Almost there.....

[1969912 0]

I just wanted to quote a comment I saw on another forum:

"Let me get this straight......we're trying to pass a health care plan written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it but exempts themselves from it, to be signed by a president that also hasn't read it and who smokes, with funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese, and financed by a country that's broke. What could possibly go wrong????"

"Once we got to the point where twenty/something's needed a place on the corner that changed the oil in their cars we were doomed . . ."
-NickDG

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

I just wanted to quote a comment I saw on another forum:

"Let me get this straight......we're trying to pass a health care plan written by a committee whose chairman says he doesn't understand it, passed by a Congress that hasn't read it but exempts themselves from it, to be signed by a president that also hasn't read it and who smokes, with funding administered by a treasury chief who didn't pay his taxes, all to be overseen by a surgeon general who is obese, and financed by a country that's broke. What could possibly go wrong????"

Maybe he listened to your hero, Reagan too much.... http://www.ontheissues.org/2004/Dick_Cheney_Budget_+_Economy.htm

Cheney too.... Former Treasury Secretary Paul O'Neill was told "deficits don't matter" when he warned of a looming fiscal crisis.
O'Neill, fired in a shakeup of Bush's economic team in December 2002, raised objections to a new round of tax cuts and said the president balked at his more aggressive plan to combat corporate crime after a string of accounting scandals because of opposition from "the corporate crowd," a key constituency.

O'Neill said he tried to warn Vice President Dick Cheney that growing budget deficits-expected to top $500 billion this fiscal year alone-posed a threat to the economy. Cheney cut him off. "You know, Paul, Reagan proved deficits don't matter," he said, according to excerpts. Cheney continued: "We won the midterms (congressional elections). This is our due." A month later, Cheney told the Treasury secretary he was fired.



And you have an issue with spending and wonder why we're broke? Your welcome, it's on me.

[billvon 2,476]

>And you have an issue with spending and wonder why we're broke?

We're broke because we're spending too much money. Bush spent far too much and now Obama is doing the same. The solution to this problem is not to condemn the guy who spent too much while supporting someone else doing exactly the same thing - the solution is to stop spending so much no matter what letter the guy has after his name. (And to stop defending people who _do_ spend so much.)

[rhaig 0]

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

--
Rob

[turtlespeed 212]

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Not in political discussions with Lucky, you are absolutely correct.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

We're broke because we're spending too much money.

And the other part; taxes. Tell me why the debt fell or if it rose, it was very minor until fascist Ronnie took the top brkt out of the 70% + range and dropped em to GD levels.

It's spending and taxation, a culmination of the two.

Quote

Bush spent far too much and now Obama is doing the same.

Any spending Obama has done so far is for recovery for the Great Recession and the war. I don't like Obama keeping us in Bush's wars; I don't get it.

Quote

The solution to this problem is not to condemn the guy who spent too much while supporting someone else doing exactly the same thing - the solution is to stop spending so much no matter what letter the guy has after his name. (And to stop defending people who _do_ spend so much.)

This country has had the top brkt at 70% to 94% since just after Hoover pumped em to 63% in 1932. Then FDR ran em up to 94% during the peak of teh war and even Truman and Eisenhower kept em almost that high. The that fascist pig came along and in 3 cuts dropped em to 28% and all of the sudden we created "just add water" millionaires overnight. The price we pay for that is massive debt. We have spent thru our asses since WWII, never really stopped, esp on the military, the only independent variable is the tax rate. Hell, even Clinton raised them to a paultry 40% and that stopped the bleeding, as he also cut spending. So the real answer is to cut spending and to raise taxes to top brkt 50-60%. Together we can cut teh debt and work with surplusses.

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Tax increases are the real answer, it worked during and since WWII, then your hero slashed them to pre-GD levels and we scratch our heads????

[rhaig 0]

Quote

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Tax increases are the real answer, it worked during and since WWII, then your hero slashed them to pre-GD levels and we scratch our heads????

you pretend to know who my heroes are.


And tax increases are coming. We all knew (or should have known) that when Hopey McChange-alot got elected.

--
Rob

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Not in political discussions with Lucky, you are absolutely correct.

Rhetoric and no substance. I've posted plenty of substance, address some or just move aloooong.

[turtlespeed 212]

Quote

Quote

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Not in political discussions with Lucky, you are absolutely correct.

Rhetoric and no substance. I've posted plenty of substance, address some or just move aloooong.

`

Your POV is amusing enough, but I don't feel like feeding the troll.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[billvon 2,476]

>It's spending and taxation, a culmination of the two.

I think you meant "combination." And no, it's not a combination of the two; we're spending too much no matter what the level of taxation.

>The that fascist pig came along and in 3 cuts dropped em to 28% and
>all of the sudden we created "just add water" millionaires overnight.

Good! A guy making a million a year at 28% pays a lot more in taxes than a guy making $100,000 at 94% a year. We need more of those instant millionaires. Add more water.

> So the real answer is to cut spending and to raise taxes to top brkt
>50-60%.

Cut spending - OK. Raise taxes - provided we do that SECOND, I'm OK with that too. I'd be even happier with a balanced budget requirement with mandatory reporting requirements, so that everyone can see that "hmm, start that war/pass that bill/build that highway and my own taxes go up by $200 a year. Not sure I like it that much any more."

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Not in political discussions with Lucky, you are absolutely correct.

Rhetoric and no substance. I've posted plenty of substance, address some or just move aloooong.

`

Your POV is amusing enough, but I don't feel like feeding the troll.

AKA: You have nothing to say; why not just admit it?

BTW, no feed troll - then stay out of kitchen.

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

I think you meant "combination." And no, it's not a combination of the two; we're spending too much no matter what the level of taxation.

True, combo.

Yes, we're spending too much and not taxing enough; we're both right. Taxes are virtually as low as they have been since WWI (yes one) and we have such an expansive government need, so the top tax rate needs to be no less than 50%.

Quote

Good! A guy making a million a year at 28% pays a lot more in taxes than a guy making $100,000 at 94% a year. We need more of those instant millionaires. Add more water.

The rub is that so many of those millionaires find a way to mitigate that AGI very low and defer it or avoid it. Whatever the science, the application is that the debt didn't soar until Reagan in 81, so guess what happened? WHat is the independent variable? Actually there were 2 (which is not scientifically desireable), but there were bigger tax cuits than there were spending increases.

Quote

Cut spending - OK. Raise taxes - provided we do that SECOND, I'm OK with that too.

Why, Hoover raised taxes 260% while not cutting spending and that worked. SECOND is a deferal for, "we will just hope the forget." Also, Clinton did both simultaneously and it worked.

Quote

I'd be even happier with a balanced budget requirement with mandatory reporting requirements, so that everyone can see that "hmm, start that war/pass that bill/build that highway and my own taxes go up by $200 a year. Not sure I like it that much any more."

Well sure, but there is no direct connecction between taxation and spending other than at the deficit. WHat I'm saying is that these are seperate legislative actions, so what you're saying is a bit utopian. Perhaps if we had a True Democracy that would work. But reality isn't that calculated or pretty, so let's just do what Clinton did and cut spending/raise taxes and watch things repair.

[turtlespeed 212]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Not in political discussions with Lucky, you are absolutely correct.

Rhetoric and no substance. I've posted plenty of substance, address some or just move aloooong.

`

Your POV is amusing enough, but I don't feel like feeding the troll.

AKA: You have nothing to say; why not just admit it?

BTW, no feed troll - then stay out of kitchen.

Ok - I have nothing of substance to say to you.

It would be different if you would try to see others' POV.

I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama
BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun

[Lucky... 0]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

no no no bill... you should know that common sense and reason has no place here.

Not in political discussions with Lucky, you are absolutely correct.

Rhetoric and no substance. I've posted plenty of substance, address some or just move aloooong.

`

Your POV is amusing enough, but I don't feel like feeding the troll.

AKA: You have nothing to say; why not just admit it?

BTW, no feed troll - then stay out of kitchen.

Ok - I have nothing of substance to say to you.

It would be different if you would try to see others' POV.

I won't see it your way just cause ur a fellow skydiver, you have to convince me with independent data, not opion, your diddy, your circle of friend's beliefs. See all the data I provide with my argument? Try it, but how can you provide any data, the R's have run shit thru the roof under the giuse of, "tax cuts my friends" will fix everything, when clearly as taxes are cut, the debt goes higher, taxes raised, the debt balances and sometimes falls.

[kallend 1,683]

Quote

>And you have an issue with spending and wonder why we're broke?

We're broke because we're spending too much money. Bush spent far too much and now Obama is doing the same. The solution to this problem is not to condemn the guy who spent too much while supporting someone else doing exactly the same thing - the solution is to stop spending so much no matter what letter the guy has after his name. (And to stop defending people who _do_ spend so much.)

If you take a look at the trade deficit, you will see that the American people are spending too much. The govt. simply reflects the people.

But with respect to the current recession, both Bush and Obama have thrown money at it and McCain likely would have done the same had he been elected. What would YOU have done differently?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[Anvilbrother 0]

Why are we always talking about RAISE/LOWER taxes....Anyone ever though of not spending it on BULLSHIT programs, travel, and toys!!!!!!

Without raising a single cent more I GUARANTEE we could have a balanced budget every year if the sorry ass politicians of all kinds stop cowering to unions, interest groups, and CEO's.

Stop the handouts to sorry ass people that don't work. They sleep in all day, get up take your handouts, go steal from those of us that work at night, then complain that everyone else is keeping them down.

There ARE jobs out there, just because it wont make you rich overnight, or makes you sweat they run full speed the other way away from them. If was out of work, and the only job was to dig ditches, my ass would be sporting boots, gloves, and a shovel!

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,

[kallend 1,683]

Quote

Why are we always talking about RAISE/LOWER taxes....Anyone ever though of not spending it on BULLSHIT programs, travel, and toys!!!!!!

Without raising a single cent more I GUARANTEE we could have a balanced budget every year if the sorry ass politicians of all kinds stop cowering to unions, interest groups, and CEO's.

Stop the handouts to sorry ass people that don't work. They sleep in all day, get up take your handouts, go steal from those of us that work at night, then complain that everyone else is keeping them down.

There ARE jobs out there, just because it wont make you rich overnight, or makes you sweat they run full speed the other way away from them. If was out of work, and the only job was to dig ditches, my ass would be sporting boots, gloves, and a shovel!

Tell us, who's looking to hire 10 million ditch diggers?

...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[mnealtx 0]

Quote

Quote

Why are we always talking about RAISE/LOWER taxes....Anyone ever though of not spending it on BULLSHIT programs, travel, and toys!!!!!!

Without raising a single cent more I GUARANTEE we could have a balanced budget every year if the sorry ass politicians of all kinds stop cowering to unions, interest groups, and CEO's.

Stop the handouts to sorry ass people that don't work. They sleep in all day, get up take your handouts, go steal from those of us that work at night, then complain that everyone else is keeping them down.

There ARE jobs out there, just because it wont make you rich overnight, or makes you sweat they run full speed the other way away from them. If was out of work, and the only job was to dig ditches, my ass would be sporting boots, gloves, and a shovel!

Tell us, who's looking to hire 10 million ditch diggers?

Obama keeps mentioning 'shovel-ready' jobs - guess it'll be at the local graveyard after that half-trillion dollar Medicare cut phases in and the doc quit treating them.

Mike
I love you, Shannon and Jim.
POPS 9708 , SCR 14706

[Anvilbrother 0]

Yes that's right take my words exactly as they were written.... Blue collar jobs! Like the ones the illegal immigrants are doing. Those jobs used to be done by the people I am talking about. Now they sit on their duff and let us raise them like our bastard kids.

Ooh and while were on the subject go ahead an legalize all 12 million of them I know it's the next thing on your golden boys agenda. That's right let's let them stay here legally, jam up your new healthcare situation not pay taxes because of some special deal to get some dem elected and send all the money back to family members in MEXICO!!

Why should I have to pay for everyone elses healthcare, am not legally eligible to use it because of higher income and then have the result of the insurance I pay for out of pocket go up even more. The bend over factor doubles up again! Don't think I'm just against dems. I hate any politician that makes up stupid legislation that takes more money from my pocket and hands it down to the teet suckers!

Postes r made from an iPad or iPhone. Spelling and gramhair mistakes guaranteed move along,