HP 7 - The Spoiler's Thread (ie don't look if you don't wanna know...)

[skybytch 259]

Seriously. If you haven't read the book yet and you don't want to know, hit your back button now. I'll throw some empty space in so you don't see something you didn't really want to... So go now... back to the Bonfire... nothing to see here... come on back when you're ready...




















Holy crap, what a rollercoaster that was! Non-stop action. Loved it! So what do you all think?

What was your favorite plot twist?

I loved that Harry was a Horcrux!! Brilliant.

Best part of the book?

Harry and Dumbledore in King's Cross. I would like to know who/what the whimpering naked child was though...

Any complaints?

My only complaint is with the ending - I think Teddy should have lived with Harry and Ginny all along.

What plot twist surprised you most?

That Snape was actually a good guy.

[NWFlyer 2]

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That Snape was actually a good guy.

Reluctantly. It actually didn't surprise me all that much - there was a reason Dumbledore was always kinda sorta loyal to Snape. Now we understand why.

I loved the way all the back stories came out throughout the book. It was like all these puzzle pieces started fitting, but nothing seemed too "convenient." It was like Rowling had it all plotted out the whole time ... makes me wonder how much of the story she's had outlined since the very beginning.

What a fun read.

"There is only one basic human right, the right to do as you damn well please. And with it comes the only basic human duty, the duty to take the consequences." -P.J. O'Rourke

[skysmurf2 0]

Unlike all the other harry potter books i wasn't immediately in love with this book. It was satisfying reading it and I certainly finished it in one go, but it seemed to lack the same quality as the others.

However, I actually think this is a brilliant book - its written differently to the the rest of the books, but its meant to be like that. and it was written in such a way as to give closure... I'm not miserable there won't be another Potter book... I'm quite the fan so I expected to be.

But the thing that really makes this (for me) a great books is that a day later its still got me thinking... and I'm liking it more and more.
biggest surprise: Kreacher loving Harry and Ron walking out on Harry and Hermione

best part of the book: Snape's memories

edit:
NWflyer: shes had it plotted out pretty much from the beginning.

[tigra 0]

The naked crying child was Voldemort/ Tom Riddle- or what he would become after he died. That's why Harry told him to try and feel some remorse. He was showing him mercy. And I LOVE that Harry disarmed Voldemort and his own spell backfired on him - Harry's signature move that Lupin criticized him for. Through all 7 books, did Harry take a single life?

I loved that each of the main "child" characters had a shot at doing something heroic- it wasn't all Harry.
I especially loved the significance of Neville pulling the sword out of the sorting hat and killing the snake with it.

I loved them being "underground" and causing trouble for the deatheaters, and the whole "resistance" movement. I liked that in spite of everything they were doing and handling, we were reminded that they were still kids from time to time. Ron's insecurities, for example, and how he had to overcome them.

The bit with Percy- I thought it would come out that he'd been secretly working for the order all along, and that Mr. and Mrs. Weasley knew and that made Mrs. Weasley worry all that much more because of the danger he was in as a "double agent". So, I guess I was a little disappointed in the whole "I was a prat" reconcilliation bit. Pretty small complaint, I guess.

Not enough Ginny, but you still knew she was there waiting for Harry and doing her part.

As I was reading, things kept clicking into place, and I had a really hard time putting the book down even for a few minutes.

I loved it from start to finish.

And Teddy? I kind of thought he'd end up with Harry too, but he was only 17. I'm OK with Harry being a godfather, just like the kind of godfather Sirius might have been to him if things had been different.

[tigra 0]

Snape being a "good guy" really wasn't a surprise at all. The surprise was that it took until almost the end of the book before it was revealed, but I think that's how it had to be. For one thing, Voldemort would have known if Snape was still actively working with the order and for another, Harry wasn't ready for the truth. He needed his anger and hatred to fuel him at the beginning.

I also thought it was interesting that Harry was a descendent of the same old wizarding family as Voldemort. Could Dumbledore have been a descendent of the third brother?

[point_code 0]

so did Harry die? if so, then how?

[Nightingale 0]

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so did Harry die? if so, then how?

Yes... and no.

[ltdiver 3]

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I loved that Harry was a Horcrux!! Brilliant.

Nicely explained here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horcruxes

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Harry Potter, who was said by Albus Dumbledore to be the only living entity left in the room when Voldemort's fatal Killing Curse backfired on himself. Voldemort's soul had been so weakened by his continuous creation of Horcruxes that when he was ripped from his body, a fragment of his soul was lost when he fled the scene, and the fragment attatched itself to the only living thing in the room, the infant Harry Potter. This gave Harry a window into the Dark Lord's mind and his gift of Parseltongue. Due to his use of Harry's blood to resurrect himself years later, Voldemort only succeeded in destroying his own soul fragment inside Harry rather than Harry himself when he finally attempted to kill Harry once and for all. This accounted for Dumbledore's "gleam of triumph" upon learning of Voldemort's fatal mistake in using Harry's blood, knowing that it was this mistake that would save Harry. Unlike the other Horcruxes, Dumbledore did not directly provide Harry with the suggestion that he could be a Horcrux; he asked Severus Snape to reveal this information to Harry at the end of his task. Voldemort was entirely unaware of Harry's status as his seventh Horcrux, and when he finally delivered a successful Killing Curse at the boy, instead of killing him he separated and destroyed the piece of his soul from Harry.

By having Harry, as a member of Griffendor House, be an unintentional Horcrux, all four houses of Hogwarts are in fact represented among Voldemort's horcruxes, as Dumbledore and Harry Potter speculated in Book 6.

ltdiver

Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon

[bbarnhouse 0]

A lot of it was predictable. I hated that Hedwig died and Dobby.
The interesting twist was Harry and Kings Crossing. He had the power of choice.
No surprise of Snape being a good guy, and his love for Lily; but felt that the Draco and his family were hanging at the end. Would have been nice to know the final outcome of that group.
The relationship with Teddy at the end could have been elaborated on. His upbringing, the interaction between Harry and his Godson.
The last chapter seemed quickly written and to my minds eye and seemed rather disappointing. I did like however Harry letting Albus Severus in on the secret that t that he in fact could chose the house he wanted to represent as Harry had done.

[davedlg 0]

I agree a lot was predictable - Harry being a Horcrux, Snape being a good guy, Harry and Ginny and Ron and Hermione getting together in the end, but none of that really spoiled the book for me, it was still a great read.

I wish there had been a little bit more development in the end. What ever happened with the Dursleys? I kind of expected Dudley to have some kind of role in the ending with the way he and Harry parted at the begining of the book. Imagine the irony if he, a muggle, played some major role in the downfall of Voldemort? Like someone else said, it would have been nice to have some more development on Draco Malfoy.

My favorite part of the book was the Battle of Hogwarts. I really liked how so many people showed up to help Harry and the classic good vs. evil battle that ensued.

[kirrz 0]

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I'm not miserable there won't be another Potter book... I'm quite the fan so I expected to be.

same same. even when i thought harry was meant to die it was fine because it was so justified and it was just the rational thing to happen.

hated the fact that both lupin and tonks died.. was surprised about the whole snape thing but loved that twist! also liked the dumbledore/ grindelwald storyline...

[jceman 1]

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I'm not miserable there won't be another Potter book... I'm quite the fan so I expected to be.

same same. even when i thought harry was meant to die it was fine because it was so justified and it was just the rational thing to happen.

hated the fact that both lupin and tonks died.. was surprised about the whole snape thing but loved that twist! also liked the dumbledore/ grindelwald storyline...

Agreed with one exception -- I said several years ago that we would find out Snapes was Harry's best ally at Hogwarts -- we knew from Harry's excursion into the pensieve with Snape's memories that Lily was the (unrequited) love of his life.

It also was a little disappointing, though not entirely surprising, that Albus Dumbledore had more than a few skeletons in his closet.

What I really liked is that in contrast with the last two books, there was almost non-stop action in this one -- breaking into, and the out of, Gringots was a real hoot for me. Imagine there was more than a little fence-mending needed once all the dust settled.

Faster horses, younger women, older whiskey, more money.

Why do they call it "Tourist Season" if we can't shoot them?

[skysprite 0]

I thoroughly enjoyed the book! I will have to read it several more times for it to fully sink in I'm sure!
One question though: JK told us that some non magical type person would manage to do magic late in life under an extreme situation. Who was that? Did I miss that part?? I'm trying to think back and it's not coming to me.

~skysprite

[skysmurf2 0]

I have the same question.

Also wish there had been more of the Dursley's and a bit more explanation of what happened to Draco post Voldemort.

I also really liked the Dumbledore/Grindelwald story as it explained so much of Dumbledore and at the same time there was a nice parallel with Harry's fears of his father's actions when his dad was at Hogwarts (book 5).

[Nightingale 0]

Perhaps that got edited out.

[tigra 0]

The Malfoy clan post Voldemort? I do think it was explained with them hanging around during the victory celebration (Narcissa played a vital role at the end) but looking a little bit out of place, and Harry's nod to Draco on the Hogwarts platform as they were seeing their children off. They were never meant to be friends.

[skysmurf2 0]

True and wouldn't really want them to be. I just mean that given Draco clearly wasn't comfortable with what Voldemort had him do... I would like to have known just a little more about how it changed him... but the nod wasn't a bad way to wrap things up.

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

It was a great closure to the story line....I'm more impressed on how she tied in so many events from all 6 books into this final one. I respect her for what she has accomplished on every level.

The biggest shock in the whole book? That Snape loved Harry. A lot of the other stuff wasn't a shock.....it was a good guess that Harry was a Horcrux and that Lily was the reason Snape turned.....but now we see that Lily did care for him and why. Interesting to note the circular nature of history she quietly puts into the story line...of how friendship's and enemies are somehow made on the Hogwarts express (started to happen again 19 years later).

I'm sure she wanted a fast paced ending at the school, to put a sense of urgency on it. In fact, it was one of the few times in all 7 books that time seemed to matter so much. But it did feel rushed. I want to know what happened to Tonks/Lupin! And having Percy just show up like that? meh And as someone else said, I wanted more to be done wtih Draco. I would have been ok with a bit less time in the tent doing nothing and more time at the end of the story. The bit that happens 19 years later is interesting. Has a very Hollywood feel to it and I'm sure thats how the movie will end. I go back and forth on whether I like it or not. I'm not sure how else it should have ended.....and I don't disagree much with who lived or died or the few loose ends (whats up with lavender). I guess my complaint is that too much was tied up in 4 or 5 paragraphs after Harry gets the wand back from Riddle.

I'm just waiting for the religious conservatives to jump all over this one. Once they find out that Harry died to protect them all and that his death prevented evil from harming all of them and then rose from the dead.....there is going to be some sort of shit storm. Christ figure as a wizard? hehe

What was great about it? Ron leaving the tent, Snape being not just a good guy, but a tragic hero, the reversal of respect coming from Dumbledore instead of Harry in that relationship, Dobby, a very human and failable Dumbledore, Neville, Mrs Weasley's revenge (and was there a hint of love from riddle for bella in that moment?).....and Harry showing mercy in that final moment just shows how far he had come.

I hope she gets around to that Enclyopedia soon so we can find out for certain who Victorie is (thou with that name I can guess Fleur) and find out mroe about the rest of the other characterss and things like what happens with the giants and dementors. Do the house elves and centaur's establish a better relationship with the wizard world? What about goblins? What about telling us what the Veil in the ministry was all about? Can Harry still do magic now that the internal connection to Riddle is gone?


Edit to add: After reading the news, she announced that Mr Weasley was the one that was going to die originally and that Tonks/Lupin are the ones that originally were supposed to live.

On a personal note....if you had told me in college that I would have enjoyed reading 800 pages over two days I wouldn't have believed you. Picking up the Potter books has renewed my interest in reading over the last few months and I am now reading about two full books a week instead of watching TV.

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you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....

[Nightingale 0]

Didn't Tonks and Lupin die in the last battle?

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

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Didn't Tonks and Lupin die in the last battle?

Yes, but how? At least Lupin deserved a proper sendoff...not something along the lines of a minor minor character.

_________________________________________
you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....

[Ian84 0]

I absolutely loved the book.

The most gripping part for me was the pensieve at the end where Harry witnesses Snape's memories. We knew Snape fancied Lily but it was quite emotional in the way his love for her and for Harry was revealed.

Would have liked Mrs Weasly to give Bellatrix a good old bitch slap before she killed her.

Neville's part was great. I always tought he'd come into his own and play a major role.

I really hope that the remaining two films are done as well as the Order of the Pheonix.

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

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I really hope that the remaining two films are done as well as the Order of the Pheonix.

Found out today that the screenwriter for the first 4 movies didn't do OOTP, but will be back for Half Blood. Hopefully this gets the movies back on track!

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you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....

[tigra 0]

I definitely HOPE the next two films are 1000X better than Order of the Pheonix because that was just really really bad.

If I had to guess, I'd say Bellatrix killed both Tonks and Lupin and although I enjoyed both characters, I didn't mind mainly because Lupin has been kind of a sad tragic character all along. With Teddy an orphan whose parents died as heroes, he didn't grow up and have to live as an outcast the way Lupin did. Plus, they died together which is better than one of them dying and the other one grieving for the rest of his or her life.

I don't know that Snape LOVED Harry, but that moment when he's dying and he asks Harry to look in his eyes so he can see Lily's eyes one last time? Not to mention, the fact that Harry knew to go to him as he was dying and knew he had something to say again just shows the growth.

I've got to agree about Percy. He's a Weasley- I wanted there to be a better explanation than "I've been such a Prat!"

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

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I don't know that Snape LOVED Harry, but that moment when he's dying and he asks Harry to look in his eyes so he can see Lily's eyes one last time? Not to mention, the fact that Harry knew to go to him as he was dying and knew he had something to say again just shows the growth.

Remember in the memory flashback? Snape in tears, shows the doe patronus (a representation of his life long love of Lily)? Read the conversation leading up to that yet again.....while it was based off of "I thought it was to honor Lily by keeping Harry alive" Dumbledore confronts him and asks if he cares about Harry....Snape says he always had....it was just him hiding that good side of him as he was prone to do (his main flaw because it showed weakness)....and this ties in again to the love theme protecting Harry....and it was this love for Lily and Harry that Riddle overlooked as he always had.....unless I read it wrong....but that is how I took it.

edit to add:
Lupin WAS tragic but was key to moving many of the events along in the story. Just like Dumbledore, their relationship changed in Hallows. Harry taught Lupin about life and how to find something to live for. Lupin found his own redemption in the birth of Teddy and Tonks love for him. This is why I feel both of them deserved more to their death than what was there.

Also, the "Look....at....me....." part you talked about; I felt the same way. He wanted to see Lily's eyes one last time.

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you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....

[ChasingBlueSky 0]

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19959323/
If you found the epilogue of “Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows” rather vague, then J.K Rowling achieved her goal.

The author was shooting for “nebulous,” something “poetic.” She wanted the readers to feel as if they were looking at Platform 9¾ through the mist, unable to make out exactly who was there and who was not.

“I do, of course, have that information for you, should you require it,” she told TODAY’s Meredith Vieira rather coyly in her first interview since fans got their hands on the final book.
Ummm … yes, please!


Rowling said her original epilogue was “a lot more detailed,” including the name of every child born to the Weasley clan in the past 19 years. (Victoire, who was snogging Teddy — Lupin and Tonks’ son — is Bill and Fleur’s eldest.)

“But it didn’t work very well as a piece of writing,” Rowling said. “It felt very much that I had crowbarred in every bit of information I could … In a novel you have to resist the urge to tell everything.”

But now that the seventh and final novel is in the hands of her adoring public, Rowling no longer has to hold back any information about Harry Potter from her fans. And when 14 fans crowded around her in Edinburgh Castle in Scotland earlier this week as part of TODAY’s interview, Rowling was more than willing to share her thoughts about what Harry and his friends are up to now.

Harry, Ron and Hermione
We know that Harry marries Ginny and has three kids, essentially, as Rowling explains, creating the family and the peace and calm he never had as a child.

As for his occupation, Harry, along with Ron, is working at the Auror Department at the Ministry of Magic. After all these years, Harry is now the department head.

“Harry and Ron utterly revolutionized the Auror Department,” Rowling said. “They are now the experts. It doesn’t matter how old they are or what else they’ve done.”

Meanwhile, Hermione, Ron’s wife, is “pretty high up” in the Department of Magical Law Enforcement, despite laughing at the idea of becoming a lawyer in “Deathly Hallows.”

“I would imagine that her brainpower and her knowledge of how the Dark Arts operate would really give her a sound grounding,” Rowling said.

Harry, Ron and Hermione don’t join the same Ministry of Magic they had been at odds with for years; they revolutionize it and the ministry evolves into a “really good place to be.”

“They made a new world,” Rowling said.

The wizarding naturalist
Luna Lovegood, the eccentric Ravenclaw who was fascinated with Crumple-Horned Snorkacks and Umgubular Slashkilters, continues to march to the beat of her own drum.

“I think that Luna is now traveling the world looking for various mad creatures,” Rowling said. “She’s a naturalist, whatever the wizarding equivalent of that is.”

Luna comes to see the truth about her father, eventually acknowledging there are some creatures that don’t exist.

“But I do think that she’s so open-minded and just an incredible person that she probably would be uncovering things that no one’s ever seen before,” Rowling said.

Luna and Neville Longbottom?
It’s possible Luna has also found love with another member of the D.A.

When she was first asked about the possibility of Luna hooking up with Neville Longbottom several years ago, Rowling’s response was “Definitely not.” But as time passed and she watched her characters mature, Rowling started to “feel a bit of a pull” between the unlikely pair.

Ultimately, Rowling left the question of their relationship open at the end of the book because doing otherwise “felt too neat.”

Mr. and Mrs. Longbottom: “The damage is done.”

There is no chance, however, that Neville’s parents, who were tortured into madness by Bellatrix Lestrange, ever left St. Mungo’s Hospital for Magical Maladies.

“I know people really wanted some hope for that, and I can quite see why because, in a way, what happens to Neville’s parents is even worse than what happened to Harry’s parents,” Rowling said. “The damage that is done, in some cases with very dark magic, is done permanently.”

Rowling said Neville finds happiness in his grandmother’s acceptance of him as a gifted wizard and as the new herbology professor at Hogwarts.

The fate of Hogwarts
Nineteen years after the Battle of Hogwarts, the school for witchcraft and wizardry is led by an entirely new headmaster (“McGonagall was really getting on a bit”) as well as a new Defense Against the Dark Arts teacher. That position is now as safe as the other teaching posts at Hogwarts, since Voldemort’s death broke the jinx that kept a Defense Against the Dark Arts professor from remaining for more than a year.

While Rowling didn’t clarify whether Harry, Ron and Hermione ever return to school to finish their seventh year, she did say she could see Harry popping up every now and again to give the “odd talk” on Defense Against the Dark Arts.

More details to come?
Rowling said she may eventually reveal more details in a Harry Potter encyclopedia, but even then, it will never be enough to satisfy the most ardent of her fans.

“I’m dealing with a level of obsession in some of my fans that will not rest until they know the middle names of Harry’s great-great-grandparents,” she said. Not that she’s discouraging the Potter devotion!

“I love it,” she said. “I’m all for that.”

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you can burn the land and boil the sea, but you can't take the sky from me....
I WILL fly again.....