Can't decide which DZ to choose for AFF (UK vs USA)

[stevechew 0]

Help!

I'm planning on doing my AFF sometime during March/April time but having an awful hard time deciding where to jump!

At the moment it's between Langer, Perris and Eloy. With flights to US it works out to cost little over £2k for full 25 jumps, whilst at Langer £1500 only gets you the AFF course, not the other jumps needed to get the A licence.

Safety is pretty important in my decision, I don't know what it is about UK DZ's but they just give me the shivers, I don't know what it is! My sister did a tandem jump this year from a DZ here and the cameraman was using a Betamax system. I kinda got it into my head that UK DZ's are generally using old equipment .

Is there anybody that could give any advice as to the pro's and con's of getting AFF in UK vs US, and anybody from UK who's gone over to the US to do their AFF and their experiences?

I understand that a big part of skydiving is to become part of a team, whether that be only 2 or 20. I'm worried that training in US and only returning every 6 months would leave me somewhat alienated. Personally I would rather learn over there but it's that problem that is drawing me back to UK DZ's.

Any advice on UK vs US DZ's would be greatly appreciated in helping me make my decision.

Thanks for listening.


Steve

[Belladonna 0]

I personally won't jump if I feel funny about it. I'll stay on the plane if the wind picks up, If I don't feel like jumping any given day, I won't go. I learned my lesson when I wasn't one with my decision to jump and did so anyway (AFF level 4 I believe)... it freaked me out. It was really tough to come back to the DZ.

You've gotta listen to your gut. Come out to the US.

Unfortunately, I don't have any advice on dropzones, but good call picking DZ's with tunnels.

[Broke 0]

If you are coming to the states might I suggest Z-Hills... www.skydivecity.com

Divot your source for all things Hillbilly.
Anvil Brother 84
SCR 14192

[Adriandavies 0]

I can't give you any personal experience about learning in the States but I can talk about Langar. It is an excellent DZ with a lot of very good and up to date instructors, good student gear, great aircraft and a huge landing area. They also have a can do attitude when it comes to AFF although progression later can be a bit more hit and miss and it is also a bit cliquey. Doing AFF there will help you get over the cliques though. There are also two wind tunnels close by which can be used if you do get stuck on any levels.

On the other hand you've already pointed out some of the positive points about the US.

[bogwarrior 0]

Hi Steve,

Langar is top notch, http://www.air-supply.co.uk/run by Phil Curtis, I cant reccomend him highly enough. Hes got a lot of experience teaching.

[stevechew 0]

Quote

Hi Steve,

Langar is top notch, http://www.air-supply.co.uk/run by Phil Curtis, I cant reccomend him highly enough. Hes got a lot of experience teaching.

Hmmm... He trained Sir Richard Branson 'eh?

I'll definitely save his site into my favorites. I think i'm definitely going to consider him.

Thanks!

Steve

edit: spelling

[vt1977 0]

I have jumped at all three of those DZs and you would be well looked after by excellent, experienced, safety conscious instructors at any of them.

As for your safety concerns about UK DZs - you only mention Langar as one of your options - I would say you have no reason to worry. They have excellent, safety conscious and highly experienced instructors there.

You don't need to worry about being "alienated" doing AFF abroad. There is nothing to stop you completing AFF abroad and then coming back and getting involved in the UK skydiving scene - plenty of people do so every year.

Some BPA DZs can be a little wary of students who have trained abroad so try to get at least 10 jumps done after your 8 AFF levels and as much as possible of it on video. You may have to do one check out dive with a BPA instructor but once that is done you will be in the same boat as anyone who qualified in the UK. This varies from DZ to DZ though, so check with whichever UK DZ you plan to jump at on your return what their policy is.

A compromise might be to get on a trip with a BPA instructor to the US or Spain - that way you get the benefit of cheaper jumps and better weather with the benefit of having a BPA instructor who can help when you get back to the UK.

The reasons most people do AFF abroad are price and weather. Plenty of Brits do AFF in the US and in Spain every year. Equally plenty of people do so in the UK every year.

Good luck whichever you choose!

Vicki

[gordy 0]

Any of the options you listed would be a great way to start off in skydiving....you will find skydivers generally are very safety conscience no matter where you go, and they are a friendly bunch!

I personally prefer the states, weather is better and the vibe is great out there...

As an aside I would also add Skydive Elsinore to that list, its near Perris, will cost you the same to get there etc and is the friendliest dropzone I think I have come across

Either way....enjoy!

[gus 1]

Hi Steve,

I'm a Langar AFF graduate, I haven't been to Perris but I have been to Eloy.

If you think that Langar will be your home dropzone then doing your AFF there will be to your advantage. Completing AFF marks the beginning of your learning, not the end, and having consistency in your instruction and having access to instructors that know you throughout your skydiving career is a good thing.

If you like the idea of cheaper AFF / better weather / having a holiday then you could consider going to Spain with Phil Curtis. He takes students out there and he's a good guy. And since he's at Langar alot he'll make sure you're looked after. Maybe it's maybe a good compromise.

Gus

OutpatientsOnline.com

[Dazzle 0]

I'm not current in this but some of the Langar AFF packages include jump suit alti etc I'm not sure if they are included on the £1500 set.

As others have said, there are no safety / old gear issues at Langar.

There is a BPA Starter Mag available which is aimed at people about to start jumping (it's usually given to Tandem students after they've jumped) but you should be able to get a copy - either email the mag or ring langar and ask them to send you a copy, they have a whole bunch available.

There is an article in there about UK vs Overseas. Naturally, being a BPA written article, there is a bit of bias there but also a lot of good info and answers to the sort of questions you are asking.

[Peterkn 17]

Hi Steve,
You seem to be saying that you can fly to the US and do your AFF & consols for around £2k. This seems a bit optimistic to me. Have you thought about accommodation costs and car hire or cost of transportation to and from the airport ? Also, are kit hire costs included in this ?
You should also remember that if you learn in the States then you'll need to join the BPA to be able to jump in the UK. If you're learning in the UK then this will be included in your AFF course costs. At over £100 per year it's something to consider.
I've been a regular jumper at Langar for 20+ years, and i've jumped at Eloy, Perris & Z-hills. All of these DZ's are top-notch and you should have no worries about any of them. Generally, regulation of skydiving is more strictly controlled in the UK than in the US, so standards should be higher. Having said that, all three of these US DZ's are first class and safety standards will be just as good as those at Langar.
The team-building and feeling of belonging that you refer to won't happen during your 10 day trip to a foreign DZ to do your AFF etc. That starts to happen when you stop jumping with the instructors and staff and start being one of the normal weekend punters at the DZ. For that to happen you need to be committed to spending your summer weekends sitting around at a UK DZ waiting for the cloud to clear and the wind to drop.
This is where many AFF graduates lose the plot. Skydiving isn't just about a couple of intensive trips a year (although many experienced skydivers do eventually settle down into routine where they do a couple of quality trips a year and do very little in between at UK DZ's).
The other thing that most AFF graduates don't plan for is the need to buy their own kit quite quickly after they've graduated.
When you're learning using slower progression methods you tend to get used to hanging around at the DZ, during which time you become a part of the scene there. You also tend to have a better idea about what type of kit you wnat to buy when the time comes.

If the total cost of going to the US to do your AFF, then joining the BPA and doing your check-out jump(s) is cheaper than doing AFF iin the UK then you should go for it - it'll leave you more cash to buy kit with afterwards.

Hope this helps,

Pete.

[stevechew 0]

Quote

Hi Steve,
You seem to be saying that you can fly to the US and do your AFF & consols for around £2k. This seems a bit optimistic to me. Have you thought about accommodation costs and car hire or cost of transportation to and from the airport ? Also, are kit hire costs included in this ?
You should also remember that if you learn in the States then you'll need to join the BPA to be able to jump in the UK. If you're learning in the UK then this will be included in your AFF course costs. At over £100 per year it's something to consider.
I've been a regular jumper at Langar for 20+ years, and i've jumped at Eloy, Perris & Z-hills. All of these DZ's are top-notch and you should have no worries about any of them. Generally, regulation of skydiving is more strictly controlled in the UK than in the US, so standards should be higher. Having said that, all three of these US DZ's are first class and safety standards will be just as good as those at Langar.
The team-building and feeling of belonging that you refer to won't happen during your 10 day trip to a foreign DZ to do your AFF etc. That starts to happen when you stop jumping with the instructors and staff and start being one of the normal weekend punters at the DZ. For that to happen you need to be committed to spending your summer weekends sitting around at a UK DZ waiting for the cloud to clear and the wind to drop.
This is where many AFF graduates lose the plot. Skydiving isn't just about a couple of intensive trips a year (although many experienced skydivers do eventually settle down into routine where they do a couple of quality trips a year and do very little in between at UK DZ's).
The other thing that most AFF graduates don't plan for is the need to buy their own kit quite quickly after they've graduated.
When you're learning using slower progression methods you tend to get used to hanging around at the DZ, during which time you become a part of the scene there. You also tend to have a better idea about what type of kit you wnat to buy when the time comes.

If the total cost of going to the US to do your AFF, then joining the BPA and doing your check-out jump(s) is cheaper than doing AFF iin the UK then you should go for it - it'll leave you more cash to buy kit with afterwards.

Hope this helps,

Pete.

First of all thanks to everybody who's replied. It really has given me alot of information that you just can't get from looking at DZ's websites.

Thanks

Pete.

I think alot of what you say is pretty much bang on. I didn't realise that the UK had tighter restrictions on safety than in the US.

Langer isn't my local DZ, it's just the one I considered the best for AFF in UK, It's only about 2 hrs away so not a biggie.

I don't know really, I think with what everybody has been saying about doing it in UK I feel somewhat like that's the better deal, although somebody mentioned in a PM that Spain is quite good also and that there are alot of BPS teachers out there.

I don't know, perhaps early next year I'll pop up to Langer for the day and just ask questions up there.

Everybody has given me alot to think about, there is deffinatly more choice out there than I realised.

Thanks everybody

Steve

[ncfitzge 0]

I have jumped in the UK and US. Personally I liked the US better. For some reason the places I ended up, they didn't like Americans to much. I couldn't even get them to repack their own rental rigs. They would take all the Brits first and raise their nose to me.

Also, you are paying twice as much when doing it in the UK, since the exchange rate is $1.92 to the pound. In the states you could find great training for 1k pounds, if not a lot cheaper. My original training ran around $800 (500 pounds).

The UK is also shaking with accepting brand new skydivers straight off of student status, from the US or even other UK DZs. Where ever you due it, try to get your USPA "A" and they will not give you that hard of a time.

If you are interested in doing it in Europe, I would highly recommend Paracentrum Texel, Holland. Petra is one of the AFF instructors and she rocks. Not to mention it had the best facilities I have ever been to. They usally charge around 1.1k Euro. The student landing area is 1.5x the size of a football field and all soft grass which is great. Not to mention the parties.

Just my 2 cents

Fitz

#148 Sonic Scrat
"Have you ever kissed a rabbit between the eyes?" Woodpecker pulling out his pants pockets to the waitress

[sky-pimp 0]

hi , uk against usa ?????emmmmmmm

i have to say usa , i did my aff at elsinore , under BPA standards so my licence was ok back in england .
i also went at this time of year , did'nt get a sun tan but did'nt freeze my nuts off either . the other side to going to the states is , ye it may cost a little more but its an adventure and an event that will change ya life FOREVER . just makes it that bit more exiting
if your thinking uk ya can't go far wrong by langer ....

YeHaaaaaaaaaaa

[Stephen 0]

www.skydivespaceland.com[url]

[Lawrence 0]

Steve - I would recommend skydive Aurora run by Tomo here in the UK, they also work with Vegas Extreme Skydiving, give Skydive Aurora a ring, can't say better in my opinion.

www.skydiveaurora.co.uk

Good luck

[cocker 0]

Hey Steve, if you are also considering spain, I can fully reccomend The Freefall University in Ocana, Madrid. I only just finished my AFF there and over the two weeks I was there I completed 21 jumps. The team there are absolutely fantastic and I spent most of my two weeks in absolute stiches of laughter.