Will_I_Am 0 #1 April 10, 2005 Did anyone see the UFC fights on Spike last night? Forrest Griffin and Stephan Bonner had to be the greatest fight I have ever seen in any kind of combat sport. Those two are going to be HUGE in UFC. Now if they would only go over to Japan and fight in K1. That would be great! For $20 I'll call the guy a CHICKENFUCKER! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Bolas 5 #2 April 10, 2005 That kicked ass. It's too bad they couldn't award two contracts. I called Vallerina after the fight to let her know Stephan Bonner lost. He is a friend or friend of a friend or something like that. Edited to add: Just learned Stephan got a contract too. If they had gone by blood extracted, he would have won. Stupidity if left untreated is self-correcting If ya can't be good, look good, if that fails, make 'em laugh. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vallerina 2 #3 April 10, 2005 Quote I called Vallerina after the fight to let her know Stephan Bonner lost. Thanks for the call!!! I was upset to hear that he lost, but I'm glad he won the contract! I still haven't seen the fight (I will when I go to my brother's tonight.) Steve is a really good guy. I'm really happy for him! There's a thin line between Saturday night and Sunday morning Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JohnRich 4 #4 April 10, 2005 QuoteDid anyone see the UFC fights on Spike last night? Forrest Griffin and Stephan Bonner had to be the greatest fight I have ever seen in any kind of combat sport. Those two are going to be HUGE in UFC. Now if they would only go over to Japan and fight in K1. That would be great! What's UFC? What's K1? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bobsled92 0 #5 April 10, 2005 The greatest Fight Ever ? You mean me and the EX? or when I punched a guy and lifted him over a cafeteria table in high school? (more exciting than any tournement I competed in)_______________________________ If I could be a Super Hero, I chose to be: "GRANT-A-CLAUS". and work 365 days a Year. http://www.hangout.no/speednews/ Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
BillyVance 34 #6 April 11, 2005 QuoteQuote What's UFC? Ultimate Fighting Championships As real as it gets to full contact fighting. It usually gets bloody, but the referees are trained to stop a match as soon as somebody gets dazed or bleeding bad."Mediocre people don't like high achievers, and high achievers don't like mediocre people." - SIX TIME National Champion coach Nick Saban Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skolls081102 0 #7 April 11, 2005 That was an incredible fight- on the edge of my seat the whole time. I thought it should have been a tie (gone the extra 3 minute overtime- that was too close to call) But I'm glad to see they both got contracts- they both trully deserved it. The President of UFC said it right- there was no loser in that fight. The sole intention, is learning to fly.Condition grounded, but determined to try.Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies.Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites kallend 1,679 #8 April 11, 2005 Hector vs Achilles on the Troad, outside the gates of Troy. PS Troy was actually in England www.troy-in-england.co.uk/trojan-war/trojan-war-0.htm... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites goose491 0 #9 April 11, 2005 QuoteWhat's UFC? The Ultimate Fighting Championship (yeah right) It's what used to be a terrific martial arts tournament. Created by the Gracy family, it would pit different arts against one another with minimal restraints and no weight categories. It appealed to the masses as a "no holds barred" fighting event. However, the fact that many were winning the tournaments without totally debilitating their apponents started to hurt the ratings. Today, it is muslce-riddled alpha-male agression addicts, beating one another into (even more) senseless pulp My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites DShiznit 0 #10 April 11, 2005 I don't think it will ever be as good as the Gracy's and Ken Shamrock days... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skolls081102 0 #11 April 11, 2005 Way back when, UFC was great- but it wasn't fair. I remember seeing some big fat sumo wrestler get his ass handed to him by a Judo fighter (real fair there) Todays UFC is beter in a sense, that its still full contact- but with weight classes- makes it better to watch if you ask me. The sole intention, is learning to fly.Condition grounded, but determined to try.Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies.Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Balls 0 #12 April 11, 2005 DAMN IT!!! I missed it cause I had to drive to Seattle for business. Are they going to replay it? Maybe I can download it.---------------------------------------- ....so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites goose491 0 #13 April 11, 2005 QuoteWay back when, UFC was great- but it wasn't fair. I remember seeing some big fat sumo wrestler get his ass handed to him by a Judo fighter (real fair there) Todays UFC is beter in a sense, that its still full contact- but with weight classes- makes it better to watch if you ask me. Ahhhhh yes I remember. Gerard Gordeau vs. Teila Tuli. The bout lasted all of 25 seconds and Teila lost some teeth. lol. Why would you say it's unfair? By saying so, you are telling me you think Judo itself is a much better art than Sumo. I know a couple Sumo Wrestlers you wouldn't want to argue this with . You'll remember Royce Gracy won that tournement with a little Shoot Wrestling... he won the next too. He won them both by making all his opponents tap out. That's right, he didn't hit a single one. He never drew blood. But this was the point of the entire tournament. Find the greatest fighter! 99.9% of real life fights end up on the ground like it or not. The only ones that don't are the ones that get broken up by friends, bouncers or cops. lol. Ratings suffered because kids in the schoolyard were saying: "What's with all the rolling around hugging eachother?"... Unfortunately, they were also saying: "How cool was it when that Sumo lost his Teeth?!!?" So... today we have roid-monkeys knocking eachothers teeth out. The truth: most any of the fighters from the first few tournaments could hand todays fighters their asses on a plate. My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites jtval 0 #14 April 11, 2005 yea I saw itMy photos My Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zenister 0 #15 April 11, 2005 Quote 99.9% of real life fights end up on the ground like it or not. The only ones that don't are the ones that get broken up by friends, bouncers or cops. if the legalities that stem from any fatality or serious injury were not an issue.. LOTS less fights would ever reach the ground or last more than 10 seconds.. maybe you should look at the history of unarmed combat in war (where legalities are not an issue) they dont spend ANY time rolling around on the ground.. its a good way to get killed by someone other than your opponent...____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Skolls081102 0 #16 April 11, 2005 You think Tito Ortiz is a roid monkey? Really I don't see that many guys that I would say are really on roids. And I don't think it's fair to have a Sumo Wrestler against a Judo figter. Whether you want to admit it or not- a Judu fighter is quicker and more agile- I would say 99 times out of 100, the Judo fighter would win. I'm not saying that the Sumo Wrestler couldn't kick my ass, I'm just saying that against a fighter who is kicking and punching, and getting out of the way- a sumo wrestler can't compare. And Joyce Grace was incredible to watch. The sole intention, is learning to fly.Condition grounded, but determined to try.Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies.Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites goose491 0 #17 April 11, 2005 Quote If the legalities that stem from any fatality or serious injury were not an issue.. LOTS less fights would ever reach the ground or last more than 10 seconds.. I disagree, fights don't go to ground because we don't want to hurt one another. lol. Think about any fight you personally have been in. There is a scale. The more seriously you feared for you safety and your life, the closer you got to the ground. It's Martial fact. (Of course, this is once engaged in combat. Otherwise, the more you fear, the more you should run away.) Quotemaybe you should look at the history of unarmed combat in war (where legalities are not an issue) they dont spend ANY time rolling around on the ground.. its a good way to get killed by someone other than your opponent... They don't walk circles around each other with their "dukes" up either. You are absolutely right that they try their best not to roll around, but it has nothing to do with the legalities and everything to do with not being a sitting duck. Think about why you know this fact... it's because if they're going to teach you hand to hand in the millitary, they KNOW that real fights end up on the ground and they KNOW that a couple grown men rolling around make a nice target. They thusly make a point to TRAIN you in how to avoid it... so that you don't get will be killed by someone other than your opponent. War time is hardly Ultimate Fighting Championship time though right? Take your greatest fighter from any Army and pit him against the greatest fighter of another in a hand to hand fight to the death with nobody else shooting at them... ...wanna bet they start rolling around by round 3? My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites goose491 0 #18 April 11, 2005 Teila lost to Gerrard because he was an inferior fighter. NOT because Judo is "better" than Sumo. You say Judo is faster and more agile than Sumo. It's funny, because Sumo wrestlers are so big, people think they are slow and sluggish. The truth is they are far faster and more agile than many ohter professional atheletes! Teila's speed and agility was an advantage to him in that fight. Judo is the art of the old Samurai donning heavy armor and sitting on horseback. It is the hand to hand combat to be used AFTER you've been knocked off your horse and are on foot in heavy armor. Fundamentally, it is desinged to get your opponent onto his back. (Once on your back in this armor... you are pretty much stuck there and you "accept" the blade your apponent would stick between your ribs and the death that would come thereafter) Judo is not so much about speed and agility as it is about leverage in the abscence of these things. The displacement of weight, the lever-arm, a force and a proper fulcrum make a take down. Edit to add: You're right though about the roid-monkey comment. Unfair of me to say that. I was moreso commenting on the mentality of todays fighters... "I'm going in there to mess him up." sorta thing... not very much honnor there you know? My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites SniperCJ 0 #19 April 11, 2005 THat was a great fight. Although I am surprised Bonner didnt do better on the ground, being tutored by a Gracie (not Gracy...). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Zenister 0 #20 April 11, 2005 QuoteWar time is hardly Ultimate Fighting Championship time though right? Take your greatest fighter from any Army and pit him against the greatest fighter of another in a hand to hand fight to the death with nobody else shooting at them... ...wanna bet they start rolling around by round 3? if it is actually a life or death the well trained soldier will simply kill/incapacitate (by breaking the joints usually as they are the weakest links) as quickly as possible and move on...thre is no 'round 3' (maim was previously preferred to kill because of the logistic problems WIA vs KIAs caused the enemy.. doctrine has likely changed since we now provide more assistance to the wounded than their own side) what every 'sport fight’ lacks is the incentive to kill. In fact there are often rules (as well as laws) against excessive force and the kind and type of attack that cause life threatening injury..... its a competition, not a matter of life or death.. the mindset and training methods are completely different... Quotethey KNOW that real fights end up on the ground and they KNOW that a couple grown men rolling around make a nice target. yes, but your looking at it backwards, what they KNOW is that getting engaged with any single opponent for any length of time (longer than 10 sec) is a good way to die... grappling is a very stupid way to fight unless you KNOW ABSOLUTLELY no one else will interfere... first guy on the ground in a 'real fight' (what you didnt bring friends? sucks to be you....) is also the first one to get kicked in the head... doesnt take to many of those to put anyone out... modern 'real' fights only end up on the ground because we have (as a society) trained NOT TO kill or otherwise maim as quickly as possible, because of the social/legal implications... its a contest, not a matter of life or death and the tactics reflect that.. Ever been in a ‘real fight’ where someone actually broke someone else’s arm? It is amazing how fast the sound of snapping bones stops a brawl...”OMG someone really got HURT!” when is the last time some got a thumb in the eye in a UFC? punched, fingers in the windpipe? broken knees, ankles, wrists, elbows at first contact?? doesnt happen...why? Because they are train to 'fight nice' and, NOT trained to kill or maim.____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. Clear editor × You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL. Insert image from URL × Desktop Tablet Phone Submit Reply 0
Skolls081102 0 #7 April 11, 2005 That was an incredible fight- on the edge of my seat the whole time. I thought it should have been a tie (gone the extra 3 minute overtime- that was too close to call) But I'm glad to see they both got contracts- they both trully deserved it. The President of UFC said it right- there was no loser in that fight. The sole intention, is learning to fly.Condition grounded, but determined to try.Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies.Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kallend 1,679 #8 April 11, 2005 Hector vs Achilles on the Troad, outside the gates of Troy. PS Troy was actually in England www.troy-in-england.co.uk/trojan-war/trojan-war-0.htm... The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goose491 0 #9 April 11, 2005 QuoteWhat's UFC? The Ultimate Fighting Championship (yeah right) It's what used to be a terrific martial arts tournament. Created by the Gracy family, it would pit different arts against one another with minimal restraints and no weight categories. It appealed to the masses as a "no holds barred" fighting event. However, the fact that many were winning the tournaments without totally debilitating their apponents started to hurt the ratings. Today, it is muslce-riddled alpha-male agression addicts, beating one another into (even more) senseless pulp My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DShiznit 0 #10 April 11, 2005 I don't think it will ever be as good as the Gracy's and Ken Shamrock days... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skolls081102 0 #11 April 11, 2005 Way back when, UFC was great- but it wasn't fair. I remember seeing some big fat sumo wrestler get his ass handed to him by a Judo fighter (real fair there) Todays UFC is beter in a sense, that its still full contact- but with weight classes- makes it better to watch if you ask me. The sole intention, is learning to fly.Condition grounded, but determined to try.Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies.Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Balls 0 #12 April 11, 2005 DAMN IT!!! I missed it cause I had to drive to Seattle for business. Are they going to replay it? Maybe I can download it.---------------------------------------- ....so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who knew neither victory nor defeat." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goose491 0 #13 April 11, 2005 QuoteWay back when, UFC was great- but it wasn't fair. I remember seeing some big fat sumo wrestler get his ass handed to him by a Judo fighter (real fair there) Todays UFC is beter in a sense, that its still full contact- but with weight classes- makes it better to watch if you ask me. Ahhhhh yes I remember. Gerard Gordeau vs. Teila Tuli. The bout lasted all of 25 seconds and Teila lost some teeth. lol. Why would you say it's unfair? By saying so, you are telling me you think Judo itself is a much better art than Sumo. I know a couple Sumo Wrestlers you wouldn't want to argue this with . You'll remember Royce Gracy won that tournement with a little Shoot Wrestling... he won the next too. He won them both by making all his opponents tap out. That's right, he didn't hit a single one. He never drew blood. But this was the point of the entire tournament. Find the greatest fighter! 99.9% of real life fights end up on the ground like it or not. The only ones that don't are the ones that get broken up by friends, bouncers or cops. lol. Ratings suffered because kids in the schoolyard were saying: "What's with all the rolling around hugging eachother?"... Unfortunately, they were also saying: "How cool was it when that Sumo lost his Teeth?!!?" So... today we have roid-monkeys knocking eachothers teeth out. The truth: most any of the fighters from the first few tournaments could hand todays fighters their asses on a plate. My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jtval 0 #14 April 11, 2005 yea I saw itMy photos My Videos Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #15 April 11, 2005 Quote 99.9% of real life fights end up on the ground like it or not. The only ones that don't are the ones that get broken up by friends, bouncers or cops. if the legalities that stem from any fatality or serious injury were not an issue.. LOTS less fights would ever reach the ground or last more than 10 seconds.. maybe you should look at the history of unarmed combat in war (where legalities are not an issue) they dont spend ANY time rolling around on the ground.. its a good way to get killed by someone other than your opponent...____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Skolls081102 0 #16 April 11, 2005 You think Tito Ortiz is a roid monkey? Really I don't see that many guys that I would say are really on roids. And I don't think it's fair to have a Sumo Wrestler against a Judo figter. Whether you want to admit it or not- a Judu fighter is quicker and more agile- I would say 99 times out of 100, the Judo fighter would win. I'm not saying that the Sumo Wrestler couldn't kick my ass, I'm just saying that against a fighter who is kicking and punching, and getting out of the way- a sumo wrestler can't compare. And Joyce Grace was incredible to watch. The sole intention, is learning to fly.Condition grounded, but determined to try.Can't keep my eyes from the circling skies.Tongue tied and twisted, just an Earth bound misfit. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goose491 0 #17 April 11, 2005 Quote If the legalities that stem from any fatality or serious injury were not an issue.. LOTS less fights would ever reach the ground or last more than 10 seconds.. I disagree, fights don't go to ground because we don't want to hurt one another. lol. Think about any fight you personally have been in. There is a scale. The more seriously you feared for you safety and your life, the closer you got to the ground. It's Martial fact. (Of course, this is once engaged in combat. Otherwise, the more you fear, the more you should run away.) Quotemaybe you should look at the history of unarmed combat in war (where legalities are not an issue) they dont spend ANY time rolling around on the ground.. its a good way to get killed by someone other than your opponent... They don't walk circles around each other with their "dukes" up either. You are absolutely right that they try their best not to roll around, but it has nothing to do with the legalities and everything to do with not being a sitting duck. Think about why you know this fact... it's because if they're going to teach you hand to hand in the millitary, they KNOW that real fights end up on the ground and they KNOW that a couple grown men rolling around make a nice target. They thusly make a point to TRAIN you in how to avoid it... so that you don't get will be killed by someone other than your opponent. War time is hardly Ultimate Fighting Championship time though right? Take your greatest fighter from any Army and pit him against the greatest fighter of another in a hand to hand fight to the death with nobody else shooting at them... ...wanna bet they start rolling around by round 3? My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
goose491 0 #18 April 11, 2005 Teila lost to Gerrard because he was an inferior fighter. NOT because Judo is "better" than Sumo. You say Judo is faster and more agile than Sumo. It's funny, because Sumo wrestlers are so big, people think they are slow and sluggish. The truth is they are far faster and more agile than many ohter professional atheletes! Teila's speed and agility was an advantage to him in that fight. Judo is the art of the old Samurai donning heavy armor and sitting on horseback. It is the hand to hand combat to be used AFTER you've been knocked off your horse and are on foot in heavy armor. Fundamentally, it is desinged to get your opponent onto his back. (Once on your back in this armor... you are pretty much stuck there and you "accept" the blade your apponent would stick between your ribs and the death that would come thereafter) Judo is not so much about speed and agility as it is about leverage in the abscence of these things. The displacement of weight, the lever-arm, a force and a proper fulcrum make a take down. Edit to add: You're right though about the roid-monkey comment. Unfair of me to say that. I was moreso commenting on the mentality of todays fighters... "I'm going in there to mess him up." sorta thing... not very much honnor there you know? My Karma ran over my Dogma!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SniperCJ 0 #19 April 11, 2005 THat was a great fight. Although I am surprised Bonner didnt do better on the ground, being tutored by a Gracie (not Gracy...). Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zenister 0 #20 April 11, 2005 QuoteWar time is hardly Ultimate Fighting Championship time though right? Take your greatest fighter from any Army and pit him against the greatest fighter of another in a hand to hand fight to the death with nobody else shooting at them... ...wanna bet they start rolling around by round 3? if it is actually a life or death the well trained soldier will simply kill/incapacitate (by breaking the joints usually as they are the weakest links) as quickly as possible and move on...thre is no 'round 3' (maim was previously preferred to kill because of the logistic problems WIA vs KIAs caused the enemy.. doctrine has likely changed since we now provide more assistance to the wounded than their own side) what every 'sport fight’ lacks is the incentive to kill. In fact there are often rules (as well as laws) against excessive force and the kind and type of attack that cause life threatening injury..... its a competition, not a matter of life or death.. the mindset and training methods are completely different... Quotethey KNOW that real fights end up on the ground and they KNOW that a couple grown men rolling around make a nice target. yes, but your looking at it backwards, what they KNOW is that getting engaged with any single opponent for any length of time (longer than 10 sec) is a good way to die... grappling is a very stupid way to fight unless you KNOW ABSOLUTLELY no one else will interfere... first guy on the ground in a 'real fight' (what you didnt bring friends? sucks to be you....) is also the first one to get kicked in the head... doesnt take to many of those to put anyone out... modern 'real' fights only end up on the ground because we have (as a society) trained NOT TO kill or otherwise maim as quickly as possible, because of the social/legal implications... its a contest, not a matter of life or death and the tactics reflect that.. Ever been in a ‘real fight’ where someone actually broke someone else’s arm? It is amazing how fast the sound of snapping bones stops a brawl...”OMG someone really got HURT!” when is the last time some got a thumb in the eye in a UFC? punched, fingers in the windpipe? broken knees, ankles, wrists, elbows at first contact?? doesnt happen...why? Because they are train to 'fight nice' and, NOT trained to kill or maim.____________________________________ Those who fail to learn from the past are simply Doomed. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
