sundevil777 93 #26 December 21, 2003 Counseling services are likely available from your health insurance provider. It is going to be difficult for you this election year, I understand.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #27 December 21, 2003 Quote I know you just hate to face your past.. look up the history of the Klan...I sure as hell bet they will not be voting for ANY democratic or Green party candidates... . Did you even read what I wrote?I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #28 December 21, 2003 ?????Your comments "could" have been right on target, except for the following facts: 1) I'm not a US citizen. Being a resident allows me to "currently" serve in the armed forces, in which I have been already been recommended for early promotion, and am 9 days shy of the 84 days requirement to be able to go abroad and be part of the relief to our troops in Iraq. 2) I am hispanic. 3) based on #1, I am not a Republican. 4) I could never ever be accepted in the Klan, my skin color as well as my accent will make it impossible, to pass on as a person able to close my fist, shave my head, and scream "WHITE POWER" in a subtle and disgusing manner. 5) I just ask you, where is your hate coming from, not asking for it. Is it possible you can level the discussion and behave like a lady you wish treated as? Merry x-mas and blue skies. 2)"According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #29 December 21, 2003 QuoteCounseling services are likely available from your health insurance provider. It is going to be difficult for you this election year, I understand. ROFLMAO...."According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #30 December 21, 2003 Quote3) based on #1, I am not a Republican. You can identify yourself as supporting any political party you want, whether you can vote or not. A Russian (now US citizen) friend thought it unusual that we do not need to officially "join" one of the political parties in order to be considered a Dem/Repub/whatever.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #31 December 21, 2003 QuoteQuote3) based on #1, I am not a Republican. You can identify yourself as supporting any political party you want, whether you can vote or not. A Russian (now US citizen) friend thought it unusual that we do not need to officially "join" one of the political parties in order to be considered a Dem/Repub/whatever. And if the left had its way, we would, comrad.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Michele 1 #32 December 21, 2003 QuoteAnd dont you FUCKING dare accuse me of being unamerican you ULTRA right wing sorry excuse for a human being Wow. Jeanne, that was uncalled for. Really. That is seriously a horrible thing to say. You make some interesting points about racism in this post, but I can't take you seriously when you say things like that. When everything goes black and white, and everything is right and wrong, there is NO room to learn, or to exchange ideas. There is no room for perspective, or personal experience, or expression of self. What is not being heard here is that each side has their points. I personally find the connection between Howard Dean and the racist comments purportedly made at a fundraiser to be a significant problem, and I don't care what party he is in...but if you look at some of the things posted recently, such as the resurgence (by one man) of the Balck Panther party, and no outcry is made...or the post belittling Mumia, you start to see that it's endemic to all areas, parties, and genders in this country. It does not respect party lines - one party is no better than another. Both use the fear issues; both rile the constituency. Kudos to those who do not run a race based campaign, nor have a race based administration... Ciels- Michele ~Do Angels keep the dreams we seek While our hearts lie bleeding?~ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #33 December 21, 2003 If you look at that statement Turtle that was directed at SunDevil. He obviously is unaware of that history. I did read what you wrote QuoteI was brought up in a racist family. All the elders that I was supposed to listen to and respect beat into my head that it was wrong to befriend anyone of color. If you have had to overcome an obstacle like that, you would find your blanket statement as insulting as I did. I was also around plenty of racists in my family when I was growing up. There is one whole branch of them in the Ocala FL area and Perry area of FL that we refer to as " the sheet wearin folk" Thankfully I got away from that and to travel.. and meet other people of many races and colors and cultures. If the right wing as embodied by the Republican party .. and many of the former Dixiecrats who fled to their ranks...I find many things they embody insulting.. as I find commments constantly on here insulting.. Be a big boy and get over it. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest #34 December 21, 2003 IBTL - mh"The mouse does not know life until it is in the mouth of the cat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #35 December 21, 2003 QuoteA Russian (now US citizen) friend thought it unusual that we do not need to officially "join" one of the political parties in order to be considered a Dem/Repub/whatever. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- And if the left had its way, we would, comrad. Why? If I still lived in Seattle we could discuss this in person, but then I would be constantly worried about having a job (left Boeing in '95 with a few thousand other engineers).People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #36 December 21, 2003 QuoteIf you look at that statement Turtle that was directed at SunDevil. He obviously is unaware of that history. You are wrong. I consider myself a Repub because of their current position on the issues of the day, not because of what they stood for in the past, and won't be bullied away from this support by attempts to make me feel guilty about the past.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #37 December 21, 2003 QuoteBe a big boy and get over it. I'm a little puzzeled. Why all the harsh words. I pointed out to you what the "raw nerve" was, you asked. You, however, seem to want to throw down and cant quite get the rational conversation thing. If you notice, I have not insulted anyone's "Excuse for being a human being" In response to this post, you are missing (actually I think you are convieniently ignoring) the part that I said that most of my family VOTES DEMOCRATIC. That is why I asked you if you read what I wrote. It would seem it very convienient of you to ignore that as it degrades your argument. I one of TWO republicans that I am aware of in my immediate family. (My grandfather is the other) That family consists of my grandfathers 13 brothers and sisters, from there there are approximately 50 other members that would negate your argument. And by the way, you might want to check out this link, since we are talking about who supports who and what party advocates what. Cheers.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #38 December 21, 2003 Quote1) I'm not a US citizen. Being a resident allows me to "currently" serve in the armed forces, in which I have been already been recommended for early promotion, and am 9 days shy of the 84 days requirement to be able to go abroad and be part of the relief to our troops in Iraq. 2) I am hispanic. 3) based on #1, I am not a Republican. 4) I could never ever be accepted in the Klan, my skin color as well as my accent will make it impossible, to pass on as a person able to close my fist, shave my head, and scream "WHITE POWER" in a subtle and disgusing manner. 5) I just ask you, where is your hate coming from, not asking for it. Is it possible you can level the discussion and behave like a lady you wish treated as? Point by point... I know you are not a US Citizen.. but you are doing like so many before have done.. taking the fast track to US Citizenship by serving this country..for WHATEVER your reasons. THat is GOOD.. I applaud your service in this time of SO MANY who can't be bothered to do so... and so many of those CHICKENHAWKS are the SUPER PATRIOTS willing to send other people off to war instead of their children or themselves. I have seen several of your posts referring to your hispanic background.. as a minority in this country you are subject to many things that most good americans of northern european descent will never have to face. It's obvious from your posts you wholeheartedly support the ULTRA RIGHT.. and have a racist bent in some of those posts. I have seen you refer to the people this administration is trying to "liberate" as towel heads. You are going to be putting your life on the line for those "towel Heads" when you head over to Iraq. I guess being part of the military its necessary to dehuminize your enemy. I mean in my generations war the enemy was called gooks, slants, slopes.. Mr. Victor Charlie... etc. My fathers enemy were referred to as nips, japs, krauts etc. My grandfathers enemy was the Huns... and demonized in various ways. His grandfathers enemy was them damn yankees or bluebellies. Yes He and his brothers and cousins were Johnny Rebs. Some of them died in that war. His Grandfather fought the British in the militia of South Carolina. So when your citizenship comes thru.. I would lay odds you will be right there registering as a republican. No you would not be accepted into the Klan.. but in this case.... they are also almost all good ole boy republicans at least the ones who are no so totally anti american that they refuse to participate at all in the american elections. There used to be a lot more of them but they have a party in power that they find SO MUCH common ground now they actually have come in from the cold. Where is my hate coming from... I do not allow hate into my heart....so it is not hate.. its learned disdain from people on the far right who will take this country down a path it has never been before. It is disdain for the PSUEDO-RIGHTEOUS who obviously have not read or follow what Christ actually taught on how to live with other human beings no matter who they are. Its disdain for people like in the article I posted. People who.. because I appear to be one of those good "white" americans... they seem to feel they need to include me in thier racist or sexist comments and humor. And as far as my being a lady which I find to be a VERY SEXIST comment... .. then do not accuse me of being a terrorist sympathizer or you will find out JUST how UNLADYLIKE I can be. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #39 December 21, 2003 QuoteWow. Jeanne, that was uncalled for. Really. That is seriously a horrible thing to say. You make some interesting points about racism in this post, but I can't take you seriously when you say things like that. Michele. I get really really tired of getting this.. if you aint with us you is against us attitude from the FAR right. and for ANYONE who.. as Juane alluded to accuses me of being someone who should be in GITMO.. I find it very disturbing. As an american I find this current bent of anti-american behavior in the silencing of dissent as a dangerous trend. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheAnvil 0 #40 December 21, 2003 QuoteI feel disgust for ANYONE who espouses racism in ANY FORM... Yet you support racial discrimination in the form of Affirmative Action. Odd. This article was written by a hate-monger with an axe to grind with Republicans. I'd wager he's incapable of completing the following sentence: 'I support racial discrimination because....' Let's examine what he has to say: Quote Personal Voices: Republicans Don't Really Care about Improving Race Relations Race relations. What a phrase. Like there is anything different necessary when dealing with someone of another race - obviously there is for him. Inauspicious beginning to a civil rights related article. Quote Because of my whitebread appearance, many white Republicans have felt comfortable enough around me during various times in my adult life to let their guard down and express their true feelings on matters of race. Ahhh...he identifies himself by his race and assumes that others do as well. What a guy. Quote Trent Lott is only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to racism in the Republican Party. Trent Lott racist? Accusation presented - proof not. Quote I can't count the number of times some Anglo conservative has used the N-word in reference to African-Americans in front of me, even toward those they root for, such as Dallas Cowboys running back Emmitt Smith. And how many times is the word used in rap music? Harlem Nights? By the comedians at the Dean Hatefest? By Bob Byrd? OH! It's only bad if a white republican uses the word. This guy judges people by their race. Hard to argue that he's not racially prejudiced. Oh BOY what a great guy to author an essay on civil rights. Quote I can't count the number of racial "jokes" or references some white City Council member, police officer, businessman or other establishment figure – whom I know to be a Republican – has told to my face. Why does their race matter to him? OH! I know! He's racially prejudiced. We already established that, didn't we? How silly of me to forget. Quote I've sat at high school football games in Republican-dominated towns as Anglo adults in the stands taunted the lone black player on the opposing team using the N-word. Give us a town and date, would you? How he knew the folks making the comments were Republicans? Oh! He notices peoples races again. Man, his racial prejudice just pervades this article. Quote I've attended all-white meetings – as a reporter, not a participant – at which elitist Republicans have discussed getting around the Voting Rights Act by lobbying for requirements that voters have to own property. I didn't need someone to spell out what they were talking about – they wanted some way to keep blacks from voting. Again that race thing. Let's get a date on this too. How long has teh VRA been in effect? Quote... but they have been replaced with subtle, back-door racism that persists in still all-white country clubs and subdivisions in the suburbs. Examples please. Which country club? Which subdivision? Who has been denied on basis of race? Quote Sure, the white racists around here used to be mostly Democrats, who hated Lincoln-style Republicans who forced Reconstruction on them after the Civil War. But most of those have left the Democratic Party for the friendlier-for-them confines of the Republican Party, where they don't have to rub elbows with African-Americans at the multicultural Democratic functions that contrast with Republican events like black and white keys on a piano. Al Sharpton is a candidate for the Democratic Presidential nomination and this buffoon claims the REPUBLICAN party is friendly to racists? Gimme a break! Quote Name a white public figure who espouses racist views, and the vast majority of the time he or she is affiliated with the Republican Party. David Duke, the former Klansman and Louisiana state representative, chaired the Republican Parish Executive Committee of the largest Republican parish in Louisiana as late as 2000, when he skipped the country and eventually was convicted of fraud and tax evasion. Duke is ostricized from the Republican party, genius boy. Al Sharpton is a presidential candidate. Byrd - Dem. Senate Majority Leader. See a difference? Duhhhh. Name some Republican racists you can actually PROVE are racists. Oh - prove without lying. Quote Many Republicans are associated with the openly racist Council for Conservative Citizens, including outgoing Georgia Congressman Bob Barr, who has spoken before the segregationist group, and Republican National Committee leader Buddy Witherspoon, who has resisted calls that he resign his CCC membership. CCC again. MeCHA ring a bell? Compare and contrast the mottos of the two and say hello to Mr. Bustamante whilst doing your MeCHA research. CCC doesn't have my support or approval, by the way. QuoteAs the site, evilGOPbastards.com points out, Supreme Court Chief Justice William Rehnquist, a Republican, launched his career as a GOP operative in 1964 by harassing black voters. And a few years earlier Truman financially supported the KKK, as his recent biography attests. Did that make him a bad president? I'd never heard that about Rehnquist and would love a reference. Unlike the democratic party, Rehnquist is generally an opponent of racial discrimination these days, FYI. Quote Republican Attorney General John Ashcroft opposed racial integration and the appointment of African Americans to offices as Missouri governor Lying Liberal Coward. No other way to put it. Quote Dubya Bush himself spoke before the segregationist Bob Jones University in South Carolina, genuflected before the Confederate flag, and helped implement the racist Willie Horton ad during the 1988 presidential campaign of Bush Sr., who approved the racist ad after lobbying by his son. The ad was racist, eh? LMFAO. Genuflected before the confederate flag and what else? Pathetic. Utterly pathetic. Quote Both Bushes have appointed many racists – both subtle and overt – to high offices, who now work to further erode civil rights. Name them. QuoteCheney supported apartheid in the racist South African regime, even as it crumbled. Reference it. I claim this dude is a liar. Quote Who can forget the Florida 2000 recount battle, when white supremacists rallied for Republicans who embraced their support? What about Florida Republican Gov. Jeb Bush and former Bush state campaign co-chair, Secretary of State (now Congresswoman) Katherine Harris' openly racist system of purges before the 2000 election that took the names of mostly African-American voters off the rolls? FL recount again. The only time race became a factor was when demoKKKlanic idiot boy Jesse Jackson came in and made it a factor with his lies. Quote What about the police roadblocks near black precincts on election days? One roadblock in the vicinity where more whites were accosted than blacks, genius. This guy is really a buffoon. Quote And how about the Republican warnings in communities across the country about impending black voter fraud that usually occur a few days before an election, not to mention misleading fliers circulated by Republican operatives in African-American neighborhoods telling them of different days to vote or wrongly trying to intimidate them against voting by warning that their criminal backgrounds and parking tickets will be checked? What the hell? I want the reference on this. WHat a moron. This would have been all over the news. QuoteRepublicans still think highly enough of Lott to make him chairman of the Senate Rules Committee, despite his public banishment as Senate Majority Leader and a racist record that includes far more than a few errant comments. In light of Byrd and Sharpton, how can ANYONE take this guy seriously? IDIOT. Quote As our last elected president, Bill Clinton, Bush won every count. Try again. Buffoon. Quote And as Jack Hughes of evilGOPbastards.com writes, the majority of Republican senators who elected Lott as their leader "must either share his views [which were so often repeated that nobody could plead ignorance of Lott's sympathies], or were at the very least 'comfortable' with a leader that held those beliefs." So all the democrats were comfortable with Byrd's? Is this an admission of democratic support for the KKK? Hmmm...they sure hate Catholics when abortion is being discussed...they support racial discrimination....sure seems that's the case, doesn't it? Quote Indeed, many senators, such as new Majority Leader Bill Frist and Don Nickles, the first Senate Republican to call for Lott's resignation as majority leader, have civil rights voting records nearly identical to Lott's, according to the NAACP. NAACP - an organization that supports racial discrimination. Quote Frist has his own racial skeletons. He was a member of the all-white Belle Meade Country Club in Nashville, Tenn., before running for the Senate in 1994. Why does this guy CARE what color anyone is? What the racial breakdown of any private group is? Because he's racially prejudiced - BINGO! QuoteSome believe the National Republican Senatorial Committee headed by Frist was behind the intimidation of minority voters in recent years. Minority voter intimidation. What were the stats on minority voter turnout again? LMFAO. If there was intimidation, it doesn't seem to have worked. I say there was none orchestrated by the RNC. QuoteThen there is Republican Sen. George Allen of Virginia, who as governor of that state, issued a proclamation recognizing "Confederate History and Heritage Month." Allen, the new National Republican Senatorial Committee chairman, also displays a Confederate flag in his living room, according to a recent New York Times column. Confederate Flag=racist. What an idiot. Quote Moving over to the U.S. House, there is Cass Ballenger. The white Republican from North Carolina recently told the Charlotte Observer that he had "segregationist" feelings and called former U.S. Rep. Cynthia McKinney, an African-American Democrat from Georgia, a "bitch." Segregationist feelings when, exactly? And calling someone from another race a name doesn't make one a racists. Given Ms. McKinney's actions, I wholeheartedly agree with the man - and unlike the democratic party, I neither judge anyone by their race nor support programs that do likewise. Quote In an ensuing radio interview, Ballenger, the Deputy Majority Whip and a member of the House Republican Steering Committee (who has a black lawn jockey in his yard that an aide recently painted white), refused to apologize to McKinney, calling her divisive, pushy, and "less than patriotic." WRT McKinney - damned straight. and why the hell does this moron CARE what color a lawn jockey is? I KNOW! I keep forgetting! He's RACIALLY PREJUDICED! Quote "One must wonder whether [Ballenger] would have made the same statement about a white congressman he considered to be pushy or divisive," said Kim Gandy, president of the National Organization of Women. "I think not. His statements demonstrated beliefs about race and gender that do not belong in the U.S. Congress." These people WONDER why we conservatives give them no credibility? Quote Rep. Tom Craddick, the new Texas House Republican leader, was one of a small group to vote against establishing a Martin Luther King Jr. state holiday in 1987. He repeated his opposition to the holiday in a 1991 vote that clarified the day. Unlike Lott, Craddick has yet to publicly apologize for those votes. Why the hell should he? Opposing any piece of legislation supported by minorities isn't indicative of racism. Try again. Quote That's why I call Republicans like Bush and Cheney and William Bennett closet racists; they publicly embrace Martin Luther King Jr. as they call for a colorblind society, yet live in their mostly-white neighborhoods and practice racism when it suits their political agenda. Bennet was physically assaulted for his support of MLK! What a MORON! Dear Jesus this guy is an idiot! Why does he CARE what color anyone living in Bennett's neigborhood is - or Bush or Cheney's? Quote They like to point out that lynching black people is wrong as they oppose proposals that would do more to bring about real equality, and conduct racist campaigns – as Bush did against McCain in South Carolina in 2000 – to gain political victory. OK - WHAT proposals? Bush's 2000 campaign racist? Has this guy HEARD Sharptons? Gore's? The entire CBC sponsored DNC primary debate? IDIOT. Quote The subtle and overt racism of the Republican Party is a stench they have to live with. To eradicate that smell, they must admit that racism in their party goes far beyond Lott and make at least as much progress on advancing race relations as the Democratic Party has. Pshaw. Completely delusional. This guy should be on a morphine drip because it has to HURT being that stupid.Vinny the Anvil Post Traumatic Didn't Make The Lakers Syndrome is REAL JACKASS POWER!!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #41 December 21, 2003 Quote as Juane alluded to accuses me of being someone who should be in GITMO.. I find it very disturbing. As an american I find this current bent of anti-american behavior in the silencing of dissent as a dangerous trend. Well Jeanne, I am quoting my exact wording, and I do not allude or accuse you should be in GITMO. 3 straight questions, not a single answer yet. I don't see the Demise of Democratic values, a military take over, and the press and people are still free to say anything they wish against GWB. Just like you. You still enjoy your freedoms, and still go on about what you like to do, and travel wherever you want, I see no restrictions about the liberties of people. QuoteWhere is all the hate you have coming from?Are you a candidate for Gitmo? Where is the impending demise of democratic values, and a military take over?. "According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #42 December 21, 2003 Thank you SO much for devoting your time and energy to make that rebuttal. On a different but related subject, Did you ever hear the speech Farakkhan delivered at the 'almost' million man march? I think it was about 2.5 hours long, and he started to go on about how the number 19 was so important in the history of American racism (he's into numerology). The 2nd and 17th president... This part of his philosophy gets a pass from most Dan Blather and others, along with his many racist statements. I think Farakkhan is a racist, and nuts.People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FallRate 0 #43 December 21, 2003 QuoteYes there is racism within minority groups How many of them do you need to lynch to make them not have those attitudes. I hope this doesn't sound like a personal attack. But have you considered medication!? FallRate Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #44 December 21, 2003 ITs very simple. You asked if I was a candidate for Gitmo.. that is a DIRECT result of this whole right wing neo-McCarthyism that is rampant in this country. If I do not agree with the current administration then I am anti-american and unpatriotic....WRONG. http://www.dropzone.com/cgi-bin/forum/gforum.cgi?post=635231#635231 With the powers the government got when that travesty of fear the Patriot Act was passed they can disappear people at will without any sort of real proof.. just suspicion...something going back to the 1200's in English law called Habeas Corpus requires due process. Jose Padilla comes to mind.. he may be part of Al Queda or support it.. I think he should be off the streets if this is the case.. BUT put it in the courts.. in the light of day.. do not just dissapear people by the thousands as they did in Pinochet's Chile or in Argentina in the 1970's http://www.yendor.com/vanished/ or http://www.yendor.com/vanished/junta.html or http://www.lakota.clara.net/ This is the kind of thing that could be in our very near future. Even Gen Tommy Franks knows its coming. http://www.newsmax.com/archives/articles/2003/11/20/185048.shtml And the reason I no longer supported Reagan.. who I voted for when he allowed the whole Iran Contra affair and the shadow government that was at play at the time... http://www.afn.org/~dks/i-c/x-discourse/draper.html So its not a very far stretch for good old South American style politics to occur here if the people of this country are not dilligent. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sundevil777 93 #45 December 21, 2003 QuoteEven Gen Tommy Franks knows its coming. I think what he is saying is that there are circumstance where martial law may be needed to counter an attack on our country. This is quite different than what you imply. Since you refer to Gen Franks for wisdom; his opinion of our president, from the article you referenced: President Bush: “As I look at President Bush, I think he will ultimately be judged as a man of extremely high character. A very thoughtful man, not having been appraised properly by those who would say he’s not very smart. I find the contrary. I think he’s very, very bright. And I suspect that he’ll be judged as a man who led this country through a crease in history effectively. Probably we’ll think of him in years to come as an American hero.” On the motivation for the Iraq war: Contrary to claims that top Pentagon brass opposed the invasion of Iraq, Franks said he wholeheartedly agreed with the president’s decision to invade Iraq and oust Saddam Hussein. “I, for one, begin with intent. ... There is no question that Saddam Hussein had intent to do harm to the Western alliance and to the United States of America. That intent is confirmed in a great many of his speeches, his commentary, the words that have come out of the Iraqi regime over the last dozen or so years. So we have intent. “If we know for sure ... that a regime has intent to do harm to this country, and if we have something beyond a reasonable doubt that this particular regime may have the wherewithal with which to execute the intent, what are our actions and orders as leaders in this country?”People are sick and tired of being told that ordinary and decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I’m certainly not, and I’m sick and tired of being told that I am Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #46 December 21, 2003 QuoteI consider myself a Repub because of their current position on the issues of the day, not because of what they stood for in the past, and won't be bullied away from this support by attempts to make me feel guilty about the past I always considered my self an independent and voted for the best candidate... not for a political party. I voted for Ronald Reagan... I voted for Richard Nixon. I admired John F Kennedy and took to heart his call to do something for my country. The current republican party includes too many people I do not wish to be associated with.Many of those people hold your same values that are NOT american values. Our president is seen in most of the world as a buffoon and now as a tyrant as well. This administration has run up the largest spending of ANY other in history.. all the while giving a paltry tax cut to all but the wealthiest americans. The american people will be paying for this presidents mistakes for generations. HE has set a precedent in the world for unilateral war that will come back to haunt us. The "coalition" is a joke. Its a simple case of " That Man tried to kill my Daddy". It was a personal vendetta and a wrong turn on a just war against those who wish to harm us. ( Who by the way WE CREATED with our support for repressive regimes in the past) After 9/11 we had the good will of the entire world and if it had been played smartly could have won this war on terrorism with the help of MOST of the rest of the world. AS it is this president with his lack of diplomatic skills and with his psuedo-righteousness with GOD speaking in his ear telling him he is the man of destiny...has ruined all of that good will. The good sherriff with his cowboy hat mentality just does not work on a wolrdwide stage. Sadaam was contained.. did he wish us harm.. you bettcha.. but every time he turned on a radar and tried to target a plane... our guys smacked it down. The No fly zone was definitely working and hell .. it should have been extended... Turn on a radar... threaten one of our planes..put a missile right back down the beam. If we want to root out terrorists... we should look just to the south. Threr are lots more right there in Saudi... but those are friends of Bush and off limits. We should have used our forces more wisely and without the lies. The former president lied about a blow job and got no US servicemen killed with that lie. This president took us into a war we did not need to fight at this place and time with a lie. Because of that many of our children will die fighting in far off places and others will die here at home in further attacks because we have given the terrorists a break far beyond their wildest dreams by attacking Iraq and.. even if you do not believe it.. the Islamic world sees this as a holy war... AGAINST Islam. There is a WHOLE lot of those people out there. They believe the stuff they see on all the TV stations like Al Jazeera etc. There are people in this country who are just BEGGING for this to escalate into Armegeddon....not that they will be here after the Rapture mind you because they will, to use the Gunneys terminology in FMJ... " All their asses will be Miracled over this obstacle". Wanna make a bet our president is one of them? This is the all to real present. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
juanesky 0 #47 December 21, 2003 As an American and as the non racist you profess to be, then you should be also be ashamed that in a fundraiser for a presidential campaign, people were being racists. Stop bashing and insulting when you can not prove your points with reason, but then, you wonder why there is so much hate."According to some of the conservatives here, it sounds like it's fine to beat your wide - as long as she had it coming." -Billvon Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
turtlespeed 212 #48 December 21, 2003 QuoteAs an American and as the non racist you profess to be, then you should be also be ashamed that in a fundraiser for a presidential campaign That was what we started debating a while ago. That is what this thread was about to begin with. Jeanne, I am truly sorry that you think that you can justify Dean's remarks with a "Well they did it first" campain. The fact is this. Using Language, and advocating the language that is considered racist is, guess what, RACIST. SO, if 1 + 1 still equals 2 in your world, then the fact that Dean and his lackeys using and condoning the use of racially discriminitory language makes them racists. You can try to justify any way you want to. It won't make a difference. The facts speak for them selves. What is true as well is that Malcom X, Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, and anyone else in this world that uses racially discriminatory words, and condones thier use is furthering Racism. Now be a good girl and get over it.I'm not usually into the whole 3-way thing, but you got me a little excited with that. - Skymama BTR #1 / OTB^5 Official #2 / Hellfish #408 / VSCR #108/Tortuga/Orfun Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #49 December 21, 2003 My point was very simple.. yet again... There is a vast difference between the REAL RACISTs of the right in this country where it is endemic and ingrained and a few people who are entertainers who are used to being vulgar and ridiculing just about anyone and anything... and if you look at the last line: Dean was present and later deplored the racist tenor of the jokes, but took the cash and let credit go. It is not the candidate himself. I for one would like to see the video of the event instead of taking the word of a questionable source. http://nikita_demosthenes.blogspot.com/ And perhaps you should quit your hating.. if you do a search on this website for TOWEL HEAD it comes up with YOU.... quite a few times... That is racism just as bad as ANYTHING any of those comedians said... remember you are in the service of this country.. supposedly about to go to help"liberate" more of those people. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amazon 7 #50 December 21, 2003 QuoteThe fact is this. Using Language, and advocating the language that is considered racist is, guess what, RACIST SHOW ME.. anywhere in that post where it said that Dean advocated it. Some of those people are probably elitist idiots and probably have some racism. The Lefties have some of them I am sure.. you UltraRightHandies have far more and its the home of the former Dixiecrats. As far as Sharpton and Jackson.. THIS link might be enlightening to you. http://www.onlisareinsradar.com/archives/001928.php And last time I checked.. Malcom X was killed by the supporters of Elijah Mohammed....who handed his legacy off to Louis Farrakahn, an avowed racist. Now be a good boy and go get your facts straight. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
