BASE canopy + skydiving rig

[base689 0]

> What will fit Flik 322?
Probably a Flik 322 WON'T stick into a J5, but consider that a Flik 322 is a parachute few BASE jumpers in the world possess.
In case of a Flik 322, just borrow a student rig form the DZ (a rig where they are used to stick a 300ish for students) and off you go (=off yoy skydive).

Stay safe out there
Blue Skies and Soft Walls
BASE #689 - base_689AT_NO_123_SPAMyahoo.com

[Thijs 0]

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Just keep an old Javelin J-5 around. Almost everything fits in that . . .

What will fit Flik 322?

Would it fit in a tandemrig?

What about using the basecanopy as a tirth parachute, and d-baging it from the plane?

Thijs

[BASE813 0]

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use your BASE gera with a tertiary reserve...??????

Yeah, the tertiary makes it so you are following the rules (in Canada) and let's you jump your shit! Perfect wouldn't you say? I mean, not like you are depending on it, mostly there for show.
I trust my BASE gear on both terminal and sub-terminal so why not skydiving?
My thoughts......... file'em where you like

exactly................ I would so much prefer to take my BASE rig out of a plane than take my BASE canopy stuffed in a dual parachute system................... if you can wear the front mount for show and for rules then do it,...... and if you question doing that, then you should not be taking a single parachute system on your back from plane or object.....................

[DrewEckhardt 0]

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I understand that it's an added benefit to first jump a BASE canopy a # of times in the skydiving environment to get a feel for how it flies. My question is this... how big of a BASE canopy do you think I can fit in my Vector sized for a 170 Spectre? Is that out of the question? I think, based on what I've read, that I'm shooting for about a 260 sq ft BASE canopy. I really don't want to have to obtain new skydiving gear just to do some hop-n-pops with a BASE canopy, but if it is truly important, I will.

All BASE jumps are not equal. Accuracy is not important when the landing area is flat and bigger than a football field. It's more important where you're landing on railroad tracks in a narrow canyon where a few feet off in one direction will fly you into a cliff and a few feet in the other will dump you in a 40 degree river with rapids. It's more important where you have 60' to land, going long puts you in trees, and landing short flies you into a steep hillside covered in boulders and pieces of the trees that used to cover the landing area.

Here's one example to put things in a skydiving perspective: The landing area under the Mexican big wall is currently 7% of the size the FAA considers to be a stadium for skydiving demos. A pro-rating (10 consecutive standup landings within 5 meters) and 50 jumps in the last year under that canopy would be required. When the second group jumped it did't even meet the FAA's minimum landing area requirement. Two out of seven jumpers went home injured after their first jump.

If you're going to jump into tight landing areas buy yourself a big used skydiving rig which will let you make dozens of jumps in a safe environment before you have to do it into someplace nasty. I spent just $700 on a J7 (officially sized for a Manta 288) with a Raven-III reserve.

[The111 1]

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All BASE jumps are not equal. Accuracy is not important when the landing area is flat and bigger than a football field.

That thought did cross my mind, and I will probably aim for first BASE jumps with large landing areas.

But I'm also under the impression that flight exposure time to the canopy is good for more than learning landing skills. Deployments, object avoidance, quick maneuvers, intentional mals , etc... I guess all of these things could theoretically be learned off of a "safe" BASE object too, but you get so much more time in a skydive (there was a discussion on these forums about this very thing some time ago...)

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[BASE813 0]

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and I will probably aim for first BASE jumps with large landing areas

just because you have a large landing area does not mean you are any better off..................

many people get hurt not being able to fly a canopy at low altitude............

[TomAiello 25]

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and I will probably aim for first BASE jumps with large landing areas

just because you have a large landing area does not mean you are any better off..................

many people get hurt not being able to fly a canopy at low altitude............

Also, many people who figure "well, I'll just do easy stuff now, so I don't need to practice" find themselves on harder objects before they find the time to go back to the DZ and practice with the canopy.

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[The111 1]

Tom, I agree, and I did not mean to imply that a large landing was a substitute for learning the canopy ahead of time. I meant that if you combine both (skills on the canopy + a forgiving LZ for your first jump) you would be better off.

813, I don't quite understand what you mean by "not being able to fly canopy at a low altitude". Example?

www.WingsuitPhotos.com

[TomAiello 25]

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I don't quite understand what you mean by "not being able to fly canopy at a low altitude". Example?

Many skydivers have very limited experience making low turns. The most experienced group in this is the swoopers, who, of course, are experts at making low turns, but, unfortunately, on canopies that are very different from BASE canopies.

In BASE, you often have to make your entire canopy flight below the altitude that you'd make your last turn on a skydive. This difference has resulted in accidents when beginner BASE jumpers (and not so beginners, too) are thrown into the unfamiliar environment of _having_ to turn low when their skydiving training screams "no low turns!"

-- Tom Aiello

[email protected]
SnakeRiverBASE.com

[RhondaLea 3]

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In BASE, you often have to make your entire canopy flight below the altitude that you'd make your last turn on a skydive. This difference has resulted in accidents when beginner BASE jumpers (and not so beginners, too) are thrown into the unfamiliar environment of _having_ to turn low when their skydiving training screams "no low turns!"

I hope someone somewhere is starting a list of all the "skills" skydiving teaches that must be unlearned to base jump successfully.

That being said, in the bad old days, students were taught survival skills in the context of a static line course. Now, mostly because of AFF and windtunnels, freefall skills are emphasized to the exclusion of flying one's canopy to the ground. On the other hand, flat and flare turns have been discussed to death on dz. com, and prior to that, on rec.skydiving, and they still are taught by those few small dropzones run by old-fashioned farts who have no use for "progress."

Aside to Matt: there are few such small dzs in our neck of the woods.

rl

If you don't know where you're going, you should know where you came from. Gullah Proverb

[avenfoto 0]

theres a florida dz, right down the street (17N) from deland and rhonda, that is run by "old farts who have no use for "progress""... it starts with a "p" and ends with "alatka".... cool family style dz with an emphasis on knowing your shit...
and no fatalities ever...

give a shout if anyones ever in the are... -b

[Colm 1]

The111,

Having recently done what you are pondering, I thought I'd humbly offer my experiences. I'd like to start out by saying that jumping my Dagger out of a plane is one of the most educational things I've ever done with it. Extremely eye-opening, especially for a low-experience guy like myself.

As far as rigging it up, I spent a little bit (ok a lot) of money and tried to keep things "standard". I bought a used Mirage M-8, old reserve, old cypres, and got it assembled & reserve packed. The M-8 is not a size listed on most Mirage size charts I looked at, because it is so big, but it is out there. This container holds my 278' very well and can theoretically go down to about a 225 if I recall correctly. But I bet it could also hold a low-300' canopy. Don't trust my guesses, check with the manufacturer's recommendation.

Next, I basically took my BASE rig, cut away the canopy at the 3-rings, and hooked the BASE risers to the Mirage. I put on the mesh slider, made sure to reroute the steering lines properly, and replaced the bridle/PC with a standard skydiving bag + collapsible PC. Packed it just like a normal skydiving rig. Some people have talked about freepacking it or whatnot, but since I have never freepacked a canopy into a skydiving container, and had been advised against trying, it made no sense to attempt something I hadn't done before when the standard skydiving rigging & pro pack would work fine.

I was also advised against any non-standard routings of the brake lines. Having heard of the resulting scenarios that have happened to people, I can't imagine I'll ever try that, either.

Even with a mesh slider (I haven't done a terminal BASE jump yet) I was surprised at how fast the canopy deployed without sacrificing any comfort at all. I suspect that using a tailpocket, the opening would be a little firmer, but I'll leave it to the experienced folks to comment yay/nay on that. (Any takers?)

After the first skydive on it, I was convinced it was worth every penny & effort. You can definitely do it for cheaper by renting student gear, but I don't live where I can do that. Plus it's my own gear to learn on as I see fit, on my own schedule, and I can't use laziness as an excuse for not futzing around with borrowed/rented gear. To me, the ongoing & future benefit of having this rig handy is worth the somewhat tall expense. I plan on keeping this rig and when I get my next BASE canopy I will probably skydive it before I ever jump it.

One newbie to another, my only regret is not doing this sooner! I also suggest searching through the archive for Jaap's threads regarding his experience when he was asking questions about skydiving his new canopy.

I'm not saying I did everything right, and if someone notices an error, by all means let me know before it becomes self-critiquing!