PhippsAT 0 #1 December 16, 2012 Hi every1! I just got my very first own rig a few weeks ago and along with that I asked myself, how long should my rig stay packed? I mean, if I pack everything, can it stay packed for like 2-3 weeks until I jump it the next time? Or would it be better to leave it unpacked and just repack it the day before I head out to the dropzone, so the material does not wear out too quickly or so? How are you guys doing this? Cheers! Phil Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
diablopilot 2 #2 December 16, 2012 QuoteHi every1! I just got my very first own rig a few weeks ago and along with that I asked myself, how long should my rig stay packed? I mean, if I pack everything, can it stay packed for like 2-3 weeks until I jump it the next time? Or would it be better to leave it unpacked and just repack it the day before I head out to the dropzone, so the material does not wear out too quickly or so? How are you guys doing this? Cheers! Phil You probably should know the answer to this, how long can your reserve stay packed?---------------------------------------------- You're not as good as you think you are. Seriously. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
theonlyski 3 #3 December 16, 2012 Quote Or would it be better to leave it unpacked and just repack it the day before I head out to the dropzone, so the material does not wear out too quickly or so? Believe it or not, generally speaking, packing is the part of the canopies life that wears out the fabric more than anything else. Doesn't matter when you pack it, so long as you're packing on a clean surface (clean carpet, grass without dog shit in it, so on)."I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
danornan 64 #4 December 16, 2012 QuoteQuote Believe it or not, generally speaking, packing is the part of the canopies life that wears out the fabric more than anything else. More than the ultraviolet light when it is open?Dano Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites theonlyski 3 #5 December 16, 2012 QuoteQuote Believe it or not, generally speaking, packing is the part of the canopies life that wears out the fabric more than anything else. More than the ultraviolet light when it is open? Go look at a couple year old tandem main. Chances are most of the damage is on the top skin center cell from packing. UV light does degrade the nylon, especially neons, but poor packing practices will generally damage it faster. I've seen reserves with less than 5 rides look like crap because of packing. (20 years worth of I&Rs)"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jimmytavino 16 #6 December 16, 2012 your rig should stay packed..... while you are getting it ON... all throughout the ride to altitude!!! Certainly .... while you are IN the door and throughout your entire skydive!!!It should become UNpacked!!!.... a split second ... AFTER you let go of your main Pilot Chute, !!!! got iT????!!!! good... p.s. congratulations on your first rig. fly it safely... jmy A 3914 NSCR 1817 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jimjumper 25 #7 December 16, 2012 Just for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Akokisa 0 #8 December 16, 2012 QuoteUV light does degrade the nylon, especially neons, but poor packing practices will generally damage it faster. Yes, UV light degrades nylon. And exposure to sunlight is apparant by fading colors. And neon colors seem to fade faster than other colors. All of this is true. But here's a question I have. Does faded neon mean that it's weaker than faded other colors, given that they've been exposed to the same amount of sunlight? In other words, is fading color really a good indicator of the degree of weakening of fthe fabric? Let's say you have an orange end cell, and the next one inward is black. The orange is faded, but the black is not. Since we're not talking about a center cell that gets most of the wear and exposure during packing, those two cells should be equal in wear and exposure. So, does the fact that the orange is faded, necessarily mean it's weaker than the black? Or is this just a characteristic of that particular color, and really doesn't correlate to the degree of strength? Or is it that the black would be just as weak as the orange, but just doesn't show it from fading color. Therefore, we can use the neon colors as an indicator of the strength of the entire canopy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites riggerpaul 1 #9 December 16, 2012 QuoteJust for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! Then again, the US FARs say that the main should be packed within 180 days. FAR 105.43(a) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NeonLights 0 #10 December 16, 2012 QuoteJust for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! I am not suprised. When a parachute is packed inside of a rig enclosed by cordura, it tends to stay put....And of stored properly should last a LONG time with no problems. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites danornan 64 #11 December 16, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuote Believe it or not, generally speaking, packing is the part of the canopies life that wears out the fabric more than anything else. More than the ultraviolet light when it is open? Go look at a couple year old tandem main. Chances are most of the damage is on the top skin center cell from packing. UV light does degrade the nylon, especially neons, but poor packing practices will generally damage it faster. I've seen reserves with less than 5 rides look like crap because of packing. (20 years worth of I&Rs) Thanks - I appreciate information and always willing to learn.Dano Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zymurdoo 0 #12 December 17, 2012 QuoteQuoteJust for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! I am not suprised. When a parachute is packed inside of a rig enclosed by cordura, it tends to stay put....And of stored properly should last a LONG time with no problems. I have seen more than one main canopy retain it's brick shape after being packed for longer than a year (Granted this was on the floor and not at terminal airspeeds). Some Zero P fabrics have a tendency to stick together when packed for an extended time. It is my understanding that this is part of the reason that reserves are made from F-111 materials. Edited to add: Check out this recent article from Sandy Reid at Rigging Innovations regarding reserve materials and a 20 year old pack job. http://www.rigginginnovations.com/Pages/Posts/ViewPost.aspx?ID=8Blue Skies, Soft Docks and Happy Landings! CWR #23 (It's called CRW, add an e if you like, but I ain't calling it CFS. FU FAI!) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites NWFlyer 2 #13 December 17, 2012 Since no one directly answered your question, 2-3 weeks is no big deal at all. Mine regularly stay packed for that length of time between visits to the dropzone, especially in the slower months of the year. It's a lot easier for me to store my gear in a cat-proof location in my apartment when it's packed up, so I tend to go home with my rig packed even if I'm not coming back for a while."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites skydiverek 55 #14 December 17, 2012 QuoteSome Zero P fabrics have a tendency to stick together when packed for an extended time. It is my understanding that this is part of the reason that reserves are made from F-111 materials. Read this from PD: http://www.performancedesigns.com/faq.asp#17 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites PhippsAT 0 #15 December 17, 2012 QuoteSince no one directly answered your question, 2-3 weeks is no big deal at all. Mine regularly stay packed for that length of time between visits to the dropzone, especially in the slower months of the year. It's a lot easier for me to store my gear in a cat-proof location in my apartment when it's packed up, so I tend to go home with my rig packed even if I'm not coming back for a while. Well, I kinda got way more info than I wanted to in the first place, hehe. Very happy about all those responses though :D Thanks guys! Ok, perfect. Then I will just leave it packed for in between my visits to the dropzone. Thanks for ya help! Phil Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Martini 0 #16 December 18, 2012 I once unpacked an X-braced canopy that had been packed in a very tight container for over a year. This particular canopy was a known sniveler, commonly 1000-1500 feet. When unpacked it not only retained it's brick shape but took 15 minutes of prying to get it flaked out. The canopy would not have opened in time to be useful. OTOH I have jumped another canopy that was packed for a year and opened just fine. Based on these experiences I would find it difficult to make a blanket statement on how long a canopy should stay packed.Sometimes you eat the bear.............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Bertt 0 #17 December 19, 2012 You know what really degrades nylon? Leaving an unpacked canopy lying around where the cat can piss on it. It really doesn't matter if you pack before you leave the dropzone, or if you leave the canopy unpacked, but at least put it in a duffel bag or something that will protect it as it lies in the closet.You don't have to outrun the bear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Krip 2 #18 December 19, 2012 Quote Quote Just for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! I am not suprised. When a parachute is packed inside of a rig enclosed by cordura, it tends to stay put....And of stored properly should last a LONG time with no problems. Hi Neon In a ideal world your rig sould only stay packed for 5 days because your jumping every weekendI know a dude very well who quit jumping for seven years. Left the rig packed in his walk in closet. In a gear bag. When he finally got the urge to get his knee's in the breeze he got a fresh reserve pack job. The rubbers looked good on the reserve, the reserve canopy flaked nicely. So he jumped the sabre one that had about 400 jumps on it at terminal and guess what. I oops me be bad, "He" didn't have to use his reserve.WARNING: if you leave your gear in a damp basement, a car trunk, or a hot attic or any other harsh enviroment for any length of time etc etc YMMV. I also recommend being current on your EP's and a current reseve pack job to be on the safe side.One Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites scoodenbuzz 0 #19 December 20, 2012 My Sabre 2 only had 30 jumps on it and was packed for 6 yrs in the bag. Hand unpacked like a brick for the Cypres service and left opened and aired for 8 weeks over winter before jumping. No problems whatsoever.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. 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theonlyski 3 #5 December 16, 2012 QuoteQuote Believe it or not, generally speaking, packing is the part of the canopies life that wears out the fabric more than anything else. More than the ultraviolet light when it is open? Go look at a couple year old tandem main. Chances are most of the damage is on the top skin center cell from packing. UV light does degrade the nylon, especially neons, but poor packing practices will generally damage it faster. I've seen reserves with less than 5 rides look like crap because of packing. (20 years worth of I&Rs)"I may be a dirty pirate hooker...but I'm not about to go stand on the corner." iluvtofly DPH -7, TDS 578, Muff 5153, SCR 14890 I'm an asshole, and I approve this message Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimmytavino 16 #6 December 16, 2012 your rig should stay packed..... while you are getting it ON... all throughout the ride to altitude!!! Certainly .... while you are IN the door and throughout your entire skydive!!!It should become UNpacked!!!.... a split second ... AFTER you let go of your main Pilot Chute, !!!! got iT????!!!! good... p.s. congratulations on your first rig. fly it safely... jmy A 3914 NSCR 1817 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jimjumper 25 #7 December 16, 2012 Just for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Akokisa 0 #8 December 16, 2012 QuoteUV light does degrade the nylon, especially neons, but poor packing practices will generally damage it faster. Yes, UV light degrades nylon. And exposure to sunlight is apparant by fading colors. And neon colors seem to fade faster than other colors. All of this is true. But here's a question I have. Does faded neon mean that it's weaker than faded other colors, given that they've been exposed to the same amount of sunlight? In other words, is fading color really a good indicator of the degree of weakening of fthe fabric? Let's say you have an orange end cell, and the next one inward is black. The orange is faded, but the black is not. Since we're not talking about a center cell that gets most of the wear and exposure during packing, those two cells should be equal in wear and exposure. So, does the fact that the orange is faded, necessarily mean it's weaker than the black? Or is this just a characteristic of that particular color, and really doesn't correlate to the degree of strength? Or is it that the black would be just as weak as the orange, but just doesn't show it from fading color. Therefore, we can use the neon colors as an indicator of the strength of the entire canopy? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerpaul 1 #9 December 16, 2012 QuoteJust for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! Then again, the US FARs say that the main should be packed within 180 days. FAR 105.43(a) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NeonLights 0 #10 December 16, 2012 QuoteJust for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! I am not suprised. When a parachute is packed inside of a rig enclosed by cordura, it tends to stay put....And of stored properly should last a LONG time with no problems. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
danornan 64 #11 December 16, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuote Believe it or not, generally speaking, packing is the part of the canopies life that wears out the fabric more than anything else. More than the ultraviolet light when it is open? Go look at a couple year old tandem main. Chances are most of the damage is on the top skin center cell from packing. UV light does degrade the nylon, especially neons, but poor packing practices will generally damage it faster. I've seen reserves with less than 5 rides look like crap because of packing. (20 years worth of I&Rs) Thanks - I appreciate information and always willing to learn.Dano Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zymurdoo 0 #12 December 17, 2012 QuoteQuoteJust for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! I am not suprised. When a parachute is packed inside of a rig enclosed by cordura, it tends to stay put....And of stored properly should last a LONG time with no problems. I have seen more than one main canopy retain it's brick shape after being packed for longer than a year (Granted this was on the floor and not at terminal airspeeds). Some Zero P fabrics have a tendency to stick together when packed for an extended time. It is my understanding that this is part of the reason that reserves are made from F-111 materials. Edited to add: Check out this recent article from Sandy Reid at Rigging Innovations regarding reserve materials and a 20 year old pack job. http://www.rigginginnovations.com/Pages/Posts/ViewPost.aspx?ID=8Blue Skies, Soft Docks and Happy Landings! CWR #23 (It's called CRW, add an e if you like, but I ain't calling it CFS. FU FAI!) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NWFlyer 2 #13 December 17, 2012 Since no one directly answered your question, 2-3 weeks is no big deal at all. Mine regularly stay packed for that length of time between visits to the dropzone, especially in the slower months of the year. It's a lot easier for me to store my gear in a cat-proof location in my apartment when it's packed up, so I tend to go home with my rig packed even if I'm not coming back for a while."There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
skydiverek 55 #14 December 17, 2012 QuoteSome Zero P fabrics have a tendency to stick together when packed for an extended time. It is my understanding that this is part of the reason that reserves are made from F-111 materials. Read this from PD: http://www.performancedesigns.com/faq.asp#17 Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
PhippsAT 0 #15 December 17, 2012 QuoteSince no one directly answered your question, 2-3 weeks is no big deal at all. Mine regularly stay packed for that length of time between visits to the dropzone, especially in the slower months of the year. It's a lot easier for me to store my gear in a cat-proof location in my apartment when it's packed up, so I tend to go home with my rig packed even if I'm not coming back for a while. Well, I kinda got way more info than I wanted to in the first place, hehe. Very happy about all those responses though :D Thanks guys! Ok, perfect. Then I will just leave it packed for in between my visits to the dropzone. Thanks for ya help! Phil Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Martini 0 #16 December 18, 2012 I once unpacked an X-braced canopy that had been packed in a very tight container for over a year. This particular canopy was a known sniveler, commonly 1000-1500 feet. When unpacked it not only retained it's brick shape but took 15 minutes of prying to get it flaked out. The canopy would not have opened in time to be useful. OTOH I have jumped another canopy that was packed for a year and opened just fine. Based on these experiences I would find it difficult to make a blanket statement on how long a canopy should stay packed.Sometimes you eat the bear.............. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bertt 0 #17 December 19, 2012 You know what really degrades nylon? Leaving an unpacked canopy lying around where the cat can piss on it. It really doesn't matter if you pack before you leave the dropzone, or if you leave the canopy unpacked, but at least put it in a duffel bag or something that will protect it as it lies in the closet.You don't have to outrun the bear. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Krip 2 #18 December 19, 2012 Quote Quote Just for your peace of mind, I watched a guy jump a 3 year old pack job on a hop-n-pop. He said it opened a little slow but was fine! I am not suprised. When a parachute is packed inside of a rig enclosed by cordura, it tends to stay put....And of stored properly should last a LONG time with no problems. Hi Neon In a ideal world your rig sould only stay packed for 5 days because your jumping every weekendI know a dude very well who quit jumping for seven years. Left the rig packed in his walk in closet. In a gear bag. When he finally got the urge to get his knee's in the breeze he got a fresh reserve pack job. The rubbers looked good on the reserve, the reserve canopy flaked nicely. So he jumped the sabre one that had about 400 jumps on it at terminal and guess what. I oops me be bad, "He" didn't have to use his reserve.WARNING: if you leave your gear in a damp basement, a car trunk, or a hot attic or any other harsh enviroment for any length of time etc etc YMMV. I also recommend being current on your EP's and a current reseve pack job to be on the safe side.One Jump Wonder Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
scoodenbuzz 0 #19 December 20, 2012 My Sabre 2 only had 30 jumps on it and was packed for 6 yrs in the bag. Hand unpacked like a brick for the Cypres service and left opened and aired for 8 weeks over winter before jumping. No problems whatsoever.. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
