nacmacfeegle 0 #51 January 14, 2005 "I find lying to be abad quality in a leader...Something Clinton and Kerry both do." And the Bush administration hasn't misled us at all, no siree..... Aw c'mon guys, how did we get to rep vs dem from administration of relief aid, surely not all the world's troubles come down to the Whitehouse. Not even I can pin this one on Dubbya, much as I'd like to. Have a good one guys, I'm off for a few beers before heading out to the Bay of Bengal next week, to try and do a little good for the folks there . Courtesy of that other great demon, Halliburton. Have a good weekend.-------------------- He who receives an idea from me, receives instruction himself without lessening mine; as he who lights his taper at mine, receives light without darkening me. Thomas Jefferson Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Botellines 0 #52 January 14, 2005 QuoteAnd at the time was the leader of the free world Sorry to hijack, but unless you consider the free world only the U.S, that is plain wrong, and even if you do. Last time i checked, France, UK, Spain, Germany, etc never had a Clinton president. To contribute to this thread, i would like to point out that the opinion of many republicans could be quite biased as the U.N decided not to brown nose shrubs little ass in his Irak adventure. Pretty much same thing that happens towards France, Germany, and in a minor scale Spain. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #53 January 14, 2005 QuoteSorry to hijack, but unless you consider the free world only the U.S, that is plain wrong, and even if you do. Last time i checked, France, UK, Spain, Germany, etc never had a Clinton president. Even the Liberals form other countries consider the US President to be the Biggest guy on the block. QuoteTo contribute to this thread, i would like to point out that the opinion of many republicans could be quite biased as the U.N decided not to brown nose shrubs little ass in his Irak adventure. Using that logic then the opinions of the liberals should not e considered since they hate Bush. And I don't like the UN since they don't do shit about anything. They pass resolutions then don't enforce them. They have done nothing about Sudan, and they were to busy lining their pockets with Oil money and selling blacklisted products to Iraq against their own rules."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Botellines 0 #54 January 15, 2005 QuoteEven the Liberals form other countries consider the US President to be the Biggest guy on the block. To be the president of the only actual superpower in the world, doesn´t make him leader of the free world. two diferent things.I know that that sentence is meant as an exageration and is not to be taken literally, but it is just plain wrong. QuoteUsing that logic then the opinions of the liberals should not be considered since they hate Bush. Liberals are biased against Bush, so yeah, my opinion has the same value than yours regarding to Bush, but we are talking here about the U.N. QuoteAnd I don't like the UN since they don't do shit about anything. They have helped other countries taking the diplomatic way rather than the military way, and that is a lot QuoteThey pass resolutions then don't enforce them. That is not the U.N task, the members must enforce them. By the way, how do you feel about the Veto option that your country has? Many resolutions would be enforced if only the U.S didn´t veto them. Would you prefer that all countries are equal rather than just a few having that power? Israel surely wouldn´t want to. Quote They have done nothing about Sudan, No one has done anything about Sudan, not even those countries that go out of the way to "help and liberate" others. Quoteand they were to busy lining their pockets with Oil money and selling blacklisted products to Iraq against their own rules. Do you realise that american companies took part in that scandal as well? You seem to forget that the U.S is part of the U.N, and share responsability for the good things as well as for the bad things. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #55 January 15, 2005 QuoteTo be the president of the only actual superpower in the world, doesn´t make him leader of the free world. two diferent things.I know that that sentence is meant as an exageration and is not to be taken literally, but it is just plain wrong. Well if you know it is not to be taken literally....Then why are you bitchingabout it? Just to bitch? QuoteLiberals are biased against Bush, so yeah, my opinion has the same value than yours regarding to Bush, but we are talking here about the U.N. We are talking about the UN, you brought up Bush. I didn't like the UN long before Bush was in office. They do very little and what they actually do they need the US's power and money to acomplish. QuoteThey have helped other countries taking the diplomatic way rather than the military way, and that is a lot Such as????? QuoteThat is not the U.N task, the members must enforce them. What good is an organizaton that does not follow its own rules? QuoteNo one has done anything about Sudan, not even those countries that go out of the way to "help and liberate" others Should not the UN be the one to do something? I mean the US gets bitched at no matter what it does. Also how long is the UN gonna wait to get involved? It has already been what 15 years of killing? They have not done shit about it...and they will contintue to do nothing. QuoteDo you realise that american companies took part in that scandal as well? American companies, not the Americans on the UN council. BIG difference."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
penniless 0 #56 January 15, 2005 QuoteQuoteSorry to hijack, but unless you consider the free world only the U.S, that is plain wrong, and even if you do. Last time i checked, France, UK, Spain, Germany, etc never had a Clinton president. Even the Liberals form other countries consider the US President to be the Biggest guy on the block. . Leadership is determined by qualities other than size. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Botellines 0 #57 January 15, 2005 QuoteWell if you know it is not to be taken literally....Then why are you bitchingabout it? Just to bitch? No. It is just that in this forums there are some people (not talking about you) that do take it literally and seems to think that the U.S is the only free country with the only democracy and the best and only workable economic system. So i just like to point out the falsehood of those statements. QuoteWe are talking about the UN, you brought up Bush. I didn't like the UN long before Bush was in office. They do very little and what they actually do they need the US's power and money to acomplish. They do a lot. See below for a list of things. You need to understand that the U.N was never made to further advance any country´s agenda. Before the Irak war, there wasn´t that much bitching about the U.N. Anyway, what do you propose as a substitute for the U.N. QuoteSuch as????? clicky QuoteShould not the UN be the one to do something? I mean the US gets bitched at no matter what it does. Specially if what it does involves the death of 1000+ americans and an indetermiated number of civilians. QuoteAlso how long is the UN gonna wait to get involved? It has already been what 15 years of killing? They have not done shit about it...and they will contintue to do nothing. Considering that the U.N depends of the military of its members, would you be willing to spare some troops from Irak and move them to Sudan? QuoteAmerican companies, not the Americans on the UN council. BIG difference. So take all the guys involved in the scandal, throw them to jail and replace them with more honest people. What you are proposing is the equivalent to ditch the whole U.S military because of the scandals in abu grahib. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jcd11235 0 #58 January 15, 2005 QuoteAnd I don't like the UN since they don't do shit about anything. They pass resolutions then don't enforce them. That was exactly the problem with the Articles of Confederation. Sooner or later, a similar solution will be implemented with respect to international government. As the world gets smaller and smaller and smaller . . .Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ron 7 #59 January 16, 2005 QuoteThey do a lot. See below for a list of things. You need to understand that the U.N was never made to further advance any country´s agenda. Before the Irak war, there wasn´t that much bitching about the U.N. There was plenty of bitching about the UN before the war. It just never made headlines. QuoteAnyway, what do you propose as a substitute for the U.N. Get rid of it. Why add ANOTHER layer of politics? Does the UN do anything that countries can't do without it? No. AS for your list of good the UN has done....Most of it is them taking credit for stuff they didn't do. #2 says they help remove the soviets from Afganistan????? What? BS. The war took a large toil on the Soviets, the UN didn't do anything. "The United Nations has used quiet diplomacy to avert imminent wars.'' UH, they ignored SH and his killing of his own people and members sold items that were banned to SH. They did a pretty piss poor job there. Sudan....Yeah they are doing good there. Also as you said the UN is nothing more than the member countries. So they are nothing without the members. So why are they needed? They are nothing. QuoteConsidering that the U.N depends of the military of its members, would you be willing to spare some troops from Irak and move them to Sudan? Sure. I would have even been more willing if the UN had not fucked up in Iraq so bad by not enforcing, or even following, its own resolutions. The UN is just ANOTHER level of political BS."No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Thomas Jefferson, Thomas Jefferson Papers, 334 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #60 January 16, 2005 QuoteSure. I would have even been more willing if the UN had not fucked up in Iraq so bad by not enforcing, or even following, its own resolutions. and now we know why, they were to busy getting rich and getting family members jobs. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
lou_lou 0 #61 January 17, 2005 That is if every country gives all the aid money they promised! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mnealtx 0 #62 January 17, 2005 probably about as well as you could trust Ricky Williams with your ounce of 'oregano'.... Mike I love you, Shannon and Jim. POPS 9708 , SCR 14706 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bodypilot90 0 #63 January 17, 2005 I sure I don't trust them with what they currently have, Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
