Running out landings & flaring technique

[Orange1 0]

Doing a search on canopies in gear & rigging, and I came across this from Jimbo:

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You shouldn't have to run out your landings on any modern, moderately loaded, parachute. It's uaually pilot error that results in run out landings.

I've done 8 jumps on non-student canopies, the last 5 on a 190 (WL ~0.88), and had to run out the last 4. I had assumed that this was because there was no wind at the time, but now the above has made me wonder about my flaring technique (which I assume is what the "pilot error" refers to above). Do I need to get someone on the DZ to watch my flaring? Or is it common to have to run out no-wind landings?

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[saucy_dee 0]

Go on a canopy course. I did a short while ago (Chris Lynch's Wingtips in the UK) and although we didn't get to jump due to bad weather that day and have our landings filmed and breifed about them I learnt so much and have not had to run off a landing at all. Just take a couple of paces at a slow jog or walk.

Doing practise flares up high and finding the "sweet point" and I now manage to kind of swoop (no I know it's not swooping as all the big boys know it ) and wash off all that forward speed so I land nice and softly on my feet and even pop up a little at the end!

Don't put off 'till tomorrow what you can do today

[Orange1 0]

I kinda included a 'slow jog' as a run-out - i.e. everything that involved taking more than one step at walking pace is there an official definiton for 'running out'?

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[ryoder 1,400]

Get someone to video your landing. Most likely causes:

- Starting flare too late. In general, large lightly loaded canopies react slower, so you need to start the flare higher than a smaller more heavily loaded canopy.

- Not finishing flare. Some people stop flaring once their feet can reach the ground. I've caught myself doing that on occasion. The result is that you only flared off the vertical speed, so it's up to your feet to deal with all the horizontal speed.

"There are only three things of value: younger women, faster airplanes, and bigger crocodiles" - Arthur Jones.

[CanuckInUSA 0]

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Or is it common to have to run out no-wind landings?

In a perfect world with perfect flares, yes one should never need to run out an landing regardless of the canopy you jump. But don't forget that we're in the middle of summer now when the density altitude (thinner air) can have an effect. We still need to do our best to finish our flares (not everyone does this) but when we're dealing with hot, humid conditions the air is thinner than normal. Add to that a little altitude to your field elevation and you've got a great way to see how density altitude effects us jumpers.

All I can say is learn to finish your flare, but don't beat yourself up too much if you've got to run out (or slide if you know the technique) your landings.

Try not to worry about the things you have no control over

[Orange1 0]

ryoder and canuck - thanks. i was told a while ago that i hadn't finished a flare (when i thought i had) and may well be repeating that mistake... i'll get someone to watch me this w/e if weather is jumpable. (it's not summer here, alas)

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.

[firstime 0]

Oh The Flare!!! my first 30 jumps where perfect, then the next 60 jumps were 1/2 very good and the other 1/2 ...... very impressive clouds of dust...... I
was told that I am fixating on my target. Thanks to ppl who care, I rec'd some video's and yup they were
right. So once you think you got your stuff together.
eg: ME ... not.. Landings are the most important part
of this sport and I have learned the hard way. Listen
and learn. Don;t watch other other jumpers and try
to imulate them, just watch and observe

[Reginald 0]

Well, “running” out a few landings is not uncommon particularly on no wind days. However, most novice jumpers try and start running WAY too soon. A proper flair will allow the canopy to burn off most of its forward speed before you ever need to put a foot down. One of the hardest things I learned about landing a canopy was patience, patience in flying the canopy until the ground hit my feet, not my feet reaching for the ground. It will come with time…pretty well once you get tired of trying to run landings out and figure out that you have to “finish” the flair at the end to burn off all the canopy’s speed you can.

"We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP

[bob.dino 0]

I've not had to run out a landing on my Spectre 190 in a long time. One or two steps is it. ryoder and CanuckInUSA seem to be providing sensible advice... and both know more about canopies than I do.

[heidihagen 0]

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kinda included a 'slow jog' as a run-out

me too. it takes 2-3 steps to come to a stop. i have been told i'm not finishing my flare... but just assumed since i was standing, i was getting it down.... but it hasn't improved. i "feel" like i'm finishing it (arms extended), but not. does running out landings ever cause injury?...like orange said, it's more like a slow jog.
p.s. thanks ry, i've made both of these mistakes!

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Get someone to video your landing. Most likely causes:

- Starting flare too late. In general, large lightly loaded canopies react slower, so you need to start the flare higher than a smaller more heavily loaded canopy.

- Not finishing flare. Some people stop flaring once their feet can reach the ground. I've caught myself doing that on occasion. The result is that you only flared off the vertical speed, so it's up to your feet to deal with all the horizontal speed.

i didn't lose my mind, i sold it on ebay. .:need a container to fit 5'4", 110 lb. cypres ready & able to fit a 170 main (or slightly smaller):.[/ce

[mnealtx 0]

I've made both those mistakes as well - I *think* what I end up doing is flare late and fast, I still get a planeout, but I'm also carrying enough forward speed that I cant bleed it all off in time. And sometimes, I don't completely finish the flare and have to run it off.

I'm definitely looking at a canopy class, if I can find one the next time I'm back...

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Candy 0]

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ryoder and canuck - thanks. i was told a while ago that i hadn't finished a flare (when i thought i had) and may well be repeating that mistake... i'll get someone to watch me this w/e if weather is jumpable.

I’ve had a problem lately with not finishing my flare, watching myself on video the other day we figure that I’m automatically preparing to run out my landings ( took a couple of hard hits on the knees earlier this year), so as I start to run my arm swings up, preventing me from doing a full flare.

I’m going to really concentrate on my landings this weekend, see if I can drop this bad habit that I’ve picked up.


Good Luck, hope you get to jump!
Candy

[Orange1 0]

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Some people stop flaring once their feet can reach the ground. I've caught myself doing that on occasion. The result is that you only flared off the vertical speed, so it's up to your feet to deal with all the horizontal speed.

ok - another of those things that you read but that only 'click' when you actually do them. I think what you are referring to here is the bit that Brian Germain calls "don't let it land"?... and watching some other guys do it properly on Saturday i think that may be what my mistake was - i.e. because my feet can reach the ground, i let them. Was hard to tell if I "fixed" it yet cos the winds were strong-ish Sat, so landing was easy but I have definitely learnt something - thanks guys

edited because even I couldn't make sense of what I wrote originally hope this is better

Skydiving: wasting fossil fuels just for fun.