Coreece 190 #26 March 6, 2009 Quote American government officials? Kidnap them? Shit. Fucking kill em, while you're at it. Start with Congress. Aren't most of em lawyers?Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #27 March 6, 2009 Quote Quote American government officials? Kidnap them? Shit. Fucking kill em, while you're at it. Start with Congress. Aren't most of em lawyers? They're the ones standing behind the firing squad, holding the upraised sabres. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #28 March 6, 2009 QuoteThese ..... have a pretty harsh justice system for the most part. It's clear that they don't understand justice, they confuse it with revenge. (in this instance at least) ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #29 March 6, 2009 QuoteQuoteThese ..... have a pretty harsh justice system for the most part. It's clear that they don't understand justice, they confuse it with revenge. (in this instance at least) But that right there is a culturally-biased statement: in some cultures, revenge is not confused with justice, it is equated with justice. And besides, even in our own culture, retribution (along with general deterrence, specific deterrence, rehabilitation and incapacitation) is one of the classic justifications for criminal punishment. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #30 March 6, 2009 A brave one, not many people would openly advocate the return of slavery.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #31 March 6, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteFor kidnappers is do. Lawrocket, in light of your reply and considering the Bush administrations' "special renditioning "programs, would you support the kidnapping of CIA agents and American government officials? Blues, Cliff American government officials? Kidnap them? Shit. Fucking kill em, while you're at it. Start with Congress. I take it you look good in orange.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #32 March 6, 2009 QuoteQuoteDo you agree with the punishment? I think the majority of us in here might be culturally unqualified to answer the question. A very interesting and insightful response.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #33 March 6, 2009 Quote Quote These ..... have a pretty harsh justice system for the most part. It's clear that they don't understand justice, they confuse it with revenge. (in this instance at least) Oh contrare, haven't you heard? Justice is blindWhen an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #34 March 6, 2009 QuoteFrontier justice in America was pretty rough too back in the old days. We seem to have gotten way too soft on crime these days. Getting your criminal ass raped almost daily in prison doesn't seem to prevent a lot of crime, does it? It's interesting that rape in prisons would come up in an "eye for an eye" thread. Rape, at least outside of prisons, is considered by many to be the next worst thing to killing someone. In that sense, prison rape of anyone who didn't rape and/or kill someone to end up there amounts to "an arm for a finger." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #35 March 6, 2009 Thanks for the image. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #36 March 6, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteThese ..... have a pretty harsh justice system for the most part. It's clear that they don't understand justice, they confuse it with revenge. (in this instance at least) But that right there is a culturally-biased statement: in some cultures, revenge is not confused with justice, it is equated with justice. certainly, and that's my point - I think that's a societally destructive interpretion of the concept - severely so. you and I have had some really good threads on 'justice', but it's Friday, so I don't want to go into the same stuff again ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Andy9o8 0 #37 March 6, 2009 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteThese ..... have a pretty harsh justice system for the most part. It's clear that they don't understand justice, they confuse it with revenge. (in this instance at least) But that right there is a culturally-biased statement: in some cultures, revenge is not confused with justice, it is equated with justice. certainly, and that's my point - I think that's a societally destructive interpretion of the concept - severely so. That may be so, but if it is, then that is a criticism of your (our) own society as well; for as I noted above, Retribution - society expressing its outrage - is most definitely one of the principal justifications for criminal punishment, even in Western-style societies. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
champu 1 #38 March 6, 2009 Quote Thanks for the image. Er, no... I didn't mean arms or fingers going any... ...you know what, nevermind. I'm sorry. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #39 March 6, 2009 QuoteThat may be so, but if it is, then that is a criticism of your (our) own society as well; for as I noted above, Retribution - society expressing its outrage - is most definitely one of the principal justifications for criminal punishment, even in Western-style societies. I'm ok with that - for me it is a weakness of the system that leads to different punishments of people that commit the same crimes. Justice has to be cold and emotionless and practical - retribution is based on neither. I'll have to go to a Batman Begins quote (because all good things come from Batman - even via Katy Holmes slapping Christian Bale) "Justice is about balance - revenge is about making yourself feel good" and I am sure I messed up the quote, but the gist is there Edit: the sad part of it is, people continue to get it backwards - the most emotionally vested proponents of retribution tend to be those that get the worst end of the stick when it comes to punishment ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #40 March 6, 2009 "Do you support eye for an eye justice" short answer - I support "an eye for a box of glazed donut holes" justice so I had to vote "other" ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SivaGanesha 2 #41 March 6, 2009 QuoteDo you agree with the punishment? I think that, in general, courts--whether here or in Iran--should have far more latitude in choosing an appropriate punishment for the action committed. Rather than picking from a rather narrow range of punishments--which might be imprisonment here or dismemberment there--that might or might not remedy anything, a court should be able to determine the fairest way of resolving the situation. I do not think that "an eye for an eye" generally works. In this case the woman has become a financial burden on her innocent friends and on the government of an innocent country (Spain). Blinding her assailant will, in the end, only have the effect of creating additional burden on innocent people. Yet at the same time it must not be forgotten that the damage he has done can never be repaired--therefore his punishment must be permanent. What I would prefer to see in this kind of a case would be lifetime incarceration where he is required to spend the rest of his life working with at-risk youth to prevent them from giving in to anger like this man, apparently, did. He needs to spend the rest of his life working--and working hard--to prevent others from committing similar crimes. The success of such an approach would depend to a large degree on how genuinely remorseful he is and whether he truly wants to spend his life making amends. I have nothing against also allowing the court more heavy-handed and physically painful punishments if it deems such an approach to be the only recourse available. Basically what I'm saying is that the set of options available to courts to truly remedy the serious problems they see on a day to day basis tends to be very limited. I would like to see courts be allowed far more creativity--both to be lenient when there is genuine remorse and to be extremely harsh when circumstances warrant--to find the best solution to problems it is presented with."It's hard to have fun at 4-way unless your whole team gets down to the ground safely to do it again!"--Northern California Skydiving League re USPA Safety Day, March 8, 2014 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rehmwa 2 #42 March 6, 2009 QuoteWhat I would prefer to see in this kind of a case would be lifetime incarceration where he is required to spend the rest of his life working with at-risk youth to prevent them from giving in to anger like this man, apparently, did. Everything in the world apparently is some 'special' social experiment. Where's the "I'm gagging on my own vomit" emoticon ... Driving is a one dimensional activity - a monkey can do it - being proud of your driving abilities is like being proud of being able to put on pants Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
crozby 0 #43 March 6, 2009 I was going to vote no because it sounded so ridiculous and barbaric. Then I looked at the picture of the woman in the artical and I changed my mind to yes, definitely. Did anyone else get swayed by the visual? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #44 March 7, 2009 Quote Where's the "I'm gagging on my own vomit" emoticon Check with Vinny... he is into that Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skyrad 0 #45 March 7, 2009 QuoteI was going to vote no because it sounded so ridiculous and barbaric. Then I looked at the picture of the woman in the artical and I changed my mind to yes, definitely. Did anyone else get swayed by the visual? yes on an emotional side I did. I thought also what if it were someone that was not a stranger to me? In which case I would not like to say what I would do to him. However, what is the difference between justice and vengence? In all honesty I'm still not exactly sure where I stand on this one.When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy. Lucius Annaeus Seneca Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
