NWFlyer 2 #1 November 7, 2006 I was reading USA Today at the hotel this morning, and noticed the front page story is about the airplane accident in NYC last month. Reading it, everything sounded hauntingly familiar. I know this isn't directly skydiving related, but the lessons learned were so familiar and seemed so directly relevant to how we train and grow skydivers that I thought it was worth sharing the article here. I've highlighted a few key parts below that seemed to reflect what we often say about people in our sport after an incident (any emphasis added is mine). QuoteLidle and Stanger were cautious, safety-minded pilots, according to people who flew with them. But so are most of the people who crash, says Michael Barr, a veteran pilot and director of the University of Southern California's Aviation Safety and Security Program. “The majority of accidents happen to good pilots who are very confident of what they do,” Barr says. “Sometimes they do something that is beyond their abilities.” I seem to recall hearing that a few times after a skydiving incident. QuoteThe board's files are filled with examples of pilots getting into trouble in small planes because they weren't familiar with the aircraft, maneuvered too aggressively or lost control New canopy size, new canopy type, bad spot... QuoteStanger praised his student, telling The New York Times a month before the accident that Lidle had an uncommon ability to remain calm and do the right thing during simulated emergencies. How often do you hear "he/she is a natural" about a new jumper? QuoteAside from that earlier trip, Stanger had little or no experience flying in the New York area. Though he had accumulated thousands of hours in planes, he also apparently had few hours in the Cirrus, according to Howard. Lidle had a total of only 88 hours and was “pilot in command” for 47 of those, according to the NTSB. Trying more than one new thing at once ... QuoteNeither pilot had apparently completed the Cirrus-designed training program suggested by the manufacturer, says Cirrus Design CEO and co-founder Alan Klapmeier. The SR-20 is a faster plane than many of its counterparts of the same size. Here's your new high-performance canopy ... be safe. QuoteThey had several factors working against them. A 15-mph wind was blowing out of the east as they flew up the river. On a typical U-turn to the left, that wind would push them toward Manhattan. At the same time, radar showed they were traveling at 112 mph, according to the NTSB. That speed would require a relatively wide turn unless they banked far more steeply than normal. Speed plus sketchy conditions plus a location with no margin for error ... QuoteWithin seconds, the plane was surrounded by skyscrapers. When it goes to shit, it goes to shit fast."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Reginald 0 #2 November 7, 2006 Yep...spot on."We've been looking for the enemy for some time now. We've finally found him. We're surrounded. That simplifies things." CP Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
slotperfect 7 #3 November 7, 2006 Excellent correlation Krisanne - thanks for that!Arrive Safely John Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
druvaughn 0 #4 November 7, 2006 I concur, that is a great correlation. Along these lines, I was happy that someone finally called the crash PILOT ERROR. The original news reports quoted as the NTSB as saying "the wind caused the crash". Which may be true, but only because the pilots didn't know how to react to said wind conditions, which makes it the pilot's fault. Nice post NWFlyer- - "Baseball is 90% mental. The other half is physical." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #6 November 8, 2006 First question: why were they flying so low, near tall buildings? Is there some special VFR corridor down the river? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #7 November 8, 2006 Maybe they should have attended a course in mountain flying. One trick my instructor showed me was to crank on a couple notches of flaps and slow down before turning in a narrow valley. Slowing down significantly decreases the turn radius. It also makes a big difference if you are facing against the wind or with the wind halfway through your turn. For a more detailed description, try reading any of Sparky Imeson's books on Mountain Flying. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
phoenixlpr 0 #8 November 8, 2006 You can see that 2 pilots are not better than one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
billvon 2,400 #9 November 8, 2006 >Is there some special VFR corridor down the river? Yes, there are VFR corridors on both sides of Manhattan. I've flown the west one quite often; very pretty at night. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #10 November 9, 2006 So, are skyscrapers hard, fair, and patient? -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmytavino 16 #11 November 10, 2006 great point about slowing down, adding lift ( flaps),, before the hard 180... very alike to a braked turn under canopy... When that crash FIRST occured,, I asked anyone with whom I had discussed the accident... " I wonder if he had a wind from the south east,,,which sliiiid. him to the west...??." Not a lot of whuffos and non-pilots understand the concept of skating.... sometimes a good long distance... when turning an aircraft...and perhaps one or both of these guys misjudged it as well..... I also was reminded of the JFK Jr. crash... Relative novice,,, with waaaaay more aircraft in his hands than he is capable of handling.... ........ and yes... wind was a certain component of this accident,,, but certainly NOT the cause...... Wind is a condition !! and MANY conditions must be assessed understood and compensated for..... on a moment to moment basis.... when flying ANYthing.......Failure to do so as a pilot OR co pilot.... and NOW you're talking about a CAUSE... sad. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
