Kanzlerin Merkel: Multiculturalism A Failure in Germany

[SkyDekker 1,140]

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Ok, I do agree that those figures are extremly embarassing
But I also think that the results are not typically for Germany only, but the same survey would bring similar results in other countries as well. Uneducated and stupid people exist around the globe.

To defend my fellow countrymen at least a little bit: The situation in some areas of some German cities is quite complicated. The German imigration policy was way to lax in the past. People without any qualification and without the intention to adjust at least a little bit were tolerated way to long. I am NOT talking about fugitives here, but about people who came to this country by free will. This is a the major difference, for example in comparison with the Canadian imigration rules. Some of those people are now exploting the social system, which causes a lot of anger by the people who actually pay the taxes. Honestly, I don't care if the tower next to my house belongs to a church or a mosque, but many Germans feel threatened by the fact that they could soon be a minority in "their" own country. There is a huge difference between justifieable concerns and xenophobia.

Your comment is very similar to the sentiment I hear in Toronto. I have to say I heard the same sentiment a lot stronger during the couple of weeks I spent in Holland this summer.

I agree that this is not specific to just Germany. In most of Europe there is a very distinct shift to the right, and extreme-right sentiments have become more commonplace. Or at the minimum are much more accepted in general conversation.

[billvon 2,426]

>This is a concern to me because if Muslim immigrants over-run a
>predominantly non-Muslim country, who's to say they won't start imposing
>their will over the rest of the population?

They might - just as Christians have done in predominantly Christian countries. It's the way immigration works.

[4000m 0]

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My personal view is that countries can set their own rules and laws and taxes, etc. Immigrants should have to follow the laws of the countries they enter, not the one they left.

I agree. I do not expect that a person who comes to Germay, calls himself Franz instead of Ahmed and starts eating tons of sausages (cheap prejudices ) , but I can at least expect that he or she repects the laws and does not try impose his laws and traditions on other people. For example, if schools stop serving pork completely, because it could offend muslim pupils if a German guys eats his Schnitzel, then there is something seriously wrong. Political Correctness has gone way to far.

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This is a concern to me because if Muslim immigrants over-run a predominantly non-Muslim country, who's to say they won't start imposing their will over the rest of the population?

Here is a good example of what kinda guys the average German John Doe is afraid of: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1DIA1Y136sQ

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[happythoughts 0]

when i read Merkel's comments, the content did not suggest that Islam was the problem, but a lack of effort to acquire basic language skills and work ethic. it seems that it is only commentary unless it is about Muslims.

[SkyDekker 1,140]

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when i read Merkel's comments, the content did not suggest that Islam was the problem, but a lack of effort to acquire basic language skills and work ethic. it seems that it is only commentary unless it is about Muslims.

When I read her comments, it reminded me af a sentiment that has bene getting stronger over the years. It underscored my impression that sentiments previously only expressed in more extreme right circles have become a lot more mainstream.

That reminded me that the negative attitude towards one specific religous group has been growing almost exponentially.

[masterblaster72 0]

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However, unemployment rate has dropped to 7,2%, the lowest rate in years and the economic growth for 2010 is expected to be >2%. Downturn in 2009 was -2,7%, but thats nothing compared to some years in the mid 80s, especially if you consider that the west of Germany is still the economic powerhouse of the nation and heavily subsidising the 5 new federal states (former East Germany). The reunification alone cost 1,5 Trillion Euro (=2,13 Trillion CAD).

Yet one third of german's wants to send the 7 million foreign workers home to protect german jobs.

17.2% agreed that "even today, jews have too much influence".

35.6% agreed that Germany is in serious risk of being overrun by foreigners.

58.4% agree that the practice of Islam should be restrcited, eventhough your constitution guarantees freedom of religion.

And when asked if Germany should have a fuhrer who leads with a forceful hand for the good of everyone, 13.2% supporte dthe statement outright and 15.9% agreed with some aspects of the idea.

14.9% of Germans agreed with the statement: "There is something special about jews, something peculiar, and they just don't really fit in with us.

The percentages are on the rise, compared to 2003. Stick your head in the sand all you want. I do see the similarities.

Got a source for all that? Thanks.

Also, if you're seeing right-wing tendencies these days in traditionally ultra-liberal countries like Netherlands and Sweden, you might want to take into account that there may be good reasons for those tendencies.

Be humble, ask questions, listen, learn, follow the golden rule, talk when necessary, and know when to shut the fuck up.

[christelsabine 1]

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However, unemployment rate has dropped to 7,2%, the lowest rate in years and the economic growth for 2010 is expected to be >2%. Downturn in 2009 was -2,7%, but thats nothing compared to some years in the mid 80s, especially if you consider that the west of Germany is still the economic powerhouse of the nation and heavily subsidising the 5 new federal states (former East Germany). The reunification alone cost 1,5 Trillion Euro (=2,13 Trillion CAD).

Yet one third of german's wants to send the 7 million foreign workers home to protect german jobs.

17.2% agreed that "even today, jews have too much influence".

35.6% agreed that Germany is in serious risk of being overrun by foreigners.

58.4% agree that the practice of Islam should be restrcited, eventhough your constitution guarantees freedom of religion.

And when asked if Germany should have a fuhrer who leads with a forceful hand for the good of everyone, 13.2% supporte dthe statement outright and 15.9% agreed with some aspects of the idea.

14.9% of Germans agreed with the statement: "There is something special about jews, something peculiar, and they just don't really fit in with us.

The percentages are on the rise, compared to 2003. Stick your head in the sand all you want. I do see the similarities.

You surely have some links on above figures?

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from another poster:
The German imigration policy was way to lax in the past. People without any qualification and without the intention to adjust at least a little bit were tolerated way to long.

A legal immigrant in Germany is entitled to receive social welfare - for the entire family of parents, kids, grand-kids, grand-pa, grand-ma. Unlimited.

How long are the North American countries paying such social benefits to thier immigrants?

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I do see the similarities.

You want to see. To stir things.

Do your investigations on that matter in North European countries. You'd be surprised.

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[christelsabine 1]

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However, unemployment rate has dropped to 7,2%, the lowest rate in years and the economic growth for 2010 is expected to be >2%. Downturn in 2009 was -2,7%, but thats nothing compared to some years in the mid 80s, especially if you consider that the west of Germany is still the economic powerhouse of the nation and heavily subsidising the 5 new federal states (former East Germany). The reunification alone cost 1,5 Trillion Euro (=2,13 Trillion CAD).

Yet one third of german's wants to send the 7 million foreign workers home to protect german jobs.

17.2% agreed that "even today, jews have too much influence".

35.6% agreed that Germany is in serious risk of being overrun by foreigners.

58.4% agree that the practice of Islam should be restrcited, eventhough your constitution guarantees freedom of religion.

And when asked if Germany should have a fuhrer who leads with a forceful hand for the good of everyone, 13.2% supporte dthe statement outright and 15.9% agreed with some aspects of the idea.

14.9% of Germans agreed with the statement: "There is something special about jews, something peculiar, and they just don't really fit in with us.

The percentages are on the rise, compared to 2003. Stick your head in the sand all you want. I do see the similarities.

Got a source for all that? Thanks.

Also, if you're seeing right-wing tendencies these days in traditionally ultra-liberal countries like Netherlands and Sweden, you might want to take into account that there may be good reasons for those tendencies.

I think he's referring to Sarrazins book - anyhow, he's just quoting some figures here. Out of the context, of course.

People like SkyDekker seem to forget that it's our entire society resp. our taxes which is/are bearing the burden of every unemployed member of immigrant family.

It's easier to blame, n'est-pas, Skydekker?

dudeist skydiver # 3105

[Amazon 7]

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The "other countries did it, too" excuse is highly lame.

Any comparison between Nazi Germany and modern-day Germany is lamer.

Germany admits its faults from the past and has enacted legislation against forming any hate-based political groups.

The Turkish population in Germany is the main subject of Merkel's speech. The Turkish government (which wants to become part of the EU), and the great majority of Turkish people, still deny their own genocide, and continue to antagonize Armenians to this day. That's far more intolerant than the Germany, which has allowed the Turkish community to grow in the last 50 years.

If you stand by your post and have such a valid point, then please share your parallels between Nazi Germany and today's Germany. All I see from you and quade is "They're Germans, they have a Nazi past, and therefore don't have a right to say anything of the sort" while completely ignoring what Merkel is getting at.

This is Germany's country and they have the right to speak their minds. Good on Merkel for not giving a toss what you or I think.

Uh don't forget the Turkish who have huge problems with the Kurds... when Iraq splinters into Kurdistan, ShiaStan, and SunniStan, look for Turkey to immediately invade for a good old time bloodbath.

Turkey still has a sizable minority Kurdish population as does Iran.

Turkey is also becoming further intolerant to their minority Christian population. The Orthodox church is in real trouble there with many of their schools and seminaries closed down.

[4000m 0]

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I think he's referring to Sarrazins book

It's not from Sarrzins book. It's from a study, recently done by the Friedrich-Ebert-Stiftung. You can read the whole thing here: http://library.fes.de/pdf-files/do/07504.pdf

I certainly agree that the study is quite worrying in some parts, but want to highlight that most countries in Europe would achive similar results. As mentioned earlier: If the society, in former ultraliberal countries like Denmark & Holland, performs a shift to the political right, there for sure is a underlying cause for that. Lot's of people were hesitating in the past to vocalize their concern about the devolopment of our society, because someone was quickly put into the xenophobic corner. And now there is a lot of anger in the air, that has been held back for quite some time. I also want to highlight that it is not about religion in general, but unfortunately for the muslims, they are the ones to stick out. In regards to both cultural background as well as crime statistics My personal impression is, that the people have absolutely no problem with muslims, or imigrants, in general. What causes peoples anger is the lack of repect that some people show. Among those people, the European authorities have the reputation of being wimps and that causes them to ignore laws, handle troubles within their clans and absolutely show no sign to become a supporting part of the society. Friendliness and politeness are considered to be weak chrarcteristics. I do not want to live in a society with those standards.

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[SkyDekker 1,140]

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People like SkyDekker seem to forget that it's our entire society resp. our taxes which is/are bearing the burden of every unemployed member of immigrant family.

I am well aware of how things tend to work in Europe. I lived there for 24 years, have family or friends in almost every western european country and speak a couple of the languages.

It is easy to blame the immigrants, when it is the native population who has created the problem, allowed the problem to escalate and in many cases is refusing to deal with the problem. It has allowed to fester fo so long, that soon the extreme right wing parties will gain a lot more control throughout Europe. I foresee problems associated with that.

[SkyDekker 1,140]

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I certainly agree that the study is quite worrying in some parts, but want to highlight that most countries in Europe would achive similar results. As mentioned earlier: If the society, in former ultraliberal countries like Denmark & Holland, performs a shift to the political right, there for sure is a underlying cause for that. Lot's of people were hesitating in the past to vocalize their concern about the devolopment of our society, because someone was quickly put into the xenophobic corner. And now there is a lot of anger in the air, that has been held back for quite some time

I very much agree with this. And believe this anger will further build and eventually escalate. I also believe this anger and hatred will be institutionalized and will be systemic.