Tuna-Salad 0 #1 April 2, 2009 What wing loading is considered advanced or high performance? I don't have a SIM on hand, but I remember it saying X wing loading is approaching high performance. My wing loading is 1.20 1.19 actually but I rounded up.Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nbblood 0 #2 April 2, 2009 Well, that's a loaded question that is open to a lot of subjectivity. What is high performance and at what wing loading is "high performance" achieved? There's just not a black and white answer. Also, 1.2 wingloading on a 190 is NOT the same as a 1.2 winloading on a 107. Some people believe below a particular canopy size it is considered high performance regardless of wingloading. But, that' said, I don't think 1.2 at your canopy size would be considered high performance. But that's just my opinion. Keep in mind you can easily kill yourself by screwing up on a "non-high performance" canopy, even at much lighter wingloadings than yours......or any wingloading for that matter.Blues, Nathan If you wait 'til the last minute, it'll only take a minute. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wmw999 2,167 #3 April 2, 2009 Here is Brian Germain's wingloading recommendations chart. These are pretty conservative numbers. But they are a starting point, and Brian Germain knows a whole lot more about canopy flight than I do. One of his points is that you can learn more on a canopy you're not scared of, because you can explore its range. And here is Billvon's downsizing checklist. Wendy W.There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnMitchell 14 #4 April 2, 2009 That chart hurt my eyes but I like Bill's check list. I think the USPA should put it in the SIM. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
squarecanopy 0 #5 April 3, 2009 Both are very helpful. Thanks Wendy! Just burning a hole in the sky..... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
keithbar 1 #6 April 3, 2009 but.. but.. what if your exit weight is ABOVE 265? by like 30 lbs or more??i have on occasion been accused of pulling low . My response. Naw I wasn't low I'm just such a big guy I look closer than I really am . Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
GLIDEANGLE 1 #7 April 3, 2009 Try this from the SIM http://www.uspa.org/SIM/Read/Section6/tabid/169/Default.aspx#610bThe choices we make have consequences, for us & for others! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jakee 1,274 #8 April 3, 2009 QuoteMy wing loading is 1.20 Since you're talking about going to a 1.3 loading in the other thread, shouldn't that be what you are asking about?Do you want to have an ideagasm? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
in2jumping 0 #9 April 3, 2009 QuoteWhat wing loading is considered advanced or high performance? I don't have a SIM on hand, but I remember it saying X wing loading is approaching high performance. My wing loading is 1.20 1.19 actually but I rounded up. Icarus has a good write up on wing loadings. http://www.icaruscanopies.aero/choosing.htm Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martini 0 #10 April 3, 2009 The actual dividing line is at 1.24786 so you're still OK unless you pig out then it's really dangerous. Serious. Sometimes you eat the bear.............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #11 April 3, 2009 QuoteMy wing loading is 1.20 Look dude, I read your other thread, where you were thinking about going to a 190, and you need to know that there isn't one answer to your question. You have to consider the size of the canopy, and the size of the jumper. Most people have heard the line, '1.2 on a 120 and 1.2 on a 170 are two very different things. The 120 will be quicker, and fly faster than the 170'. This is true, and it's related to the line length (shorter lines make for quicker handling) and the lower overall drag of the smaller canopy. This is why the smaller jumpers, 140 lbs and under, generally need to shoot for a lower WL when looking at gear in the begining. Otherwise you'd have new jumpers flying around under 150s and 135s. The thing is that sword cuts both ways. When you tend toward the higher end of jumper weight, say 220-230ish on up, you also have to make some special considerations. Now let's keep in mind - I don't know you, and I don't know if any of this applies to you, but - You have to consider things like how fast can you run? Be realistic if you're a bigger guy, because if you can't run as fast as your canopy, you'll need to consider the next point- How much of a fall or impact do you think you can walk away from? On a no wind day, you may be going faster than your legs, and take a fall. Or maybe the winds get funky on you, and the bottom drops out halfway through your flare. How are you going to fare in these situations? You're always going to have to keep in mind that many of the 'rules of thumb' in skydiving were made for the average sized jumper. If your size is either toward the lighter end, or the heavier end, some of the rules won't exactly apply to you, and you will have a few considerations unique to your size. I think the important thing to think about when selecting canopies is this - the main thing that will make you a better pilot is experience. The trick is to just keep jumping, and you'll get there. Even a very minor injury, like a sprained anlke or wrist can keep you grounded for weeks on end, so make choices that will keep you at 100% and keep you jumping, chipping away at the skills you need to go fast, and be safe while doing it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
nbblood 0 #12 April 3, 2009 Well said. One of the best explanations I've seen. Worth repeating.Blues, Nathan If you wait 'til the last minute, it'll only take a minute. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LyraM45 0 #13 April 3, 2009 Talk to TK, or Paul, or anybody else over at Zhills who knows you and knows what they're talking about. Seriously.... just buy them a beer at the bar and ask the exact questions you're asking on here and you'll get great answers. Are they going to be exactly what you're looking to hear?? Probably not.Apologies for the spelling (and grammar).... I got a B.S, not a B.A. :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tuna-Salad 0 #14 April 3, 2009 Other thread.. the 190 is the size canopy I want.. and it will be a while down the road before I get it...I was trying to say that I do not intend to go below a 190..... EVER Lots of good advice here. Definately the 2'nd from the bottom. I have stood up about 90% of my landings (and some of them have been fairly hard) I totally agree with what is being said, and the charts provided are a good guide.. seems I am well below those reccomendations already. I am not so concerned with downsizing as most people are, but I would like to get to a small enough canopy that I can rent demo gear for cheaper than I am renting student gear. (I have actually downsized at a much slower pace than some I have seen) Presently the largest they have to offer is a 200.. so.. I hope you understand my motivation.Millions of my potential children died on your daughters' face last night. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
davelepka 4 #15 April 3, 2009 QuoteI have stood up about 90% of my landings (and some of them have been fairly hard) This is not the way to look at it. If you are about to have a hard landing, a PLF is the way to go, not trying to stick the stand up. Standing up a landing is over-rated, and in no way a measure of skill. Being able to stand up (and walk away) after a landing is what's important. I didn't realize you're jumping at Z-hills. What you neeed to do is this, ask around and see who has a container that would fit both you and the canopies you want to demo (hint-look for guys who look like you size wise). Ask if you can borrow (or even rent) their container and reserve to demo some canopies. You'll need to provide a guarantee to replace anything you lose or damage. You'll also need a rigger to handle switching canopies (Sally Hathaway?), and you'll need to have the demo canopies in hand before taking the rig. You may have to jump during the week, when the owner of the rig is not jumping. The best way to get started might be to ask TK for help. He'll know what to do. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #16 April 3, 2009 Quote but.. but.. what if your exit weight is ABOVE 265? by like 30 lbs or more?? I feel your pain. Drop me a line. (although I doubt you have a question about wingloading). Its important to remember that 1.3:1 on a 150 isn't the same as 1.3:1 on a 190. Then there's just the canopy's design. 1.3 on a Katana 170 isn't the same as 1.3 on a Sabre2 in terms of performance. This is something we have repeated time and time again, but it needs to be continued to be repeated.--"When I die, may I be surrounded by scattered chrome and burning gasoline." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites