally I think GPS use will increase amongst the birds. It's like taking a camera with you on the jump. When you get down you can show off what you did. It would be pretty borring to film a solo bird flight. The GPS can show every one that you flew 75 miles and gained altitude with your suit and even landed it!!! Once we find a suitable place to install it, maybee Birdman will sell GPS pockets as an option. Kim if you guy's use this, I want my royaltee's to be paid in Sam Adams Beer, or possibly a nice discount on a S3. I think every one can agree GPS Data is far more accurate and detailed than the Pro-Trac, just the GPS doesn't beep at you when you are about to go in. My Pro-Dytter doesn't even go off on half the flights!!! That's all I have to say about that.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LouDiamond 1 #24 April 4, 2003 Just a little info for those of you who are interested in the whole GPS thing. Check out http://www.gpsworld.com you can subscribe to their magazine for free if your really interested in learning about all the things GPS can and is being used for. BTW, an additional sat was put into service the other day bringing it to 29 birds I believe"It's just skydiving..additional drama is not required" Some people dream about flying, I live my dream SKYMONKEY PUBLISHING Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #25 April 4, 2003 Techie geeks! Scott, you are lucky you are my monkey brother. CHuckie (the antithesis of techie geek) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
