br0k3n 0
JackC 0
QuoteOur 5 senses, a brain to crunch the data, and faith is all we have to construct our realities.
With 5 senses and a brain you can construct a model of reality that will be reasonably accurate. The problem arises when your senses and your brain tell you something that doesn't fit with your faith. Faith is like fitting your brain with a ball and chain. Every model of reality you construct is constrained by your faith and therefore based on something for which there is no evidence.
jakee 1,265
QuoteI personally believe God created all things, and has made provisions for His creation to continue. I don't think any of us have all of the details on how exactly God started everything. I think the earth is older than 6000 years more like 4.5 billion years. But as far as the "bogus" award I would have to give it to Kallen, "only a fool says in his heart there is no God" That is the biggest lie of all.
It seems to me as if you're saying "OK, I know creationists are liars, but they're on my side so it's ok."
Nice sense of honesty there.
Do you want to have an ideagasm?
maadmax 0
It seems to me as if you're saying "OK, I know creationists are liars, but they're on my side so it's ok."
Nice sense of honesty there.
Nice sense of honesty there.
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Not exactly, I feel that in the big scheme of things some facts are more important than others.
How we got here is mildly interesting. Why we are here is by far much more important. Some people could be totally wrong on how we got here. But if they are correct on why we are here, that in my opinion is what really matters.
maadmax 0
With 5 senses and a brain you can construct a model of reality that will be reasonably accurate. The problem arises when your senses and your brain tell you something that doesn't fit with your faith. Faith is like fitting your brain with a ball and chain. Every model of reality you construct is constrained by your faith and therefore based on something for which there is no evidence.
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In some cases your observation is correct. I have also observed that. Every person living utilizes faith in their reality constructs. Hopefully the true seeker of God will remain open to new faith lessons and not get bogged down in human ignorance. I constantly examine my faith for inaccuracies. The Bible also says God tests a person's faith so that it hopefully will become free of defects. I have personally benefited from Gods testing many times in my life.
maadmax 0
Free from what exactly?
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The chains of sin and death and all of the temporal and eternal consequences. Freedom from a life of regret. Free to wake up every morning new and clean, knowing the penalty of my sins has been commuted. Free to commune with God. Is that enough or would you like more examples.
br0k3n 0
QuoteFree from what exactly? [/quote}
QuoteThe chains of sin and death and all of the temporal and eternal consequences. Freedom from a life of regret. Free to wake up every morning new and clean, knowing the penalty of my sins has been commuted..
These so called chains that you “free” yourself from are merely self imposed by your faith in the first place!!!!!!!!! The term “Sin” when used in a religious context describes any lack of conformity to the will of God, now for some one who does not believe in god/god (because there isn’t single shred of evidence) this concept is rather meaningless, and we believe human behaviour is not regulated by "commandments" given from above, but by moral standards derived from natural sources.
Also the concept of sin originated in St Paul’s sadomasochistic doctrine of original sin.
Adam the proposed perpetrator of the “original sin” never existed in the first place, a rather awkward fact don’t you think….
But the story of Adam is symbolic I hear you say, so Jesus was tortured and executed for a symbolic sin by a non-existent individual!!!!
If god wanted to forgive our sins why not just forgive them…
*** Free to commune with God
I suspect that this is a rather “one way” commune, funny that isn’t it…..
QuoteIs that enough or would you like more examples
Yes.
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--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
JackC 0
QuoteEvery person living utilizes faith in their reality constructs.
Oh now you're just making stuff up. Plenty of people have no use for faith. I'm one of them.
QuoteI constantly examine my faith for inaccuracies
The fact that you've even got the capacity to have faith in which to examine is the problem I'm trying to point out. Faith means you believe something to be true without any supporting evidence, you have no reason to believe this thing to be true except that you want to. In fact, the thing you have faith in will be quite different from the the thing someone else has faith in, even though you both call that thing by the same name (ie god). It's a totally subjective "knowledge" so any notion of "wisdom" has to be completely subjective too. That, to my mind, is not wisdom but merely opinion and it's not even an opinion I'll respect because it's not based on anything.
maadmax 0
QuoteQuoteEvery person living utilizes faith in their reality constructs.
Oh now you're just making stuff up. Plenty of people have no use for faith. I'm one of them.
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I disagree, any time you make conclusions without the benefit of complete information you have to use
faith or a belief to bridge the gaps of the unknown. We may be having a semantical difference here, which is fine. You define the term and I will use it. But what ever you call it , it still exists. For example, you "believe" that God doesn't exist. You can not prove God doesn't exist, but somehow you know. You have made that concept part of your reality. I call that faith, what would you like to call it.
maadmax 0
These so called chains that you “free” yourself from are merely self imposed by your faith in the first place!!!!!!!!! The term “Sin” when used in a religious context describes any lack of conformity to the will of God, now for some one who does not believe in god/god (because there isn’t single shred of evidence) this concept is rather meaningless, and we believe human behaviour is not regulated by "commandments" given from above, but by moral standards derived from natural sources.
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Goodness you are a hard case. It appears you have a good understanding of what sin is. Since God sets the rules for the reality we exist in, His morality is law. Since we are created in His image we can also make godlike decisions and create our own realities. We can write Him out of the picture and grant ourselves all the rights and privileges our little hearts desire, contrary to what God has designed for us. I can promise you one thing though, there is no quicker road to self destructive thoughts and behavior. The proof for you will be in watching your life unfold if you maintain that belief. Sin, which is all decisions made outside of Gods Will, EXISTS! whether or not you believe .
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Goodness you are a hard case. It appears you have a good understanding of what sin is. Since God sets the rules for the reality we exist in, His morality is law. Since we are created in His image we can also make godlike decisions and create our own realities. We can write Him out of the picture and grant ourselves all the rights and privileges our little hearts desire, contrary to what God has designed for us. I can promise you one thing though, there is no quicker road to self destructive thoughts and behavior. The proof for you will be in watching your life unfold if you maintain that belief. Sin, which is all decisions made outside of Gods Will, EXISTS! whether or not you believe .
kallend 1,661
Quote
These so called chains that you “free” yourself from are merely self imposed by your faith in the first place!!!!!!!!! The term “Sin” when used in a religious context describes any lack of conformity to the will of God, now for some one who does not believe in god/god (because there isn’t single shred of evidence) this concept is rather meaningless, and we believe human behaviour is not regulated by "commandments" given from above, but by moral standards derived from natural sources.
____________________________________________
Goodness you are a hard case. It appears you have a good understanding of what sin is. Since God sets the rules for the reality we exist in, His morality is law. Since we are created in His image we can also make godlike decisions and create our own realities. We can write Him out of the picture and grant ourselves all the rights and privileges our little hearts desire, contrary to what God has designed for us. I can promise you one thing though, there is no quicker road to self destructive thoughts and behavior. The proof for you will be in watching your life unfold if you maintain that belief. Sin, which is all decisions made outside of Gods Will, EXISTS! whether or not you believe .
Which God would that be? Indra? Varuna? Akash Bhairab? Odin? Horus? Zeus?
...
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.
br0k3n 0
QuoteThese so called chains that you “free” yourself from are merely self imposed by your faith in the first place!!!!!!!!! The term “Sin” when used in a religious context describes any lack of conformity to the will of God, now for some one who does not believe in god/god (because there isn’t single shred of evidence) this concept is rather meaningless, and we believe human behaviour is not regulated by "commandments" given from above, but by moral standards derived from natural sources.
QuoteGoodness you are a hard case. It appears you have a good understanding of what sin is. Since God sets the rules for the reality we exist in, His morality is law. Since we are created in His image we can also make godlike decisions and create our own realities. We can write Him out of the picture and grant ourselves all the rights and privileges our little hearts desire, contrary to what God has designed for us.
Again all this is your belief, not mine. You have no evidence what so ever to suggest anything you believe about sin is correct, therefore I reject it.. Simple..
I haven’t written your god or any god out of the picture because they have neve been in it…
Quote. I can promise you one thing though, there is no quicker road to self destructive thoughts and behavior. The proof for you will be in watching your life unfold if you maintain that belief. Sin, which is all decisions made outside of Gods Will, EXISTS! whether or not you believe
No you cant promise me anything, because you do not have the answers…. So are you ignorant enough to assume that without belief in your god then I am on the road to “self destructive thoughts and behaviour”!!!!
So do you have an overwhelming urge to rape and pillage, but because your god is watching you and threatens you with eternal damnation you choose not to??? what a load of old crap….. do you honestly look to the bible for a guide to morality? Have you even read it???
[sic] Many Christians have never read the whole Bible, and are not aware of the moral teachings that are found in it. Let's look at some. Exodus 23:19 tells us we cannot cook a baby goat in it's mother's milk. Do you worry about keeping this commandment? Gen. 17:14 tells us a child is to be punished when his parents neglect to have him circumcised. Is that fair? Ex. 20:8-11, 31:15-17, 34:21, and 35:1-3 tell us that no work may be done on the Sabbath (Saturday) not even the lighting of a fire. The penalty is death. Do you recommend that we kill people who light a fire in their fireplace on Saturday? [1] Lev. 3:17 tells us that we may never eat fat. So how is it that we eat hamburgers without guilt? Lev. 27:1-7 tells us that males are more valuable than females. Do you agree? If you are female, do you think males are more valuable than you are? No? Than these verses are mistaken, aren't they? Num. 5:12-31, tells us that if we suspect our wife has committed adultery, she is to be tested by making her drink water mixed with dirt. If she gets sick, she is guilty. Do you recommend that we implement this test procedure? I don't. Interestingly, there is no such test given for men. Is this fair? Deut. 22:5 tells us we may not wear clothing of the opposite sex. Do you think it is a sin for a woman to wear her husband's shirt? No? Then you disagree with Deuteronomy. Deut. 23:1 tells us that a man whose testicles are crushed may not enter the assembly of the Lord. Should we set up an inspection station at the church doors, asking every man to kindly drop his drawers for inspection, so we can keep injured people out? Or should we just pretend this verse isn't there? Deut. 25:11-12 tells us that a wife who grabs her husband's attacker by his private parts must have her hand cut off and is to be shown no pity. It does not matter that she was only trying to rescue her husband. Do you agree? I could give many more examples
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--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+
JackC 0
QuoteI disagree, any time you make conclusions without the benefit of complete information you have to use faith or a belief to bridge the gaps of the unknown.***
Rubbish. If I'm playing hold 'em poker and I go all in on a pair of poket aces, I have no idea if I will win the hand or not but I can calculate the odds and act accordingly. That's not faith.
I make decisions based on the information I have. It doesn't matter if I know that knowledge is incomplete or not, I only make a tentative decision that I will use as long as it seems reasonable. I know that it could well be wrong and I must be prepared to change it when fresh information is made available. That's not faith.
No, faith is a belief that isn't based on evidence. And because faith isn't based on evidence, no amount of evidence will change the faithfuls mind. One poster on this board summarised his faith as "I "know" God exists and that His Word is true. I am solid in my belief. Nothing will ever change that.". That's faith and it does not impress me.
If you want to equate my Texas Hold 'em strategy to your faith in god, then you do both of us a diservice.QuoteFor example, you "believe" that God doesn't exist. You can not prove God doesn't exist, but somehow you know. You have made that concept part of your reality. I call that faith, what would you like to call it.
No, I don't know that god doesn't exist. How can I know? I can look at the omnimax definition and say that's not logical, I can look at the bible or the koran and say it's incoherent gibberish but fundamentally, I cannot search the entire universe to look for a god that may or may not exist.
It is not that I have faith that god does not exist, but rather that I place no faith in god. There is a difference.
QuoteNo, I don't know that god doesn't exist. How can I know? I can look at the omnimax definition and say that's not logical, I can look at the bible or the koran and say it's incoherent gibberish but fundamentally, I cannot search the entire universe to look for a god that may or may not exist.
It is not that I have faith that god does not exist, but rather that I place no faith in god. There is a difference.
You better hope if there is a God He is into playing the semantics game.
steveOrino
Royd 0
Isn't it funny that someone who doesn't believe in a God or sin will still drive around with a radar detector in their car.QuoteAgain all this is your belief, not mine. You have no evidence what so ever to suggest anything you believe about sin is correct, therefore I reject it.. Simple..
No, I think religion has turned people toward the viewpoint you embrace, with good reason I might add. Believing the Truth of God HAS SET THEM FREE!!!
Free from what exactly?
--+ There are 10 types of people in the world: Those who understand binary, and those who don't.. --+