Why? What is the Goal? What will he say?

[idrankwhat 0]

Quote

Would the speach cause the kids to ask "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so mean they dont want everyone to have health care?" Or, "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so greedy they will polute the planet for money?"

That last one is a good question.

[rushmc 18]

Quote

Yeah, I read the agenda. What do you think it should say - "encourage children to say that the speaker is a big bozo?"

It's asking for critical thinking at a level that's appropriate for children. That's what teachers are supposed to be teaching -- how else to children learn how to deal with new situations if they don't think about them?

No two situations are ever exactly alike. If we teach children only to react in rote manners, then they'll either react inappropriately, or fail to see the differences in situations, events, or people. Both are bad things, in my opinion.

Wendy P.

IF, what you post happens then yes, you are correct.

I guess the proof will be in the context of what is said itself. And, IF it is what you say, then I will have not problem with it. At this point however, he has given no reason to trust him based on what he says to whom and when

marc

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[wmw999 2,163]

There will still be people who will read into it criticism of voucher programs (God forbid he says something about public schools) or religious schooling (same God forbid) or home schooling (likewise) or anything else they want to be pissed off about.

There are people out there who would be pissed even if the full text were made public ahead of time, because the delivery might change.

Wendy P.

There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)

[Ion01 1]

Quote

No two situations are ever exactly alike. If we teach children only to react in rote manners, then they'll either react inappropriately, or fail to see the differences in situations, events, or people. Both are bad things, in my opinion.

That is exactly what the agenda is asking them to do: to react in a particular manner....that manner is to support and help the president. There is not "critical thinking" involved in that agenda! Besides, why is the president supposed to have any involvement or say in our childrens education? Among other things, the tenth amendment makes it clear the federal government should have no involvement. Why must he address them instead of the parents?
This is the direction he is going as made clear by the agenda.
http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2009/01/20/i-pledge-to-be-a-servant-to-our-president/

Once again why is the president asking our children to help the president? The president is supposed to serve us. The people we elected are civil servents!!!!! They are to serve us not them! Why is he asking them to help him not to help others! Why is it always about him! Why are they pledging to the president not the country! Why are they going to serve the president when the president should be serving them!
I beleive everyone here knows the answers but few are willing to accept it.
These are the same steps that totalitarian leaders in countries such as cuba took! But lets remember what this administration thinks about cuba and its oppressor.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BvenExgMoJc

Yea, go down there and see what they have going.....go down there while they are trying to come here by floating cars across the ocean!!!!!!

And if you don't know anything about what these czars believe such as Van Jones or John Holdren then same on you! These government was established by the people and for the people and according to the constitution we as the people are supposed to have the power, not them! That means if these things are happening not because of them but because of the individuals that make up this country and are not educating themselves, allowing the government to feed them and thier children whatever they want, and continue to allow the government to ignore the constitutions and stomp all over our rights. There is no excuse for not knowing these things because they have said themselves exactly what they want to do and what they believe and when people continue to ignore them and make excuses for them like "its asking for critical thinking" then its the individuals in the country who have failed because we have the power of the truth available to us and we have the power to stop it.

BTW-Critical thinking would be like how does what he have to say fit with the constitution? or the bill of rights? or the declaration of independance? How does what he have to say fit within the framework of freedom and liberty that this nation was founded on? If what he has to say is good then these questions are fine and if what he has to say is bad then these questions bring that out. What is he asking me to do for him means he can say anything and ask them to do anything and the students just restate what obama had to say....no thinking invovled. Then they ask how can they help obama.... not thought as to whether or not is right, wrong, or otherwise.......and thats the point of the agneda!

[idrankwhat 0]

Quote

That is exactly what the agenda is asking them to do:....

Did you read any of the links I posted from the dept. of education regarding the content of the message and the suggested participation exercises?


Menu of Classroom Activities
President Obama’s Address to Students Across America
(PreK-6)

Produced by Teaching Ambassador Fellows, U.S. Department of Education

September 8, 2009

Before the Speech
· Teachers can build background knowledge about the President of the United States and his speech by reading books about presidents and Barack Obama. Teachers could motivate students by asking the following questions:
Who is the President of the United States?
What do you think it takes to be president?
To whom do you think the president is going to be speaking?
Why do you think he wants to speak to you?
What do you think he will say to you?
· Teachers can ask students to imagine that they are delivering a speech to all of the students in the United States.
If you were the president, what would you tell students?
What can students do to help in our schools?
Teachers can chart ideas about what students would say.
· Why is it important that we listen to the president and other elected officials, like the mayor, senators, members of congress, or the governor? Why is what they say important?
During the Speech
· As the president speaks, teachers can ask students to write down key ideas or phrases that are important or personally meaningful. Students could use a note-taking graphic organizer such as a “cluster web;” or, students could record their thoughts on sticky notes. Younger children could draw pictures and write as appropriate. As students listen to the speech, they could think about the following:
What is the president trying to tell me?
What is the president asking me to do?
What new ideas and actions is the president challenging me to think about?
· Students could record important parts of the speech where the president is asking them to do something. Students might think about the following:
What specific job is he asking me to do?
Is he asking anything of anyone else?
Teachers? Principals? Parents? The American people?
· Students could record questions they have while he is speaking and then discuss them after the speech. Younger children may need to dictate their questions.

After the Speech
· Teachers could ask students to share the ideas they recorded, exchange sticky notes, or place notes on a butcher-paper poster in the classroom to discuss main ideas from the speech, such as citizenship, personal responsibility, and civic duty.
· Students could discuss their responses to the following questions:
What do you think the president wants us to do?
Does the speech make you want to do anything?
Are we able to do what President Obama is asking of us?
What would you like to tell the president?

Extension of the Speech

Teachers could extend learning by having students:
· Create posters of their goals. Posters could be formatted in quadrants, puzzle pieces, or trails marked with the following labels: personal, academic, community, and country. Each area could be labeled with three steps for achieving goals in that area. It might make sense to focus first on personal and academic goals so that community and country goals can be more readily created.
· Write letters to themselves about how they can achieve their short-term and long-term education goals. Teachers would collect and redistribute these letters at an appropriate later date to enable students to monitor their progress.
· Write goals on colored index cards or precut designs to post around the classroom.
· Interview one another and share goals with the class to create a supportive community.
· Participate in school-wide incentive programs or contests for those students who achieve their goals.
· Write about their goals in a variety of genres, such as poems, songs, and personal essays.
· Create artistic projects based on the themes of their goals.
· Graph individual progress toward goals.


Where's the problem?


Menu of Classroom Activities
President Obama’s Address to Students Across America
(Grades 7-12)

Produced by Teaching Ambassador Fellows, U.S. Department of Education
September 8, 2009

Before the Speech
· Conduct a “quick write” or “think/pair/share” activity with students. (In the latter activity, students spend a few minutes thinking and writing about the question. Next, each student is paired with another student to discuss. Finally, the students share their ideas with the class as a whole). Teachers may choose to ask the following questions:
What ideas do we associate with the words “responsibility,” “persistence,” and “goals?”
How would we define each term?
Teachers then may choose to create a web diagram of student ideas for each of the words.
· Have students participate in a “quick write” or brainstorming activity. Teachers may ask students:
What are your strengths?
What do you think makes you successful as a student and as a person?
· Teachers may engage students in short readings. Teachers may post in large print around the classroom notable quotes excerpted from President Obama’s speeches on education. Teachers might ask students to think alone, compare ideas with a partner, or share their thoughts with the class. Teachers could ask students to think about the following:
What are our interpretations of these excerpts?
Based on these excerpts, what can we infer that the president believes is important in order to be educationally successful?
· Create a “concept web.” Teachers may ask students to think of the following:
Why does President Obama want to speak with us today? How will he inspire us?
How will he challenge us?
What might he say?
Do you remember any other historic moments when the president spoke to the nation?
What was the impact?
After brainstorming answers to these questions, students could create a “cause-and-effect” graphic organizer.

During the Speech
· Teachers might conduct a “listening with purpose” exercise based on the following ideas: personal responsibility, goals, and persistence. Teachers might ask pairs of students to create a word bank at the top of a notes page that has been divided into two columns. On the right-hand side, students could take notes (trying to capture direct quotations or main ideas) while President Obama talks about personal responsibility, goals, or persistence. At the end of the speech, students could write the corresponding terms from the word bank in the left-hand column, to increase retention and deepen their understanding of an important aspect of the speech.
· Teachers might conduct a “listening with purpose” exercise based on the themes of inspiration and challenges. Using a similar double-column notes page as the one described above, teachers could focus students on quotations that either propose a specific challenge to them or that inspire them in some meaningful way. Students could do this activity individually, in pairs, or in groups.

Transition/Quick Review
· Teachers could ask students to look over their notes and collaborate in pairs or small groups. Teachers might circulate and ask students questions, such as:
What more could we add to our notes?
What are the most important words in the speech?
What title would you give the speech?
What is the thesis of the speech?

After the Speech

Guided Discussion:
· What resonated with you from President Obama’s speech? What lines or phrases do you remember?
· Whom is President Obama addressing? How do you know? Describe his audience.
· We heard President Obama mention the importance of personal responsibility. In your life, who exemplifies this kind of responsibility? How? Give examples.
· How are the individuals in this classroom similar? How is each student different?
· Suppose President Obama were to give another speech about being educationally successful. To whom would he speak? Why? What would the president say?
· What are the three most important words in the speech? Rank them.
· Is President Obama inspiring you to do anything? Is he challenging you to do anything?
· What do you believe are the challenges of your generation?
· How can you be a part of addressing these challenges?

Video Project:
· Teachers could encourage students to participate in the U.S. Department of Education’s “I Am What I Learn” video contest. On September 8, the Department of Education will invite students age 13 and older to submit a video no longer than two minutes in length, explaining why education is important and how education will help them achieve their dreams. Teachers are welcome to incorporate the same or a similar video project into a classroom assignment. More details will be released via www.ed.gov.

Transition/Quick Review
· Teachers could introduce goal-setting activities in the following way to make the most of extension activities:

“When you set a goal, you envision a target that you are going to reach over time. Goals are best when they are “Challenging,” “Attainable,” and “Needed” (CAN). For example, a good goal might be: ‘I want to boost my average grade by one letter grade this year so I can show colleges that I am prepared.’ But, every good goal also needs steps that guide the way. These steps keep you on track toward achieving your goal. For example, my first step might be improving in all of my subjects by one letter grade. My second step might be completing 100-percent of my homework in all of my classes during the first week of school. My third step might be taking an extra hour to study for all of my tests during each marking period. My fourth step might be attending a tutoring session or getting an adult to help me whenever I do not understand something. My last step might be the most important: asking an adult in my life to check on me often to make sure that I am completing each of my steps. Your steps should add up to your goal. If they don’t, that’s okay; we fix them until they do!

Let’s hear another example of an academic goal for the year and decide what steps would help to achieve that goal…

Now I want you to write your personal academic goal for this year and the steps that you will take to achieve it. We can revise our steps each marking period to make sure we are on track.”

Extension of the Speech

Teachers could extend learning by having students:
· Create decorated goals and steps on material that is the size of an index card. The index cards could be formatted as an inviting graphic organizer with a space for the goal at the top and several steps in the remaining space. Cards could be hung in the classroom to create a culture of goal setting, persistence, and success, and for the purpose of periodic review. (See the “Example Handout” section.)
· Create posters of their goals. Posters could be formatted in quadrants, puzzle pieces, or trails marked as steps. These also could be hung around the room, to be reviewed periodically and to create a classroom culture of goal setting and for the purpose of periodic review.
· Interview and share their goals with one another and the class, establishing community support for their goals.
· Create incentives or contests for achieving their personal goals.
· Write about goals and the steps to achieve them in a variety of genres such as poems, songs, or personal essays.
· Create artistic representations of goals and the steps to achieve them.


Where's the problem? You ARE what you learn.

[rushmc 18]

Quote

There will still be people who will read into it criticism of voucher programs (God forbid he says something about public schools) or religious schooling (same God forbid) or home schooling (likewise) or anything else they want to be pissed off about.

There are people out there who would be pissed even if the full text were made public ahead of time, because the delivery might change.

Wendy P.

the extreems and the outliers can always be used as an excuse Wendy.

Again, what the message is and how it is presented will form the context of the debate. The WH has already removed much of the info originally posted. Why?

You can excuse and trust this bunch if you wish. This admin and congress (both sides) have given us no reason to trust them with anything. I sure as hell would not start trusting them with my kids.

On a good note. Many schools are refusing to take part. That is the choice of the local boards. As it should be

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

Quote

Quote

That is exactly what the agenda is asking them to do:....

Did you read any of the links I posted from the dept. of education regarding the content of the message and the suggested participation exercises?


Menu of Classroom Activities
President Obama’s Address to Students Across America
(PreK-6)

Produced by Teaching Ambassador Fellows, U.S. Department of Education

September 8, 2009

Before the Speech
· Teachers can build background knowledge about the President of the United States and his speech by reading books about presidents and Barack Obama. Teachers could motivate students by asking the following questions:
Who is the President of the United States?
What do you think it takes to be president?
To whom do you think the president is going to be speaking?
Why do you think he wants to speak to you?
What do you think he will say to you?
· Teachers can ask students to imagine that they are delivering a speech to all of the students in the United States.
If you were the president, what would you tell students?
What can students do to help in our schools?
Teachers can chart ideas about what students would say.
· Why is it important that we listen to the president and other elected officials, like the mayor, senators, members of congress, or the governor? Why is what they say important?
During the Speech
· As the president speaks, teachers can ask students to write down key ideas or phrases that are important or personally meaningful. Students could use a note-taking graphic organizer such as a “cluster web;” or, students could record their thoughts on sticky notes. Younger children could draw pictures and write as appropriate. As students listen to the speech, they could think about the following:
What is the president trying to tell me?
What is the president asking me to do?
What new ideas and actions is the president challenging me to think about?
· Students could record important parts of the speech where the president is asking them to do something. Students might think about the following:
What specific job is he asking me to do?
Is he asking anything of anyone else?
Teachers? Principals? Parents? The American people?
· Students could record questions they have while he is speaking and then discuss them after the speech. Younger children may need to dictate their questions.

After the Speech
· Teachers could ask students to share the ideas they recorded, exchange sticky notes, or place notes on a butcher-paper poster in the classroom to discuss main ideas from the speech, such as citizenship, personal responsibility, and civic duty.
· Students could discuss their responses to the following questions:
What do you think the president wants us to do?
Does the speech make you want to do anything?
Are we able to do what President Obama is asking of us?
What would you like to tell the president?

Extension of the Speech

Teachers could extend learning by having students:
· Create posters of their goals. Posters could be formatted in quadrants, puzzle pieces, or trails marked with the following labels: personal, academic, community, and country. Each area could be labeled with three steps for achieving goals in that area. It might make sense to focus first on personal and academic goals so that community and country goals can be more readily created.
· Write letters to themselves about how they can achieve their short-term and long-term education goals. Teachers would collect and redistribute these letters at an appropriate later date to enable students to monitor their progress.
· Write goals on colored index cards or precut designs to post around the classroom.
· Interview one another and share goals with the class to create a supportive community.
· Participate in school-wide incentive programs or contests for those students who achieve their goals.
· Write about their goals in a variety of genres, such as poems, songs, and personal essays.
· Create artistic projects based on the themes of their goals.
· Graph individual progress toward goals.


Where's the problem?


Menu of Classroom Activities
President Obama’s Address to Students Across America
(Grades 7-12)

Produced by Teaching Ambassador Fellows, U.S. Department of Education
September 8, 2009

Before the Speech
· Conduct a “quick write” or “think/pair/share” activity with students. (In the latter activity, students spend a few minutes thinking and writing about the question. Next, each student is paired with another student to discuss. Finally, the students share their ideas with the class as a whole). Teachers may choose to ask the following questions:
What ideas do we associate with the words “responsibility,” “persistence,” and “goals?”
How would we define each term?
Teachers then may choose to create a web diagram of student ideas for each of the words.
· Have students participate in a “quick write” or brainstorming activity. Teachers may ask students:
What are your strengths?
What do you think makes you successful as a student and as a person?
· Teachers may engage students in short readings. Teachers may post in large print around the classroom notable quotes excerpted from President Obama’s speeches on education. Teachers might ask students to think alone, compare ideas with a partner, or share their thoughts with the class. Teachers could ask students to think about the following:
What are our interpretations of these excerpts?
Based on these excerpts, what can we infer that the president believes is important in order to be educationally successful?
· Create a “concept web.” Teachers may ask students to think of the following:
Why does President Obama want to speak with us today? How will he inspire us?
How will he challenge us?
What might he say?
Do you remember any other historic moments when the president spoke to the nation?
What was the impact?
After brainstorming answers to these questions, students could create a “cause-and-effect” graphic organizer.

During the Speech
· Teachers might conduct a “listening with purpose” exercise based on the following ideas: personal responsibility, goals, and persistence. Teachers might ask pairs of students to create a word bank at the top of a notes page that has been divided into two columns. On the right-hand side, students could take notes (trying to capture direct quotations or main ideas) while President Obama talks about personal responsibility, goals, or persistence. At the end of the speech, students could write the corresponding terms from the word bank in the left-hand column, to increase retention and deepen their understanding of an important aspect of the speech.
· Teachers might conduct a “listening with purpose” exercise based on the themes of inspiration and challenges. Using a similar double-column notes page as the one described above, teachers could focus students on quotations that either propose a specific challenge to them or that inspire them in some meaningful way. Students could do this activity individually, in pairs, or in groups.

Transition/Quick Review
· Teachers could ask students to look over their notes and collaborate in pairs or small groups. Teachers might circulate and ask students questions, such as:
What more could we add to our notes?
What are the most important words in the speech?
What title would you give the speech?
What is the thesis of the speech?

After the Speech

Guided Discussion:
· What resonated with you from President Obama’s speech? What lines or phrases do you remember?
· Whom is President Obama addressing? How do you know? Describe his audience.
· We heard President Obama mention the importance of personal responsibility. In your life, who exemplifies this kind of responsibility? How? Give examples.
· How are the individuals in this classroom similar? How is each student different?
· Suppose President Obama were to give another speech about being educationally successful. To whom would he speak? Why? What would the president say?
· What are the three most important words in the speech? Rank them.
· Is President Obama inspiring you to do anything? Is he challenging you to do anything?
· What do you believe are the challenges of your generation?
· How can you be a part of addressing these challenges?

Video Project:
· Teachers could encourage students to participate in the U.S. Department of Education’s “I Am What I Learn” video contest. On September 8, the Department of Education will invite students age 13 and older to submit a video no longer than two minutes in length, explaining why education is important and how education will help them achieve their dreams. Teachers are welcome to incorporate the same or a similar video project into a classroom assignment. More details will be released via www.ed.gov.

Transition/Quick Review
· Teachers could introduce goal-setting activities in the following way to make the most of extension activities:

“When you set a goal, you envision a target that you are going to reach over time. Goals are best when they are “Challenging,” “Attainable,” and “Needed” (CAN). For example, a good goal might be: ‘I want to boost my average grade by one letter grade this year so I can show colleges that I am prepared.’ But, every good goal also needs steps that guide the way. These steps keep you on track toward achieving your goal. For example, my first step might be improving in all of my subjects by one letter grade. My second step might be completing 100-percent of my homework in all of my classes during the first week of school. My third step might be taking an extra hour to study for all of my tests during each marking period. My fourth step might be attending a tutoring session or getting an adult to help me whenever I do not understand something. My last step might be the most important: asking an adult in my life to check on me often to make sure that I am completing each of my steps. Your steps should add up to your goal. If they don’t, that’s okay; we fix them until they do!

Let’s hear another example of an academic goal for the year and decide what steps would help to achieve that goal…

Now I want you to write your personal academic goal for this year and the steps that you will take to achieve it. We can revise our steps each marking period to make sure we are on track.”

Extension of the Speech

Teachers could extend learning by having students:
· Create decorated goals and steps on material that is the size of an index card. The index cards could be formatted as an inviting graphic organizer with a space for the goal at the top and several steps in the remaining space. Cards could be hung in the classroom to create a culture of goal setting, persistence, and success, and for the purpose of periodic review. (See the “Example Handout” section.)
· Create posters of their goals. Posters could be formatted in quadrants, puzzle pieces, or trails marked as steps. These also could be hung around the room, to be reviewed periodically and to create a classroom culture of goal setting and for the purpose of periodic review.
· Interview and share their goals with one another and the class, establishing community support for their goals.
· Create incentives or contests for achieving their personal goals.
· Write about goals and the steps to achieve them in a variety of genres such as poems, songs, or personal essays.
· Create artistic representations of goals and the steps to achieve them.


Where's the problem? You ARE what you learn.

Everything depends on the message dont you think?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[idrankwhat 0]

Quote

Everything depends on the message dont you think?

Absolutely. Maybe people should wait to find out what the delivered message is before they start fear mongering. But then again, if the intended goal is to promote divisiveness and to ensure that Obama fails at absolutely any effort, then waiting to hear what he actually says may be counterproductive. Best to put the straw man out there and set it afire.

[rehmwa 2]

Quote

Quote

Everything depends on the message dont you think?

Absolutely. Maybe people should wait to find out what the delivered message is before they start fear mongering. But then again, if the intended goal is to promote divisiveness and to ensure that Obama fails at absolutely any effort, then waiting to hear what he actually says may be counterproductive. Best to put the straw man out there and set it afire.

of course - it's SOP for any party with the other party's guy in the hotseat

...
Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants

[quade 3]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Everything depends on the message dont you think?

Absolutely. Maybe people should wait to find out what the delivered message is before they start fear mongering. But then again, if the intended goal is to promote divisiveness and to ensure that Obama fails at absolutely any effort, then waiting to hear what he actually says may be counterproductive. Best to put the straw man out there and set it afire.

of course - it's SOP for any party with the other party's guy in the hotseat

I dunno. Seems like this raises the bar to a level I have never seen before in my life. I can not think of a single time I have ever heard of masses of people planning to take their kids our of school for a day so that they won't have to listen to the President of the US say something.

That the parents actually believe listening to the PRESIDENT is going to harm their kids.

Can you?

Some idiots decided to take a perfectly reasonable talk from the President telling kids to stay in school and get good grades (BTW, the ONE thing that really is the magic bullet for success in life) and turn it into something sinister.

Fucking grow up people.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[rushmc 18]

Quote

Quote

Everything depends on the message dont you think?

Absolutely. Maybe people should wait to find out what the delivered message is before they start fear mongering. But then again, if the intended goal is to promote divisiveness and to ensure that Obama fails at absolutely any effort, then waiting to hear what he actually says may be counterproductive. Best to put the straw man out there and set it afire.

Hmm, did you happen to notice the subject line?

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[rushmc 18]

Quote

Quote

Quote

Quote

Everything depends on the message dont you think?

Absolutely. Maybe people should wait to find out what the delivered message is before they start fear mongering. But then again, if the intended goal is to promote divisiveness and to ensure that Obama fails at absolutely any effort, then waiting to hear what he actually says may be counterproductive. Best to put the straw man out there and set it afire.

of course - it's SOP for any party with the other party's guy in the hotseat

I dunno. Seems like this raises the bar to a level I have never seen before in my life. I can not think of a single time I have ever heard of masses of people planning to take their kids our of school for a day so that they won't have to listen to the President of the US say something.

That the parents actually believe listening to the PRESIDENT is going to harm their kids.

Can you?

Some idiots decided to take a perfectly reasonable talk from the President telling kids to stay in school and get good grades (BTW, the ONE thing that really is the magic bullet for success in life) and turn it into something sinister.

Fucking grow up people.

More idiots talk

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[TomAiello 25]

Quote

I don't remember this much furor when Bush I addressed schoolchildren about drugs.

There's a pretty large difference.

Bush wasn't pushing his televised image into every public school classroom in the nation, and Bush wasn't distributing lesson plans to teachers giving student assignments to tell how each child could help him achieve his goals.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TomAiello 25]

Quote

I'd trust Obama to address school children on a nationwide basis.

Given his record on this issue (addresses given in an educational setting, which have historically been non-political for every other president who's given them), no, I don't trust him.

Obama lost that trust, from me, when he took an opportunity to give a standard Presidential address at a college graduation, about working hard and doing good, and turned it into a campaign stop about abortion.

FWIW, I'm pretty vehemently pro-choice, and I still think Obama was utterly lacking in class to do that.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[rushmc 18]

Quote

Quote

Would the speach cause the kids to ask "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so mean they dont want everyone to have health care?" Or, "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so greedy they will polute the planet for money?"

That last one is a good question.

Ya, for the dufus AGW zealots

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

Quote

Given his record on this issue (addresses given in an educational setting, which have historically been non-political for every other president who's given them), no, I don't trust him.

Obama lost that trust, from me, when he took an opportunity to give a standard Presidential address at a college graduation, about working hard and doing good, and turned it into a campaign stop about abortion.

FWIW, I'm pretty vehemently pro-choice, and I still think Obama was utterly lacking in class to do that.

Are you talking about Notre Dame?

If you are, maybe I recall it differently, but I remember all the activist trying to make it about abortion, and Obama trying to avoid that topic.

- Dan G

[TomAiello 25]

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It's asking for critical thinking at a level that's appropriate for children.

I disagree.

Asking for critical thinking would be things like:

"What is the President saying?"

"What do I think of his ideas?"

"Do I agree with him?"

"Do I think those things are going to be good for me?"


Asking "how can I help the President?" is non-critical in the extreme.


My daughter is a pre-schooler. She's fully capable of articulating her desires and comparing them to other ideas.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TomAiello 25]

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Would the speach cause the kids to ask "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so mean they dont want everyone to have health care?" Or, "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so greedy they will polute the planet for money?"

That last one is a good question.

So is "why are some people so ignorant they think they can borrow their way out of debt?"

How would you feel if that one was fed to your children at their school?

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[TomAiello 25]

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There will still be people who will read into it...There are people out there who would be pissed...

Which begs the question: Why are we having political figures address school children at all?

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[rushmc 18]

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It's asking for critical thinking at a level that's appropriate for children.

I disagree.

Asking for critical thinking would be things like:

"What is the President saying?"

"What do I think of his ideas?"

"Do I agree with him?"

"Do I think those things are going to be good for me?"


Asking "how can I help the President?" is non-critical in the extreme.


My daughter is a pre-schooler. She's fully capable of articulating her desires and comparing them to other ideas.

This addresses your point well

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White House Withdraws Call for Students to 'Help' Obama
President Obama's plan to speak to the nation's schoolchildren in a video address next week erupted into controversy as critics claimed he was trying to indoctrinate America's kids.

FOXNews.com

Thursday, September 03, 2009



The Obama administration is rethinking its course recommendations for students ahead of President Obama's address to the the nation's schoolchildren next week, rewriting its suggestions to teachers for student assignments on how to "help the president."

White House aides said the language was supposed to be an inspirational, pro-education message to America's youths, but its unintended consequences were evident.

Among the activities initially suggested for pre-K to 6th grade students was to "write letters to themselves about what they can do to help the president."

Another assignment for students after hearing the speech was to discuss what "the president wants us to do."

The suggestion about writing letters has since been changed to: "Write letters to themselves about how they can achieve their short-term and long-term education goals. These would be collected and redistributed at an appropriate later date by the teacher to make students accountable to their goals."

White House spokesman Tommy Vietor said the changes to the language are intended to make the lesson plans clearer. He added that the speech is not a policy speech, but is intended to encourage kids to work hard and commit to school.

The speech is "about the value of education and the importance of staying in school as part of his effort to dramatically cut the dropout rate," Vietor said.

The Washington Times was first to report Thursday that the plan was being reconsidered. Presidential aides also acknowledged to the newspaper that they helped the U.S. Education Department write the suggested assignments, which stirred criticism by many who say Obama is trying to indoctrinate the education system.

Christina Erland Culver, former deputy assistant secretary for education, said presidents have traditionally addressed classrooms on the first day of school, but the problem with the event was the accompanying materials from the Department of Education.

"That's where they kind of got into a slippery spot. Federal statute denies any authority to the Department of Education to provide any kind of curriculum or anything that can be passed down to the state, and that's part of the statute forming the Department of Education. So they kinda got themselves into this mess because they didn't really understand some of the key legal roles or the dos and don'ts at the federal Department of Ed," she said.

"America will never be destroyed from the outside,
if we falter and lose our freedoms,
it will be because we destroyed ourselves."
Abraham Lincoln

[DanG 1]

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Asking "how can I help the President?" is non-critical in the extreme.

I suppose you are right.

However, I don't see that question anywhere in the quoted materials. Did I miss it somewhere?

- Dan G

[TomAiello 25]

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Asking "how can I help the President?" is non-critical in the extreme.

I suppose you are right.

However, I don't see that question anywhere in the quoted materials. Did I miss it somewhere?

Are you reading the initial guidelines or the revised ones (after this became an issue)? The original contains the following suggested assignment:

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Write letters to themselves about what they can do to help the President. These would be collected and redistributed at an appropriate later date to make students accountable to their goals. (emphasis added by me)

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[DanG 1]

I guess I was reading the revised ones. Thanks for pointing that out.

Are there objections to the revised lesson plans? They appear to be pretty narrowly focused on perserverance and responsibility.

- Dan G

[marks2065 0]

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Yeah, I read the agenda. What do you think it should say - "encourage children to say that the speaker is a big bozo?"

It's asking for critical thinking at a level that's appropriate for children. That's what teachers are supposed to be teaching -- how else to children learn how to deal with new situations if they don't think about them?

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Are you serious? did you read what you wrote? Teachers are having enough trouble teaching math, science and english, maybe they should concentrate on that and not trying push political views. Our kids need to be eduacated so they can make their own choices not brainwashed at 6 to love Obama and his agenda!

edited to add, If Obama had earned trust and was going to talk about the needs of education I would have no problem, But he has lied to many times and has proven himself untrustworthy. The origonal script was political and agenda pushing then got changed. Why should I believe or trust a prooven liar to not wiggle his origonal agenda into the speech somehow? therefore kids in my house will not attend.

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[idrankwhat 0]

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Would the speach cause the kids to ask "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so mean they dont want everyone to have health care?" Or, "Mommy, daddy, why are some people so greedy they will polute the planet for money?"

That last one is a good question.

So is "why are some people so ignorant they think they can borrow their way out of debt?"

How would you feel if that one was fed to your children at their school?

I wouldn't expect either of those questions to be "fed to your children". I'd expect that sort of question to come back from a child after those topics were raised in discussion. My first reaction would be "wow, that's great that you guys are even talking about economics and the environment." Then I'd say, "calling them "ignorant" is inappropriate in respectful discourse. "Misguided" or "short sighted" might be a better term although I'm going to be hard pressed to prove my point. Part of our economic crisis was caused by wealthy and politically connected individuals who used their influence to borrow 30 times the worth of their institutions, and consequently, profited enormously despite their failed policies. So it can be done. You just need to decide for yourself if you think it's appropriate."