chachi 0 #26 February 2, 2007 QuoteQuoteBoth canopies are in a similar category. Yes, that was a bit of a ramble, but I will tell you that there is NO non-braced canopy that will outperform any braced canopy when flown by the same pilot. I would take that Neos anyday over the Sail Crossfire if I had a spot for one in my quiver. Just my opinion as a guy that has been doing this swooping thing for a while. _________________________________________________ you are probably correct which makes me wonder why a pilot doesn't just choose a fully braced canopy instead of going half way. _________________________________________________ Jim talks a bunch of trash about the Neos as being "failed technology", but anyone with any memory capacity left will remember him highly praising the canopy when he was actually flying it. That GLS/GLX/whatever, I mean. We are talking revisionist history here. _________________________________________________ actually i was replying to the OP that called the cross fire old technology being recycled and was simply pointing out that the NEOS is recycled and improved as well. __________________________________________________ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dharma1976 0 #27 February 2, 2007 cause some of us dont want to sacrifice openings for the performance and would prefer something in the middle that would be why, that being said my FX opens on heading every time...but I need to head up and test the 104 Neos when it gets a bit nicer out Davehttp://www.skyjunky.com CSpenceFLY - I can't believe the number of people willing to bet their life on someone else doing the right thing. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkymonkeyONE 3 #28 February 2, 2007 Quoteso a hybrid cross brace doesn't work better than an all zp one then? Apples and Oranges. I didn't compare those two at all. What I compared was a crossbraced 21-cell F-111 canopy versus a non-braced ZP 9-cell canopy. The Excallibur was F-111. What, if anything, I "presumed" was that the Neos was probably a better swooping canopy than a Sail Crossfire as it is at least a partially crossbraced main. As I have yet to see a single Sail Crossfire anywhere, I guess I will just have to go off of my first-hand impressions of the Neos which is here in the gear shop for demo. Yes, I think a Sail Crossfire (or any other HP nine-cell) would possibly fly with more authority than a ZP model. That can be garnered from the reports from the field on the difference in performance between the "stock" ZP JVX and it's Sail siblings. I foresee in the very near future at least two of the other leading canopy manufacturers offering Sail cloth as at least a hybrid options on their crossbraced mains. They really have nothing to lose, do they? Chuck Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #29 February 3, 2007 >I foresee in the very near future at least two of the other leading canopy manufacturers offering Sail cloth as at least a hybrid options on their crossbraced mains. They really have nothing to lose, do they? Not really at all! I want to see that material that was mentioned at a previous PIA symposium(is that how you spell it?) that was 4 times stronger and 4 times thinner than ZP with eqaul strenth and resistance in any direction. this is said to remove the need for reinforcing tape and further reduce packing volume. was also said to be 4 x as expensive too though"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnny1488 1 #30 February 3, 2007 Im sorry, were you at the wind tunnel testing in Germany where they were testing where canopies benefieted from bracing and where it didn't do much? And just because the prototype started a few years ago, does not mean it is still the same canopy. And I also personally remember Jim telling me the 9 cell prototype (which he alone monikered the GLX) was the fastest and most fun canopy he had ever flown. And heading stability is how Icaurs is keeping the openings so completely under control and on heading in their new canopies. Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
chachi 0 #31 February 3, 2007 just wondering what this has to do with my post. my original response was only to point out that the crossfire and the neos are both old canopies that have been upgraded. what does the glx ( a fully braced canopy) have to do with this convo? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #32 February 5, 2007 why cant I find any information about the Neos anywhere? its not mentioned on the Icarus web site????? Am I looking in the wrong place?----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinister 0 #33 February 5, 2007 Not on the site yet contact your local dealer for more details. you can also check out www.wydiproductions.com for some picsShane Murphy www.adrenalinegeeks.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #34 February 5, 2007 QuoteNot on the site yet contact your local dealer for more details. you can also check out www.wydiproductions.com for some pics which part of the site are the pics?----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
piisfish 135 #35 February 5, 2007 Quotewhy cant I find any information about the Neos anywhere? its not mentioned on the Icarus web site????? Am I looking in the wrong place?the Neos will be officially presented in Reno at PIA symposium (I was told by an Icarus rep). So it should also be online soon after that I guess.scissors beat paper, paper beat rock, rock beat wingsuit - KarlM Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
thedarkside 0 #36 February 9, 2007 QuoteNope never jumped the glsxf not really interested in it from my understandings it is just a xf2 with different trim and soma sail material the Neos is a much different canopy Arc bracing, true leading edge of the wing, heading stability controll, presurixed stabilizers it is in my opinion not even comprable they are two different beasts I have seen some amazing things being done on the Neos latley. My advice to someone who is looking at buying one of two canopies is to jump both and decide for themselvs opinions are just that opinions people all fly differently no matter how much they all think they fly alike. Eddited to add: You can only revize the same technology so much until you have to come up with something new if you are looking for something more than an xf2 get something more than an xf2 or learn to pilot what you currently fly better if you can't make the commitment to steping it up yet. This is a common problem when doing VS. People will argue that one is better then the other, not because they have tried both but they spent their time, money or are related to one of the items.(ie vendor, testing ect..) The problem is that other people will believe your biased statement. Anyway...So you are saying that this NEOS is a different beast all together when comparing to a XF2 or GLSxf, so then I guess what we really need to compare it to is the JVX, right?Keep going faster until the joy of speed overcomes the fear of death. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
frost 1 #37 February 9, 2007 Quote This is a common problem when doing VS. People will argue that one is better then the other, not because they have tried both but they spent their time, money or are related to one of the items.(ie vendor, testing ect..) The problem is that other people will believe your biased statement. You don't have to be so politically correct. You can call this for what it is - LAME. "I never read the book/watched the movie/jumped that canopy but i think it sucks." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dploi 0 #38 February 9, 2007 QuoteYou don't have to be so politically correct. You can call this for what it is - LAME. "I never read the book/watched the movie/jumped that canopy but i think it sucks."I didn't read this post, but I think it sucks. I kid! I kid! I'll do the opposite -- I never jumped a Neos, and I always buy PD, but I've been really impressed with what people have been doing with theirs. It screams. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnny1488 1 #39 February 10, 2007 Sorry for the delay, just got back from the symposium. In your post, you said why not have a fully braced canopy were the load could be better distrubited. How do you know that is better? Also the GLS was the name Jim originally called the canopy he jumed at nationals a few years back. An early protoyype of the Neos. Now he calls another canopy the GLX. How is the technology in the Neos old, anyway? What other canopies on the market have ram air stabalizers or ARC bracing? How about openings that I have not personally seen go off heading yet? The Neos is not the end all swooping machine. But it is an amazing canopy that will do some amazing things for pilots. Jump whatever canopy you like and buy whatever canopy you like. But don't say something is old technology because the R and D has been going on for a few years. The Neos has technology that no one has used before. Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #40 February 11, 2007 QuoteJump whatever canopy you like and buy whatever canopy you like. But don't say something is old technology because the R and D has been going on for a few years. The Neos has technology that no one has used before. Agreed 100% "When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #41 February 12, 2007 So im a little confused now, where in the market place does the Neos sit? Is it a HP elliptical along side the GLSxf or is it in with the xbraced VX's and JVX's??? or is it in some sort of new group that sits between the two????----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhys 0 #42 February 12, 2007 between the two and probably more comparable to an FX or Velo? I guess?"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #43 February 12, 2007 QuoteIs it a HP elliptical along side the GLSxf or is it in with the xbraced VX's and JVX's??? or is it in some sort of new group that sits between the two???? Don't quote me on this, but I believe that it's aimed at the crossbraced market, for those who don't jump every day...the weekend warrior if you will...It's "easier" to swoop than a VX, but in my opinion (300 jumps on VX, 60 on Velo, 50ish on Neos) it more closely resembles a Velocity, due to it's steep trim. It opens (again IMO) much better than a Velocity (less seeky). Effectively, I see it as a Velocity with Crossfire openings...(If you want my full thoughts do a search for Neos...)--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnny1488 1 #44 February 12, 2007 The Neos is going to be marketed towards professional skydivers. People who do a lot of jumps in a day. AFF instructors, video people, team training. Someone who wants a high performance canopy that is very fast and fun to fly, but opens perfectly and does not come with some of the baggage that other cross-braced ellipticals have. It is not limited to these jumpers by any means. I have done swoops on my 104 that have riviled my VX, but it is not meant to replace or compete with the top of the line canopies. It's more for someone who wants to go killer fast and swoop, but doesn't care if someone else goes a few feet further than them. The Neos is by far the most fun canopy I have ever jumped. The openings are unparalleled, the flight is super smoothe, and it is killer fast. Is there a direct niche for this canopy? I'm not sure yet. It's an amazing canopy that I think a lot of people are really going to like. Give one a shot and see for yourself. and... If you weren't aware, I am affiliated with Icarus. But if anyone wants to ask me ay questions, I will do my best to give you my unbiased answer. Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #45 February 13, 2007 QuoteThe Neos is going to be marketed towards professional skydivers. People who do a lot of jumps in a day. AFF instructors, video people, team training. Someone who wants a high performance canopy that is very fast and fun to fly, but opens perfectly and does not come with some of the baggage that other cross-braced ellipticals have. It is not limited to these jumpers by any means. I have done swoops on my 104 that have riviled my VX, but it is not meant to replace or compete with the top of the line canopies. It's more for someone who wants to go killer fast and swoop, but doesn't care if someone else goes a few feet further than them. The Neos is by far the most fun canopy I have ever jumped. The openings are unparalleled, the flight is super smoothe, and it is killer fast. Is there a direct niche for this canopy? I'm not sure yet. It's an amazing canopy that I think a lot of people are really going to like. Give one a shot and see for yourself. and... If you weren't aware, I am affiliated with Icarus. But if anyone wants to ask me ay questions, I will do my best to give you my unbiased answer. How does the front riser pressure compare with a jvx modded VX?----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sinister 0 #46 February 13, 2007 Not nearly as highShane Murphy www.adrenalinegeeks.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnny1488 1 #47 February 13, 2007 It is no where near as high as the VX. I have never jumped a modded VX. I would call the Neos riser pressure light. I should also say I dont like to have riser pressure too light. I did not like the front riser pressure on the Katana, for instance. It felt way too light and there was hardly any resistance. I like to know im pulling on risers. I think it makes for a better flight and better control of inputs when its not ridicilously easy to pull on risers. Thats just my opinion. The response from the risers on the Neos also lends itself to better flight also. The canopy really screams and you dont need to hang on risers to get it to do what you want. Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
br0k3n 0 #48 February 15, 2007 So will be NZ Aero be making the Neos?----------------------------------------------------------- --+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
johnny1488 1 #49 February 15, 2007 No, as of right now, the Neos is only being produced by Icarus Canopies in Spain. (CIMSA) Johnny --"This ain't no book club, we're all gonna die!" Mike Rome Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tj-land 0 #50 February 20, 2007 I have about 150 jump's on a 89 neos and 100 on a 84 neos. I like the canopie alot.It is faster than a Crossfire and carves like a vx. the opening are great.The canopie is for the every day jumper as well as a nice step befor a fully cross braced canopy. it is not a vx or a jvx.this canopy is diffrent so check it out you might like it or not. I have 12000 jump's.I have about 8000 cross brace canopies jump. I still have a lot of fun on it. TJ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
