timbarrett

What level of jump numbers do you think poses the highest level of risk? The fatality stats don't really have enough data points (thankfully) it seems, especially as there are no numbers readily available for injuries rather than fatalities. This post somewhat prompted by my own feeling that with around 100 jumps I am now at the stage where a)I know enough to get into trouble, b) not enough to get out of it/make a better decision and c) some growing awareness (as more experienced jumpers often point out) that a lot more things can happen than you can imagine... Curious what others views/thoughts on this are? Stuck at work on a beautiful day and reduced to DZ.com for entertainment... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

I found sitting down and reading "Deep Survival, Who lives and Who dies" by Gonzales to be helpful. Maybe you just had a rotten run of luck - shit happens and you can't do anything about that - but maybe you are doing something more systematically to make all this happen to you. Either way get it analyzed by yourself and others (video etc). Try to make sure at least you are not repeating the same mistakes in the hope of a different result... Note I am not an instructor or indeed anyone with any claim to have useful skydiving advice to give..i have however learnt from mistakes over my years of being alive "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

i find that laying the pack-job down, squeezing the air out and cocooning it either as for the reverse-S fold or Wolmari-pack BEFORE flipping it over and rolling it up to bag it psycho style is the best of both worlds...more control with the laying down and coccooning and then easier folding/bagging as per psycho-pack... mind you this was shown to me because i was so useless at everything else... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

i think the lizard reference is apposite...when your primitive "lizard" brain can recognize height it triggers the fear response..but the primitive response was only designed for environments that primitive man might experience, eg up a tree, the edge of a cliff. The primitive brain cannot recognize the height from 13,000 feet - no-one looks out of a airplane window and thinks "i am on the edge". Understandably your more sophisticated rational brain recognizes that jumping out of an airplane door is probabaly not very wise but that isn't the same as the visceral fear you get on the edge of a cliff. It is entirely reasonable and to be expected that anyone gets scared 200ft up but not necessarily 13,000 feet up... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

sure..PM me "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

My daughter did a tandem around her 16th birthday. What made that so wonderful was her running up to hug me after, a huge smile on her face, saying "I get it now!". To have another family member understand the joy I get from the sport meant a lot to me.. That all said, I haven't encouraged her to jump again and, as she is now on an athletics scholarship at college, desperate not to get injured, I am not too upset she hasn't followed up her first jump. If she ever wants to jump badly enough she knows who to ask and I will jump on the same load... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

Funny thing i have noticed is that, while i am still nervous, i feel a lot calmer if I am jumping with or leaving the plane just before someone who is clearly more nervous/scared than I am...i guess it is that i feel if they can overcome their fears then i shouldn't have so much to worry about... for me the first 1500' in the plane is the worst but i also love the butterflies you get when you feel the lurch in the aircraft as the first chunk leaves the door...once I am in the door it's too late to worry and time to have fun! "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

I wanted to ask what more knowledgeable people thought of this version of psycho packing/bagging that I was shown recently. Despite having done all the approved things..like inadvertently rolling around in the desert in Eloy...I was still struggling with 230 sq ft of new ZP and someone took mercy on me and showed me this version... As has been discussed, psycho-packing is really just pro-packing but with a different way to fold up the wretched thing and getting it into the bag. If there is anywhere that psycho-packing is likely to go wrong it has also been suggested is when, especially with a larger chute, you lay it down "upside down" and/or when you fold the ears over and squeeze out the air. Then there is a risk you pull a line around the front. It is also harder to keep the slider all the way up against the stops as you are working from the other end (at least in the videos etc). That is why it has been suggested to me that the pro-pack and especially the practice of "cocooning" the pack job before reverse S-folding it into the bag allows more control....that of course still leaves you wrestling the stack into the bag which, if you are as incompetent as me, still leaves plenty of scope to screw the whole thing up.. So he showed me this version to get the best of both worlds.. Lay the chute down just as for a pro-pack and squeeze the air out lying down on it as usual. While doing this you also cocoon the pack-job as per those who recommend the reverse S-fold bagging approach. While you are still on the pack-job you can use one hand to keep the cocoon together while the other hand controls the cocoon right over the slider to hold that in place too. Now you flip the neatly wrapped package over as per the psycho-pack version but because it is cocooned it will not spill out/slide around as when you lay it down upside down in the normal psycho-pack approach. Now you can kneel alongside the pack-job and put one knee on the slider area to hold that in place while you roll the package up..with a bit of judicious shuffling of knees and hands then all the air can be squeezed out while keeping total control of the roll. Even someone as hopeless as I am can then easily get the thing into the bag under complete control. Probably this is unnecessary complication if you are any good at packing anyway but for useless packers like me it was suggested that this would work..it seems to do very well for me but I thought I would ask if anyone could see any problems with this version... happy packing.. "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

Well it amused everyone else I guess... A lot stronger uppers than we thought on the first load so, with no chance to make it back, I picked what seemed to be the biggest, flattest dirt field I could see and just to be on the safe side aimed right for the middle. Of course the reason it looked the flattest was that it was a field of smooth mud under 2-3 inches of water. Talk about sticking your landing! It took me 30 minutes to crawl out of there through about 18 inches of thick mud and water, leaving behind my shoes which were sucked off early on. The DZ van occupants who came to pick me up just sat and laughed..they put me in the back of the pickup truck and then wouldn't let me back into the DZ until I had been hosed off! I spend the rest of the day getting a crash course from the DZ rigger on how to clean a rig and chute... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

Just wanted to give a word of thanks and a plug for Roy and the rest of the Spa Hayabusa team whose Bedford tunnel camp I attended this Saturday.. it was a) well organized, b) loads of fun and c) an excellent learning experience...there is a significant difference in my humble opinion between "just time in the tunnel" and quality structured coaching. I'd like to think that I have been a student enough of my life to be able to recognize good coaching when I get it! There is another camp scheduled for 12/16-17 I believe.. I would add in passing that now that Bedford has the cafeteria/bedrooms open there is even less excuse not to bankrupt oneself out there... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

I banged into the desert after an asymmetric flare and compressed a couple of vertebra so.. 1) waited until felt completely healed - lots of exercise, stretching, yoga etc - more for the confidence than anything else 2) reviewed everything i could on landings - including this forum 3) spent a day at the DZ watching people land 4) picked a perfect wind day to jump ata a DZ with a massive landing area 5) jumped solo and pulled high so i could chill out and practice lots of flares. I identified a tendency to flare a bit asymetrically and tried a few flares focusing on correcting that 6) set up to land in the middle of the massive field with absolutely no-one/nothing else to think about 7) deep breath on final, relax..perfect stand-up landing 8)..normal service resumes "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

hi, I found myself in a similar position recently having compressed a couple of vertebra after messing up a no wind landing at a DZ with a much higher density altitude than I was used to. First I had to spend some time and rehab work (exercise, stretching, yoga etc) so that I was happy that my back was fine..to remove any doubt/excuse from my mind before I jumped again. Then i picked the perfect wind day to day to jump again..after spending the morning watching good jumpers landing..until I just couldn't stay on the ground anymore. I jumped solo, pulled at 5000 and spent the time playing with my flare and was able to recognize that I had a tendency to flare asymmetrically. I tried to remember that when i landed in front of my buddy recording it on video. One of my best landings; I showed it to a canopy pilot who i respect and he said"Yeah, okay. Now go and do a lot more like that. Come back and talk if you want to." Eventually you have no choice but to jump if you want to learn. There are plenty of people who went through the same thing and plenty of people who you can ask for advice. "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

aren't the openings so, so soft! "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

This one got me thinking a bit afterwards about how it could have gone wrong...this wasn't how I imagined by my first chop-or-not decision would unfold.. ..Opened and quickly into multiple line twists (Alti-2 shows me deployed at 2500 after a lovely soft Spectre snivel). It stopped getting worse and I started to kick out of them..but it was taking time and effort. I had always promised and mentally drilled myself to keep looking at my wrist alti while I was kicking out but the effort and hard breathing totally fogged up the full face (Mamba). Now I am thinking "This is coming out, I don't want to chop for this silly thing" but also I could hear the not-so-still voice of Ron shouting 'Time is passing. Stop the skydive!"..I paused, opened my visor (duh!), hands on handles, and looked at my alti. As it happened I could see 2100 and only two twists left..so I went back to kicking and it came out in 10 seconds.. Pretty dull really but I had always imagined that my first possible mal would be something blindingly obvious that screamed "Chop me!" in neon lights across the sky and where I could impress myself with my picture perfect EPs...not something that crept up on me and made me think while time passed..enough time that the rest of the 4-way around me were looking and wondering "Hmm..wonder what he is going to do?" I guess it is never goes the way you think it will. I almost got to my hard deck without making a decision. I would have felt pretty stupid hitting the ground like that...I am reviewing my procedures and reminding myself that there are people on this forum worth listening to because you will hear them later. "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

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so many people in this life assume things are safe and even after disclaimers/video etc don't truly "get it" that there is a small, but not zero, chance that someting might go very wrong even on a tandem..i just want to make sure I am erring on the side of pointing this out rather than getting carried away by my enthusiasm for the sport and so inadvertently "selling" it too hard... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

What are the ethics when someone says something like, "I hear you jump and I am thinking of making a tandem/learning to skydive"? Personally I decided to say "Awesome, I am happy to organize it for you" but to only say that ONCE. I won't sell it to them after that or follow up. If they follow up and once I book them in I also say "This is not an amusement park ride. All I ask before I take you to the DZ is you give a number to call on your behalf in the unlikely - but not impossible - situation that something goes wrong. Give me that number, forget it and go out and have some FUN" I read somewhere that our ethical responsibility is to say how much we enjoy it - as if anyone could stop us saying that anyway. However we should never SELL it... Just curious what approaches other people take... "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

i think those who use "whuffo" as a derogatory term that includes tandem passengers probably deserve to spend the rest of their days chugging slowly to altitude in a C-182... I have no problem with the term being used on the willfully ignorant - don't worry, there are plenty of those but.. We should be a lot more big-hearted and welcoming to even the one-time jumpers - it's more than 99.9% of the population will ever do...my daughter made her tandem jump and felt a bit of the spirit in the plane (Dad, what were they doing with all those ghetto handshakes?) and after landing came running up to say, "I get it now". She isn't going to jump again because it's too risky for her as an athlete to risk the injury but at least she will vote our way some time in the distant future when we face an airport closure/DZ ban. Make them feel part of the family..we need them! "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

All i can say from my own very limited experience...is that I initially started AFF without any tunnel time and was generally pretty hopeless after 8 jumps and only 3 levels passed. I then took 6 months off, spent 1 hour in the tunnel in Orlando and then started my AFF again. My instructors released me almost immediately after the first exit - indeed I never saw the reserve side again - and i passed all levels in 5 jumps. I consider it money very well spent! "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

In retrospect it seems inevitable... First I began scuba-diving. Beautiful but a bit too "Type B" ultimately..(below sea level) Followed by 8 years of semi-professional offshore yacht racing but ultimately that was about your ability to raise/spend money...(sea level) Took up flying and quickly got hooked on aerobatics. Awesome but then my instructor told me that, given I had to wear a bail-out rig in case I pulled the wings off, I should make a parachute jump just to make the decision easier if I ever had to get the hell out..(5000 AGL).. AFF and tunnel time...never had the air been fresher, the grass smelled better or the colors been brighter...I haven't landed in a small airplane, helicopter or balloon since then...(13,000+ AGL)... Inevitable and wonderful... Tim "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

no argument...but is there any other way than donating via PayPal as it doesn't seem to like UK CCs? "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

Hi, I started at 45 - my daughter just made her first (tandem) jump at Hinton and came running up to me afterwards to say "I get it now!"...luckily I was wearing dark glasses so she couldn't see me cry! Anyhow..you need to recognize that it is a selfish decision - it isn't safe and can take time away from your family...BUT...as long as everyone understands that then this sport will fill you with more love for life than anything I have ever come across and it will calm you to face the little stresses of family life. When you land and the first thought in your mind is "IT IS SO GREAT TO BE ALIVE!" then that it likely to make you a better parent as well. Weston and Hinton are both nice and friendly places...The other way to handle the weather and the scheduling is to book tunnel time too. Blue skies, Tim "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

Emma, I consulted my S.O. who is in the fitness business. After the initially simplistic response that it is a sport you need to be fit for but isn't going to make you fit, she came up with the following more thorough analysis; it makes sense to argue the following (in terms of the language of the fitness industry)... 1) Core stability. Arguably skydiving, especially tunnel training, requires the optimal combination of stability with mobility. Think of the work required of the abdominal and back muscles to maintain level control while yet maintaining the stability of the body core. That core body work is conducted a) against constant and significant resistance and b) has to be within the controllable range of motion - one of the key elements, for example, of Pilates 2) Propreoceptive (please check spelling) skills. This relates to awareness of where the parts of your body are. These are elements/goals of, for example, Pilates, Alexander Technique and yoga. You can't fly well if you are unaware of the position of you non-visible limbs, the straightness of your spine, etc. 3) Kinesthetic awareness. Linked to 2) this is awareness of how your body parts and alignment move throughout the activity. Maintaining core stability and body alignment while engaging in any activity is enhanced by the awareness developed by skydiving. 4) Stabilizer muscles. All the micro level adjustments in body position mean that a huge range of smaller muscle groups are worked by skydiving. For example if you pump iron in the gym you can surely trash your trapezius muscles but will you also give as good a work out to the other smaller muscles around the neck?..not judging by how mine felt after Saturday night in the tunnel anyway! 5) You can't pick up any fitness publication without reading about Mind-Body linkage as a key element/goal. Learning how to move your body; our brain's awareness of that movement is a capability that we lose if we don't use it - and as we get older. In other words, Skydiving keeps you young! 6) Stress manangement. Mentioned by some of the other posters in this, this is clearly a key element in most fitness activity. We all know how the word "Door" can wipe out all other petty concerns in your life! Anyway..hope this helps. PM me if you need any of these points expanded by my "consultant". Tim P.S. I had a great time in the tunnel

Really warm up and stretch. Not just a few desultory stretches but take 30 mins to get gently warmed up and thoroughly stretched in all areas... stretching when your muscles are cold is not bad but is much less effective. Don't bounce your stretches either. Then when you are finished make sure you stretch it all out again. A lot of people forget that part and regret it. It's addictive! "Work hard, play hard and don't whinge"

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