elfanie 0 #1 December 1, 2003 So I jumped 7 times this weekend....and just about every one of them was me jumping with an experienced jumper (not officially a coach jump...but might as well have been)...and working on rate of descent and docking. Now...to toot my own horn so I don't sound like I'm being too hard on myself...everyone I jumped with (4 different people) said they were VERY impressed with me...that I was very very good considering my experience (I now have a total of 27 jumps to my log book) that being said..I SUCKED! (in my opinion) First 2 jumps felt good...we were good, docked, he did a 360*, so I did a 360* just for grins...we did great, I tracked away...same guy twice. I actually felt my confidence coming up. but then.. next guy I jumped with..said he'd be my "base". He's up! so I flatten out. WAIT! There he goes..he below me...so I arch....crap, he's above me....flatten...he's below me! I couldn't dock with him. I felt like HE was all over the sky and I was chasing him... I wondered for a moment if it was him, since he's a freeflyer, not an RW guy...wondered it BRIEFLY..but then.. jumped with another guy... closest I got was a high-5 on the way past that spun us facing each other as we went backwards. he's up..he's down...he's up..he's down..ok, now we're finally on the same level, only when I come in to dock I'm coming in fast so I slow down. as SOON as I slow down my glide...he's WAY below me again! At least we got a high-5. My last jump was an official "coach jump" for my last freefall requirement for my A...I needed to track, wave, and pull. *shrug* fine. So we plan out this dive...exit went smoothly...now we're facing each other. let go..he drops below me. CRAP! I arch as he flattens...we go screaming past each other. I flatten, he arches...ok, we have to stop doing this! at the very end we are on the same level and I am close enough to dock (no more than a foot and a half face to face from each other) when I litereally put both hands in front of his face and wave off...we're at breakoff altitude. Turn, track, wave, pull. WHY oh WHY am I having such a hard time with rate of descent? And are there any pointers for me? Every person I jumped with said that they were impressed that I had such good eye contact...that I always knew where they were...that no matter where they went, I was following them...it was mostly that rate of descent. What am I doing wrong? Is it just a practice thing? Is there any advice anyone can give me? The one piece of advice my coach said was that I need to be more aggressive...that I am too timid coming in because I'm afraid I'm going to hit too hard. that and to use my legs more... anyone have any good tips for the rate of descent issue? Thanks in advance. -------------------------------------------- Elfanie My Skydiving Page Fly Safe - Soft Landings Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #2 December 1, 2003 I'm about to start doing post-graduation jumps like this with friends. An experienced jumper said in case we aren't on level, the higher of us should come down to the lower, instead of both of us trying to fix the difference at the same time, because of the possibility that we'd go up and down past each other. So, is this maybe what's happening with you? If the other jumpers are experienced enough, I would doubt it unless they were messing with you to test your ability to change your fall rate while handling the other stuff. I dunno for sure because I'm not there yet. But, as a skydiver, I know my core advice is "jump more and keep trying." -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
indyz 1 #3 December 1, 2003 A fairly common problem with newer skydivers is a lack of middle ground in fall rate control. Either they are arching their hearts out and going really fast, or hugging the beachball and going really slow. They are flying at the extreme slow and fast ends of their range, but need to practice being able to fly at any speed over the whole range. A useful drill dive: Do a two way with a decent belly flyer. You both face off, undocked. He floats up and stops. You float up and stop when you are on level. He goes down, you go down. The goal is to smoothly adjust your fallrate and stop on level. Don't even bother trying to dock. You only need to be close enough to tell if you are level. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Plaedouh 0 #4 December 1, 2003 QuoteA useful drill dive: Do a two way with a decent belly flyer. You both face off, undocked. He floats up and stops. You float up and stop when you are on level. He goes down, you go down. The goal is to smoothly adjust your fallrate and stop on level. Don't even bother trying to dock. You only need to be close enough to tell if you are level. Great advice. I second that. Just be sure you have a good belly flyer and focus all on fall rate. Maybe do it for 2 jumps. When things start falling apart, stress starts in, and it reflects in body control. Relax, have fun, and have a plan ready for everything that can happen. Before you gear up, talk about how you can recover from any funnel situation. On the ride up, take 2 minutes to yourself and visualize (in real time) the next jump. And not just visualizing what happens for a perfect jump, but how you react if the exit falls apart, or if you find yourself high, or low, or in a burble as you progress through the practiced motions. Think it all through and keep fresh in your mind what you need to do. You'll find yourself better prepared, and you'll be able to start reacting faster, before small problems become big. I do this now before every jump, and train students to, everything from the exit to potential canopy malfunctions on opening, and it's really shown to help. You'll get it, don't worry. Let us know how it goes. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mad47 0 #5 December 1, 2003 It is very common problem for a person with 27 jumps to have problems like you just described, so there is no need to be frustrated. Visual contact is extremely important, but you should also develop the body awareness and to learn how to change the rate of fall with small or aggressive inputs (depending on the situation) without even thinking about it. What you doing with you arms and legs and how quickly you respond to the fall rate changes make the difference. It will all come with time. To accelerate the learning process, watch "The basic body flight theory", spend as much time as possible doing simple drill dives with GOOD people or take a tunnel camp (the best solution to any performance problem) and you will improve fast. Again, do not be frustrated, we all learn from mistakes we make. Work hard, jump a lot, keep your mind open for advice from experienced people and you will become a good skydiver soon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
newsstand 0 #6 December 2, 2003 I'm in your range when it comes to total jumps and I fall like a rock. The one thing I have learned is to make the adjustments slowly. Don't go from arch to air hugging to arch. Bring it in slowly. "Truth is tough. It will not break, like a bubble, at a touch; nay, you may kick it about all day like a football, and it will be round and full at evening." -- Oliver Wendell Holmes Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
councilman24 36 #7 December 2, 2003 Remember, with only 27 jumps you've only flown your body a max of about 30 minutes, including all of the time just learning how to fall. And maybe less if your at a Cessna DZ. How many sports can you learn in 30 minutes? I tell people that skydiving must be really easy, because you can get fairly competent in 2 hours and really good in 4-6 hours. Can you lean tennis that fast? Have some patience, try the above suggestions, concentrating on small corrections and fine adjustments. I know folks with 400 jumps that can't fall stable reliably.I'm old for my age. Terry Urban D-8631 FAA DPRE Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
elfanie 0 #8 December 2, 2003 QuoteAnd maybe less if your at a Cessna DZ. *laugh* Actually, we usually have a twin otter or porter....although all winter we're supposed to have a king air. They use the cessna occasionally...although I"ve only jumped it one time at this dropzone - and that was for my hop-n-pop. I think that doing a jump that JUST has me focuse ONLY one rate of descent with one of the coaches is a good idea. And I can definately see me 'overcorrecting' my arch/de-arch... -------------------------------------------- Elfanie My Skydiving Page Fly Safe - Soft Landings Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bch7773 0 #9 December 2, 2003 just keep working on it. like some other people said, you need to transition slower from hard arch to getting big. once you get enough jumps, it becomes really natural. don't stress out over it MB 3528, RB 1182 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DBCOOPER 1 #10 December 2, 2003 Another thing is to try to jump with the same "coach".Once you get that dialed in then its time to go with different people.Replying to: Re: Stall On Jump Run Emergency Procedure? by billvon If the plane is unrecoverable then exiting is a very very good idea. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZoneRat 0 #11 December 2, 2003 Ya know... Most yung-uns I've jumped with are too tentative with their inputs. It takes them forever to get down or up or move in for the dock. I love it when I see one being confident and decisive (not agressive, mind you..decisive) in the air. That's a good natural trait to have. When you're doing you 2-way drill dives it wouldn't hurt to say to yourself: "Start!"- "Coast!"- "Stop!" If you overshoot or undershoot coming on level, or if you come in a little hot or cold on a dock, no big deal, just adjust and try it again.“There are more things in Heaven and Earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophies.” Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gremlin 0 #12 December 3, 2003 The key to successful skydiving is to be relaxed. Try to jump more with one person so that you are not trying to impress someone new with how good you are - they will see that anyway. It sounds like you were trying a bit too hard. Just relax into the dive and remembering that if it all goes badly you can get back up and redo it you should find that you are skydiving better than before. RELAX.I'm drunk, you're drunk, lets go back to mine.... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #13 December 3, 2003 Another nice mental state is to work in terms of halves for level issues. If you are 6 feet high, shoot for 3 feet not the whole 6 feet. If you're only 12 inches off level, split the difference and only think of a 6 inch adjustment. This makes a lot more sense when you're working level adjustments of inches instead of feet (and when you have 4 people all compensating), but the thought process still applies even when learning. I think it's great that you are 'aggressive' at this stage, you'll learn faster than being tentative. But, if you plan to really crank it up, make sure you are working with someone who's pretty good. You want someone skilled enough so you don't accidently bump noggins too hard. Only doing a fallrate drill with a coach is well worth the effort and it's fun. That was a good point above too. Oh, and the tunnel or course..... ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
