cut-in laterals

[katzurki 0]

It's probably just my ignorance of the term in its English incarnation, but what exactly are cut-in laterals, and how do they make a rig better?

And also how come Racers don't get them? I listened to John Sherman's explanation on the phone, but I am not sure I caught on. (The calling card was running out, the connection was lousy, and I was sleepy.)

(Racers claim they don't need anti-twist risers as well; or rather that their riser design is such that no specific anti-twist tweaking is required; is this really so?)

[pbla4024 0]

Lateral cut on Wings:
http://www.skydivewings.com/wings.htm
I cannot find pictures of lateral cut on Odyssey on Sunpath web page.

Fido

[dropzonefool 0]

Cut in laterals: when your rig is wider than your back... anti twist risers? unsure, but hard housing can make cutaway eaisier when the risers are twisted.

[PhreeZone 15]

Cut ins are mostly noticed on larger rigs or smaller people. It allows the rig to hug you all the way along your waist and back instead of wearing like a box with a belt. You can feel the difference if you are jumping anything larger then a baby sized rig. On my friends Wings with a 120 main I noticed a large difference over my Jav with a 135 and no cut ins. The Wings hugged my hips and the Jav had laterals that went straight back and pulled on me.

As for why Racer doesn't offer them I can venture a few guesses, but you will probally want to call or email them to verify. Racer makes their harnesses slightly different from the rest of the industry and as such they flex differently and wear differently. I've heard from lots of people that they feel a Racer harness is more comfy then any other custom rig they have ever had. Racer might feel that altering the design will take away from the comfort already in a rig. Another guess is implementing them might mean they can't do their one piece of webbing harness anymore.

In a much funnier guess they might just feel its a fad and they want to make sure that the industry really has a demand for it. Kinda like tuck tabs instead of velcro. It only took about 8-10 years of that fad for them to offer it

In all reality call or email John back and talk to him directly. He's one of the few that can tell you exactly why JumpShack does'nt offer it. I will tell you my next rig will probally have it.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[RMURRAY 1]

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In a much funnier guess they might just feel its a fad and they want to make sure that the industry really has a demand for it. Kinda like tuck tabs instead of velcro. It only took about 8-10 years of that fad for them to offer it

if I bought a new rig it would be a racer (of course) - I'd get the 2k3 WITHOUT tuck tabs. Velcro works better than tuck tabs and is easy to replace at that location. I believe I heard this from bill booth also. From other Racer people --- forget hip rings (there is no need - a waste of money). The Racer risers are simple - the entrance for of the cutaway cable is "relieved" so that it will not bind when wound up. I have them along with the red cutaway cable but have no high stress cutaways. I'd like to see an apples to apples comparison with other risers.

rm

rm

[skycat 0]

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I believe I heard this from bill booth also. From other Racer people --- forget hip rings (there is no need - a waste of money).

Bill Booth seems ok with hip rings it's the chest rings he doesn't offer on his rigs.

Fly it like you stole it!

[PhreeZone 15]

Velcro needs replacing every 150-200 jumps if you want to freefly in the rig and have everything stay in. My rig is approaching 1000 jumps and the tuck tabs look as good as the day I bought the rig. Same with every other rig I see at the DZ. There is only 1 rig I can remember in 5 years that had an issue and that was a rig with 1500+ jumps that the tuck tab was broken due to slamming the rig in a trunk. Why have a system that is easy to repair if there is another system out there that requires less maintence all together?

RWS is using tuck tabs on the Sigma tandem rigs... probally the one rig out there that is subjected to more use and abuse then any other rig. I think thats a good sign off on tuck tabs.
I would like to know what makes Racer risers so different then other risers out there. I know about the snap toggles but that has no factor in the twisting of cables and risers.

Yesterday is history
And tomorrow is a mystery

Parachutemanuals.com

[hookitt 0]

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I'd get the 2k3 WITHOUT tuck tabs. Velcro works better than tuck tabs and is easy to replace at that location.

Are you saying velcro works better than tuck tabs? Or are you saying the Velcro version of the Racer riser covers works better than the tuck tab version? *If* that's the case, then it's due for another redesign.

What that has to do with cut in laterals I'm not sure but since it's mentioned, I'd like to know what you mean. Velcro is not a better option on any other rig and is always a poor option for freeflying. Search this one out so I don't have to restate my opinion (which is based on real life experience) of velcro.

What's the difference in the Racer risers? *Relieved* Isn't quite enough description. I looked on the website and found nothing.

I've been victim of a rediculously hard cutaway due to line twists and no hard inserts in the risers, so I'd be hard pressed to suggest a riser without them.

My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto

[RMURRAY 1]

sorry, don't mean to highjack the thread. I only said (some) Racer people say there are no need for hip rings on Racers.

rm

[RMURRAY 1]

I will find the comment made by bill booth. sorry, should had done this in the first place...

rm

[RMURRAY 1]

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What's the difference in the Racer risers? *Relieved* Isn't quite enough description. I looked on the website and found nothing.

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I will take a picture and post of the Racer riser and post to a new discusion under gear and rigging.

rm

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[RMURRAY 1]

I should have said velcro works fine for me. Also, I should have said I do not freefly. Here is what bill booth has said..........

Tuck riser covers are very sensitive to the bulk under them. (Velcro riser covers didn't have this problem, by the way.) When we design a rig with tuck tabs, we can only choose one riser cover dimension, and we base that on the average bulk we expect. When your risers are "thick" like yours, you should ask your rigger to leave very little bulk at the top of your freebag. This will help your riser covers stay shut. If he can't pack with little bulk up top, perhaps your reserve is a bit too large. Even if you choose the "right size" reserve for your container, two supposedly "identical" reserves may have up to 10% different pack volumes, because of fabric and construction tolerances. Every bit of bulk, risers or canopy, up top affects your riser cover's ability to stay shut. So, if you want your riser covers to be as secure as possible, always choose a reserve that will fit "loosely" in your container, so that your riser covers can curve over your shoulders.

[Tonto 1]

I don't like them. I think they're an extra snag point.

Maybe that's cos I'm an old CRW dog, but the idea freaks me out.
My Mirage G4 MT has the Elasitcated lumbar supprt, which I think is
a lot more comfortable than cut in lats, with a fraction of the risk.

t

It's the year of the Pig.

[riggerrob 558]

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sorry, don't mean to highjack the thread. I only said (some) Racer people say there are no need for hip rings on Racers.

rm

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

If you get harness geometry perfect and you are not too flexible (i.e. are not into funky freestyle moves) then a fixed (ring-less) harness will be comfortable.

[RMURRAY 1]

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sorry, don't mean to highjack the thread. I only said (some) Racer people say there are no need for hip rings on Racers.

rm

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

If you get harness geometry perfect and you are not too flexible (i.e. are not into funky freestyle moves) then a fixed (ring-less) harness will be comfortable.

This from a contact who says he has sold over 40 Racers over a 6 month period - I tend to believe him and I assume he means no matter what type of skydiving you are into...........
"DO NOT get Hip rings, the serve no purpose on a Racer and you only notice them when you walk to the plane. I have had two customers send their rigs back to have them removed. Expensive proposition. The harness is comfortable already as you know, besides it saves you $ 100.00"

The people I know with cut in laterals like them. I have heard others say that depending on your size and rig size, they can dig in and be very uncomfortable - so I would be very careful in ordering.