Amazon 7 #51 February 8, 2006 nyah nyah nyah.... So MR NRA when you gonna go get some TRIGGER TIME.. I know you are just dying to GO GET SOME. Edited to add you might even get to learn a few new swear words.... some in our military can educate you on whole new realms of cuss words. Edited to add you could even get some kewl training for the militia... so that after the democrats are back in power again.. you can be a new right wing hero like the guys who want to overthrow the government. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #52 February 8, 2006 Can I assume all who are opposed to tax cuts have sent any refunds they got back to the Govt.? Didn't think so. Makes you a hypocrit. Might I suggest you do it this year, or stop your whining. You could start a movement that refuses to accept refunds. Edited to add: You are also free to send the govt. more money than they already take from you if you believe your taxes are too low. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rushmc 18 #53 February 8, 2006 QuoteCan I assume all who are opposed to tax cuts have sent any refunds they got back to the Govt.? Didn't think so. Makes you a hypocrit. Might I suggest you do it this year, or stop your whining. You could start a movement that refuses to accept refunds. Edited to add: You are also free to send the govt. more money than they already take from you if you believe your taxes are too low. Here here! What I think is so sad is that they want thier money back. But anybody that makes a dime more than them needs to pay more. Conclusion? They have fully bought into the class envy dogma of the left. Rich evil bastards They had to cheat steel or just get dam lucky by marriage or family. "America will never be destroyed from the outside, if we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves." Abraham Lincoln Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #54 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteCan I assume all who are opposed to tax cuts have sent any refunds they got back to the Govt.? Didn't think so. Makes you a hypocrit. Might I suggest you do it this year, or stop your whining. You could start a movement that refuses to accept refunds. Edited to add: You are also free to send the govt. more money than they already take from you if you believe your taxes are too low. Here here! What I think is so sad is that they want thier money back. But anybody that makes a dime more than them needs to pay more. Conclusion? They have fully bought into the class envy dogma of the left. Rich evil bastards They had to cheat steel or just get dam lucky by marriage or family. Yep. What they want is for everyone to pay more except them. It's always about the govt forcing someone else to pay more. I think they should start a protest group called "Liberals Against Tax Refunds." They could get airtime on TV by holding refund check return protests across the country. OK, I'm putting down the crack pipe now. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #55 February 8, 2006 QuoteI think they should start a protest group called "Liberals Against Tax Refunds." They could get airtime on TV by holding refund check return protests across the country. OK, I'm putting down the crack pipe now. LMMFAO!!!!!! It's true -- how can anyone take them seriously for opposing tax cuts if they're not handing back the money they've been given back? Do you think that any of the companies owned by rich LIBERALS are ready to give back the tax cut money they receive? I mean, it's one thing if their complaint is that the tax cuts are given to the RICH and not the poor or middle class (a claim which is bullshit anyway)... But it's another to BE a rich liberal and talk shit about opposing tax cuts and then NOT refuse your own! --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,634 #56 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteHOLY FUCKING SHIT A WHOLE POST WITHOUT VULGARITY.... Would you kindly grow up? - Irony score 10.0... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #57 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteHOLY FUCKING SHIT A WHOLE POST WITHOUT VULGARITY.... Would you kindly grow up? - Irony score 10.0 How about you, too? Would you kindly grow up? --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #58 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteHOLY FUCKING SHIT A WHOLE POST WITHOUT VULGARITY.... Would you kindly grow up? - Irony score 10.0 How about you, too? Would you kindly grow up? - Chit..Kallend's as old as Mick Jagger. J/K Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #59 February 8, 2006 That too. Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
EricTheRed 0 #60 February 8, 2006 QuoteMy mistake on the guy thing. Is it Miss or Mrs.? Moving on. I'm prepairing my 3 girls to rely upon themselfs and not upon the State, to take pride in their own work, instead of sitting idle to envy the luck of others, to face life with resolute courage, win victory if they can and accept defeat if they must. But they should never place on their fellow brethern a responsibility which is not theirs. The US Constitution does not entitle them to free hand outs, Medical Cares or the right to snuff out the lives of the Old or unborn (Thread Hijack) and a life time pay check they themselves have not provided for. .... but the freedom to pursue happiness, and the opertunity to live as free men /women. Tax cuts have always produced revenues to the treasury and the treasury has never produced an income other than that which it has taken from a free people. Wing the people off Social Security and Medicare and set up manditory savings accounts that are owned by each individual and over the next 50 years people will be much better off. The average US citizen is saving -.50 -.70 percent, that is a choice that is leading millions to poverty. And if you go in on a jump, or just end up paralyzed? I hope not but if you do, are your daughters ready to live on their own 100%, no assistance from the big bad gov'mnt? It's just a matter of degree. \ I really detest people that only see black and white and never realize that there are shades of grey.illegible usually Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 1 #61 February 8, 2006 I think what everyone seems to be missing is how much of our tax money goes basically for nothing, that is, it goes to pay off the interest on the debt. Let's see, for 8 trillion, let's say at a 3% rate (it's probably more), we have to pay out $240 billion a year! Correct me if I'm wrong, but that's more than Iraq and Katrina combined for nothing in return. And with each additional $500 billion deficit (seems to be the average for the past few years), the "bottomless" pit gets another $40 billion deeper. Likewise, with each rise of 1% in the interest rate, it gets $80 billion deeper. It may "feel good" right now to have those tax cuts, but it's gonna sting like a bitch if we keep on the way we are. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #62 February 8, 2006 Well, the easy solution is to let ourselves get so far in that we have no hope of getting out, and then ask other countries to forgive our debt! I mean, it's good enough for Africa... --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
peacefuljeffrey 0 #63 February 8, 2006 And before you go excusing Africa, because it's poor and backward for the most part, let me remind you that it is always thrown in our face that Africa is the "cradle of humanity": why, if it is the oldest place where humans developed, is it in LAST place to... well... develop!? --Jeffrey "With tha thoughts of a militant mind... Hard line, hard line after hard line!" Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 1 #64 February 8, 2006 QuoteWell, the easy solution is to let ourselves get so far in that we have no hope of getting out, and then ask other countries to forgive our debt! I mean, it's good enough for Africa... And how would you feel if you were one of the creditors that had their life savings wiped out? Remember, it's not just rich Chinese who own the debt, it's also poor shmoes with savings bonds. It's naive to think that that huge amount of debt would be forgiven without serious consequence, possibly even war. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,634 #65 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteHOLY FUCKING SHIT A WHOLE POST WITHOUT VULGARITY.... Would you kindly grow up? - Irony score 10.0 How about you, too? Would you kindly grow up? - Chit..Kallend's as old as Mick Jagger. J/K Not quite, but he's chemically preserved.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,634 #66 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteCan I assume all who are opposed to tax cuts have sent any refunds they got back to the Govt.? Didn't think so. Makes you a hypocrit. Might I suggest you do it this year, or stop your whining. You could start a movement that refuses to accept refunds. Edited to add: You are also free to send the govt. more money than they already take from you if you believe your taxes are too low. Here here! What I think is so sad is that they want thier money back. But anybody that makes a dime more than them needs to pay more. Conclusion? They have fully bought into the class envy dogma of the left. Rich evil bastards They had to cheat steel or just get dam lucky by marriage or family. Yep. What they want is for everyone to pay more except them. It's always about the govt forcing someone else to pay more. Which poll did you use to get that information? How about all those that supported the invasion of Iraq throwing in the $7,000 for themselves and each of their family members to cover the likely final cost of that misadventure?... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #67 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteCan I assume all who are opposed to tax cuts have sent any refunds they got back to the Govt.? Didn't think so. Makes you a hypocrit. Might I suggest you do it this year, or stop your whining. You could start a movement that refuses to accept refunds. Edited to add: You are also free to send the govt. more money than they already take from you if you believe your taxes are too low. Here here! What I think is so sad is that they want thier money back. But anybody that makes a dime more than them needs to pay more. Conclusion? They have fully bought into the class envy dogma of the left. Rich evil bastards They had to cheat steel or just get dam lucky by marriage or family. Yep. What they want is for everyone to pay more except them. It's always about the govt forcing someone else to pay more. Which poll did you use to get that information? How about all those that supported the invasion of Iraq throwing in the $7,000 for themselves and each of their family members to cover the likely final cost of that misadventure? Believe me, I have paid much, much more than my fair share and I have no expectation of paying any less in the future. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkyDekker 1,129 #68 February 8, 2006 QuoteCan I assume all who are opposed to tax cuts have sent any refunds they got back to the Govt.? Didn't think so. Makes you a hypocrit. So, if I don't agree with tax hikes, but I pay them anyways, does that make me a hypocrit too. What an incredibly assinine statement. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gravitymaster 0 #69 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteCan I assume all who are opposed to tax cuts have sent any refunds they got back to the Govt.? Didn't think so. Makes you a hypocrit. So, if I don't agree with tax hikes, but I pay them anyways, does that make me a hypocrit too. What an incredibly assinine statement. What an incredibly dumb comparison. If you don't think you are paying enough taxes, then you have the legal right to voluntarily pay more, and in fact you can legally pay as much over the minimum as you like. If you don't agree with tax hikes, you cannot legally refuse to pay. If you want to beat yourself up and call yourself a hipocrit for complying with the law, then be my guest. Did you even think about what you were saying before you posted your response? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goofyjumper 0 #70 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteThe last time Bush gave you a tax refund, did you: 1) Cash the check, or; 2) Send it back and tell them to keep it for the sake of the deficit? I knew that question would come up eventually. Yes I did cash it and put it towards my college fund, because I knew we be having huge cuts eventually, and sure enough I was right! So rather than stand on your principles, you helped contribute to the deficit, which you now criticize. Ok, you obvioulsy misunderstood what I was talking about. I was just saying that everone was bitching that Clinton fucked up the economy. I was also saying that the economy was oblvioulsy not that bad while clinton was in office. Bush gave us all these refunds and took credit for what Clinton help produce!----------------- I love and Miss you so much Honey! Orfun #3 ~ Darla Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,634 #71 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteThe last time Bush gave you a tax refund, did you: 1) Cash the check, or; 2) Send it back and tell them to keep it for the sake of the deficit? I knew that question would come up eventually. Yes I did cash it and put it towards my college fund, because I knew we be having huge cuts eventually, and sure enough I was right! So rather than stand on your principles, you helped contribute to the deficit, which you now criticize. Ok, you obvioulsy misunderstood what I was talking about. I was just saying that everone was bitching that Clinton fucked up the economy. I was also saying that the economy was oblvioulsy not that bad while clinton was in office. Bush gave us all these refunds and took credit for what Clinton help produce! Here is a graph showing the annual % change in US National Debt over the last few years. Republican administrations in red, Democrat in blue.... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
storm1977 0 #72 February 8, 2006 Apocalypse ain't nigh Social Security and Medicare notwithstanding, the economy may be in better shape than it seems. By Justin Fox, February 8, 2006: 10:37 AM EST NEW YORK (FORTUNE) - Barring huge tax hikes or huge cuts in promised spending, the U.S. appears headed toward budgetary meltdown a few decades down the road. So what should today's politicians do about it? Over the past half decade, their approach has looked like this: The Democrats downplay looming funding problems with Social Security and Medicare, but talk a good game about fiscal discipline today. The Republicans show few compunctions about running big deficits today, but talk a good game about doing something to fix Social Security's long-run shortfall. (Nobody in either party has any real ideas what to do about Medicare.) What we've ended up with as a result is seemingly the worst of both approaches: A budget deficit that's expected to hit $423 billion this year, no progress on Social Security, and some regress (that is, a bigger gap between spending and income) on Medicare. As a card-carrying member of the mainstream media, I should at this point be expected to start ranting about irresponsible politicians and the dire state they've left our nation in. But here's the thing: We aren't in that obviously dire a state. The economy grew 3.5 percent last year; the unemployment rate is only 4.7 percent. It may not be the best of times for working Americans, beset as they are by outsourcing angst on the one side and high energy prices on the other. But it's not entirely fair to blame Congress and the president for that (although of course many people do). As for the deficit, the $423 billion projected for this year would be the biggest ever in dollar terms. But by the more reasonable standard of its share of gross domestic product it's 3.2 percent -- "well within the historical range,"as White House budget director Joshua Bolten put it in his turgid defense of the president's new budget in Monday's Wall Street Journal. In 1992 the deficit was 4.7 percent of GDP; in 1983 it was 6 percent; in 1943 it was 30.3 percent. 20 percent of GDP! Or not. Then there's the long-run prognosis. If you believe the reports of the trustees of the Medicare program in particular, it's really bad. They expect the program's cost to taxpayers to rise from 2.7 percent of GDP in 2005 to 6.8 percent by 2030 and 13.7 percent by 2080. Social Security, which currently eats up 4.3 percent of GDP, is projected to top out at just over 6 percent of GDP in the 2030s and stay there for at least half a century. Add those together and you get 20 percent of GDP going to the two programs by 2080. In 2005, the total federal tax burden was just 17.5 percent of GDP. If we don't want providing income and medical care to old people to become the sole function of our government, either taxes will have to rise substantially or Medicare and Social Security costs will have to be brought sharply in check. But is it reasonable to do something about this now? When President Bush proposed cutbacks to Social Security last year, Democratic critics correctly pointed out that projecting revenues and outlays 50 or even 10 years into the future is a wildly inexact science. There's still a lot to be said for being conservative about future Social Security commitments, given that it's a lot easier for today's 40-year-olds to prepare for an increase in the retirement age if they're told about it now rather than 25 years from now. With Medicare, though, it's hard to know what to make of the actuarial projections. The experience of the past few decades would seem to indicate that health care costs always go up. But they don't have to. Technological advances and political decisions down the road could either cut costs or send them ballooning. This is something our political system simply can't be expected to deal with intelligently right now. In other words, it's not so hard to see why Washington hasn't done much about either today's deficits or tomorrow's. Today's are of tolerable size, and tomorrow's are, well, tomorrow's. This is the problem with making budget deficits the focus of political discussion. The question shouldn't be whether we can manage a deficit of 3.2 percent of GDP, because we surely can, but what we're getting in return for it (because that money we're borrowing will have to be paid back someday). And it shouldn't be about whether Social Security and Medicare will eat up 20 percent of GDP in 2080, because who knows if that will be true, but how we can design a pension and health care system that's sustainable no matter where the demographic and cost trends lead. Anybody want to start that debate? ----------------------------------------------------- Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goofyjumper 0 #73 February 8, 2006 QuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteQuoteThe last time Bush gave you a tax refund, did you: 1) Cash the check, or; 2) Send it back and tell them to keep it for the sake of the deficit? I knew that question would come up eventually. Yes I did cash it and put it towards my college fund, because I knew we be having huge cuts eventually, and sure enough I was right! The statistics don't lie! So rather than stand on your principles, you helped contribute to the deficit, which you now criticize. Ok, you obvioulsy misunderstood what I was talking about. I was just saying that everone was bitching that Clinton fucked up the economy. I was also saying that the economy was oblvioulsy not that bad while clinton was in office. Bush gave us all these refunds and took credit for what Clinton help produce! Here is a graph showing the annual % change in US National Debt over the last few years. Republican administrations in red, Democrat in blue. Thanks, I am sure they (rebuplicans) will make some excuse though.----------------- I love and Miss you so much Honey! Orfun #3 ~ Darla Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
likearock 1 #74 February 8, 2006 Quote As for the deficit, the $423 billion projected for this year would be the biggest ever in dollar terms. But by the more reasonable standard of its share of gross domestic product it's 3.2 percent -- "well within the historical range,"as White House budget director Joshua Bolten put it in his turgid defense of the president's new budget in Monday's Wall Street Journal. In 1992 the deficit was 4.7 percent of GDP; in 1983 it was 6 percent; in 1943 it was 30.3 percent. 20 percent of GDP! Or not. The problem is not so much the deficit as the debt (a word that is conspicuously absent from this overly optimistic analysis). After all, that's the value we pay interest on. In fact, the debt is at record levels in comparison with the GDP as can be seen here. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
storm1977 0 #75 February 8, 2006 That is sorta silly..... It doesn't even make sense. The chart you put up shows government debt and household debt combined.... That is stupid first of all. They should NOT include personal debt in the argument, but if you are going to do that, atleast be clear on what that means.... Home ownership is the highest it has ever been in the USA. So, that means Americans have more "Debt" than they have ever had. Sure.... But it is not debt in the traditional sense. That debt is an investment which can be liquidated in difficult times.... I for instance own a 500,000 house. I still owe 300,000 on the mortgage. You could look at my case and say I am $300K in debt, but what you aren't looking at is the $200K in equity I have. If I turned around tomorrow and sold my house, I would no longer have any debt... infact, I would be $200K in the Black. So, your chart is really meaningless. ----------------------------------------------------- Sometimes it is more important to protect LIFE than Liberty Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
