Mockingbird

By "suggests" do you by any chance mean "is misunderstood to say"? The reason I ask is that the biblical authors, instructed/inspired to write by God, nowhere TEACH that the earth is flat, nor that nothing existed more than 6000 years ago. If one is a fair-minded reader, he'll have no problem with this. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

This is simply wrong. I have a lot of evidence that my main or my reserve has a good chance of opening. Scientific theories are backed by evidence and experiment, they have a high degree of reliability in describing and predicting the nature of reality. There is always a chance that new evidence will arise but we work with the best information available, to call that faith on par with religious faith is a gross misrepresentation. Hi, Dorbie. I'm not replying to you specifically, but more to ones I've discussed this very concept with in the past. Christianity is also backed by evidence, and those who look for and at the evidence and are willing to follow it WHEREVER it might lead them will find it convincing. Faith is merely believing beyond a reasonable doubt that a certain claim is true; it is assurance about the adequacy and reliability of the evidence for that claim. What people (especially non-Judeo/Christian people) refer to as "religious faith" today is very often NOT what the the bible describes as faith. "Faith" is a word which has definitely morphed into something the bible wouldn't recognize. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

No, I sincerely believe that in its original form, it contained no factual errors. I might even go so far as to say that in its present form it doesn't contain statements which are untrue; the problems arise where people do not interpret it correctly and fairly... such as when someone insists that a figure of speech in a text should be interpreted literally. See, for example, the argument you are trying to prove-- that the bible is erroneous in saying that the moon is a "light." It most certainly MAY be considered a "light" in the way that word is used in the vernacular. See reply above. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

You didn't read my reply carefully. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

WHAT?!?! Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

I believe it's meant to convey emotion, Andy. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

There are other things I'm much more interested in... and can understand. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

I'd never thought of it quite this way. Coerced love isn't love at all. Thanks, Steve. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

By the way, this sounds awfully patronizing. There's no need to promote your knowledge of the subject of evolution-- I'm sure we all recognize that you know a TON more than simple-minded me. And I'm wondering what assertions you've heard me make on the subject. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

I don't nor have ever denied that evolution happened... at least, the type you're referring to. I don't know all the intricacies-- nor do I want to. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Not sure why it's funny, but... The context and the specific verse doesn't say that Terah had Abraham when he was 70. It says that after he turned 70, he had three sons. Apparently in that culture, the year of a man's life that marks the beginning of fatherhood is a big deal, and usually mentioned. See Noah for same thing. And Eber and Nahor in the same chapter-- Gen. 11. It tells the ages they were when they had their firstborn. As for your second example, This is so obvious, only someone who truly WANTS to trump up an error would use this one. First of all, God doesn't teach science; the bible isn't a science book. Men wrote it, and the description of creation is from earth's point of view--- where man lived. To this day, we use scientifically wrong words-- "sunrise" sunset. Tonight some dz probably had night jumps because the moon is full (another inaccurate word), so they could jump by the light of the moon. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

On behalf of those of us in the elementary/intermediate stage, thank you for all the knowledge you pass on. We really appreciate it.

I agree with that. I think that I've had to learn way too much of this on my own-- either by reading, or by asking questions--- Now I realize that asking questions is an excellent way to learn, but one must ask alll the right questions. What if a question important to my safety hasn't occurred to me? I agree with Riggerrob and Tom about brain overload in the FJC, and I see that the ISP suggests a good progression of knowledge, but the only things about gear that were formally taught during my student progression were pre-jump equipment checks. I never even looked at the RSL system ("from snap shackle to guide ring" ) 'til I got my own gear. A lack of knowledge made investigation scary. Anyway, all I'm saying is that to learn, I had to take the initiative most of the time. Which isn't a bad thing, but..... Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Oh goody. If you dare to bring any of those up, I may have to give you a lesson on "how to read." George, here's a fun exercise-- why don't you find one, and I mean read the Bible yourself (don't cheat!), and see how long it takes you to discover a "contradiction." Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Why do they ignore the origin of life aspect? Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Yes, there is additional evidence. I've referred to a book in the past that you might find interesting... that is, if you are interesED. It's a nice, little book (only 760 pages) called Evidence That Demands a Verdict by Josh McDowell. Last I looked Amazon had it for about.. well here's the link: Evidence That Demands a Verdict There are other sources as well. Paj has some good ones worth your consideration. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Specifically, what form of evolution are you talking about? Surely not life from non-life. Changes within species? Ok. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

OK, so Non-Christians, when they hear a statement of what a Christian believes can 1) not respond/ignore it, 2) ask "why?", 3) state their own beliefs, or 4) dis or make accusations. Some here do #3 and state their own beliefs. Good. Most people probably fit into #1-- they just keep reading/move to another thread. Very few actually ask (with sincerity) Christians WHY they believe. But quite a lot do #4-- which is pretty juvenile, IMO. That they can't come up with a more thoughtful response is pretty sad. How do you have an interesting discussion with someone like that? Frankly, I think the Christians here have been pretty tolerant of dz.com's non-Christians' rudeness and accusations-- we try to back up what we say, we take questions seriously and try to answer them honestly. Granted, one of us gets a bit crotchety at times... But I'm digressing. We were talking about who has the burden of proof; and I still say that whoever makes a claim has the burden of proof. When someone states his belief, he isn't making a claim. But responding with "The Christian god is just a myth" is making a claim, and that person has the burden of proof. Doesn't everyone do this? Is it the Gospel that offends you? or that we believe and state something for which we haven't proof? Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Hmm, that doesn't make much sense to me. BUT, you should know, so I'll defer to you and think about it some more. Thanks. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

I guess you haven't been reading the religion threads around here.

Thanks, I don't need a fuller explanation. You answered my question. Evolutions does have as many questions as it has answers. There are lots of gaps in man's understanding of evolution. (I'm speaking of the type of evolution which really does occur, not the kind which says life came from non-life.) Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

too bad it has nothing to offer of eternal significance. Doesn't evolution have as many quesions as it does answers? Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Still not true, at least, not necessarily. If you profess to be an atheist, and in turn i profess to be a Christian, I'm NOT claiming your beliefs are wrong. If you take it that way, then you've just jumped to a conclusion. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

So you're saying that you can profess believe in god without thinking god exists? Very strange. How you got that from my statement, I'll never know. Jack, a profession is not a claim. It's a personal statement of what you believe. I'll try to help you out, OK? This is a profession: I believe that Christ is the son of God. Here is a claim: Christ IS the son of God. Does that help? Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"

Aside from talking about God, your sentence above is very interesting, coming from someone who says he's a scientist. Lots of things have been proven over the years by science; does that mean that before they were proven, they were only myths? There is still lots to be discovered. Things that are already... you know... REAL! Now Kallend, let's not play dumb. It's not becoming. You know very well that we, as Christians, have never claimed proof for (I think you meant "for", not "of") the existence of God. Now evidence... that a whole other story. We have evidence-- the evidence is what gives us reason for our beliefs. It's really not that complicated to understand the concept of faith. After all you exercise faith when you skydive. Blue skies & happy jitters ~Mockingbird "Why is there something rather than nothing?"