cruzlite 0 #1 October 15, 2003 I have been told to "never stow excess bridle in pilot chute". Since I have always done this, with no problems, I am wondering What's uuppp ? Also; I have Vector II with 1&1/2" velcro patch on lower flap, next to BOC pocket. I have bought new pilot chute with no velcro on bridle. Do I have rigger put velcro on bridle (system I'v always used with no problems), or remove velcro from rig ? Thanks D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
darkwing 4 #2 October 15, 2003 When I hear advice I often ask myself "why does this person give me advice that significantly differs from that of the manufacturer?" Which doesn't answer your question, but it gives you something to shoot back at the person who said it. -- Jeff My Skydiving History Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #3 October 15, 2003 So, if you don't put most of the PC bridle in the middle of the PC, where do you put it? Outside the PC but still in the BOC pouch? I'm still on ripcords, but I'm clearly going to be looking at this soon for myself, and *cough* hypothetically speaking, if I were packing other peoples' rigs for them - under the supervision of a rigger, of course - it might make a difference to them / me right now. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
hookitt 0 #4 October 15, 2003 Put the Velcro on the bridle or have a bridle cover put on the rig. The less it can flap around the better. Cheers.My grammar sometimes resembles that of magnetic refrigerator poetry... Ghetto Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cruzlite 0 #5 October 15, 2003 QuoteSo, if you don't put most of the PC bridle in the middle of the PC, where do you put it? Outside the PC but still in the BOC pouch? Yes...S-FOLDED (???) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Chrisky 0 #6 October 15, 2003 Yep, outside and s-folded. Theory is that like this it will not knot (knot not?) the PC in the BOC locking it in case of a horseshoe. Add: This is why i tend to care that my bridle attachement point is on the same side as the handle (hackey, mf, pud, whatever), so the PC will "deploy" right out of the pocket (if pulled by the bridle or let go of handle) and not have to "roll out" first. Get the idea? Sorry i don't have alink to the packing method depicted.The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open. From the edge you just see more. ... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites FrogNog 1 #7 October 16, 2003 Sounds clear to me. It also sounds like it will take some "talent" to get the PC and s-folded bridle to go into the pouch properly, but magic comes from experience. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Chrisky 0 #8 October 16, 2003 Not really, just pack it nice and flat, then keep the whole thing in your hand "grabbing" the s-folds one at a time. You'll end up having your PC and bridle in one hand and having the other one free to stuff it in nice and clean(why, the bridle is still attached of course!!). Most stuff always sounds easy, hehehe.The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open. From the edge you just see more. ... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites gus 1 #9 October 16, 2003 I thought I'd read a post by Bill Booth explaining why you should pack the bridle inside the pc. I think it was to ensure that the pc couldn't inflate under the bridle. GusOutpatientsOnline.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites fudd 0 #10 October 16, 2003 I have the same setup as you, and don't got velcro on my new PC. Never had any trouble with it. Very little bridle exposed anyway. As long as you're not freeflying, but stay on your belly it should be safe enough. If you're freeflying you REALLY should consider getting another rigg. I know a lot of people is freeflying with Vector II, but that doesn't make it safe. There are only 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites cruzlite 0 #11 October 16, 2003 QuoteI thought I'd read a post by Bill Booth explaining why you should pack the bridle inside the pc. I think it was to ensure that the pc couldn't inflate under the bridle. Gus Found Bill Booth's post...don't know how to link... will attach Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites mr2mk1g 10 #12 October 16, 2003 Standard training in England it (virtually) the bill booth method. we are told to ALWAYS S-fold the bridle into the roll of the PC - THAT is the way to avoid a horse shoe / maya hard pull. The 1 1/2 inch vecro patch you refer to is called an "idiot patch", (assuming your talking about a little square patch on your top flap and it doesnt actually "go" anywhere). Its basically there to remind you how to route your bridle. Its entirely superflous and can either be removed, or ignored. You could always get some hook velcro on your bridle though and... use it to remind you how to correctly route your bridle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites FrogNog 1 #13 October 16, 2003 OK, based on the Bill Booth post I now know I don't know anything different from what I knew before, except that there may be one more thing I didn't know. Should I be, hypothetically speaking, packing someone else's rig for them - under the supervision of a rigger, of course - I will continue to do it the way I know they prefer. Meanwhile I will continue to review which way I want to do this for myself. I note in the Bill Booth post that the manuals say to s-fold the bridle against the mesh (i.e. the "most inside" part of the PC) and I have been s-folding the bridle on top of the PC after it has already been folded in half once (but not yet folded up the rest of the way). This may or may not be a trivial difference in re knotting. But from Bill Booth's post, I don't understand the "envelope" concept that you don't want the bridle to "get above" - what is that, and which way is "up"? (Yeah, that question is the sign of a good skydiving student, huh? ) Is the envelope the folded-up PC wrapping around the bridle s-folds, and we want to avoid allowing the s-folds to get loose or wrap around any significant portion of the folded PC? And is "up" behind you in the air, meaning knots (outside the pouch) are more probable if the user is holding the PC and the bridle gets loose and streams out in a big "U" in the air? I never before thought this would be a problem, as long as the bridle didn't wrap your arm or something. And on issues of scale - is this a "big" or "little" thing? Obviously a PC that won't come out of the pouch is bad, and this is one possible component of that. And a PC that wears the bridle like a girdle is also bad. But I'm known to be overconcerned about things, and some at my DZ already seem to care less about how their PCs are packed ("just stuff it in there and pound the heck out of it to get it flat") than I do/would. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites cruzlite 0 #14 October 16, 2003 Assumption incorrect; 1&1/2" velcro is on bottom flap & sits under right SIDE flap when closed-as close as you can get to BOC pocket mouth & still be under SIDE flap. (velcro on bridle would be between pin & pc) (This is Vector II) But, thanks anyway, D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites cruzlite 0 #15 October 16, 2003 Yes, I believe this issue IS important. That said; I will continue to pack with bridle inside pc as Bill states in post, for two of the same reasons I jump vectors-safety & reliability. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites meatbomb 0 #16 October 17, 2003 Quote1&1/2" velcro is on bottom flap & sits under right SIDE flap when closed-as close as you can get to BOC pocket mouth & still be under SIDE flap. In that case, I would definitely get the bridle velcro fitted...should cost less than $10...The last thing you want is a great loop of bridle flapping about in freefall...causing premature, or even worse, out of sequence openings...--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Squeak 17 #17 October 17, 2003 does anyone know of problems associated with this type of PC stowage. Lay PC fabric to floor, flatend bridle on mesh fold PC in half, then fold the sides into 3rds, S fold remaining bridle on fabric, roll fabric into an approximatley 6" long cylender, stow in BOC. Most ppl doit like this at my DZ, and I have never had a prbloem with it. Has anyone else had issues???You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky) My Life ROCKS! How's yours doing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites meatbomb 0 #18 October 17, 2003 Quoteroll fabric into an approximatley 6" long cylender The only problem I have heard talked about with this method, is that it is possible for the single roll to expand / unravel once in the pocket, so that it is larger than the mouth of the pocket, giving a stiff/no pull. We always use a double roll to the centre for this reason. But like the saying goes...YMMV --- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites Join the conversation You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account. Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible. Reply to this topic... × Pasted as rich text. Paste as plain text instead Only 75 emoji are allowed. × Your link has been automatically embedded. Display as a link instead × Your previous content has been restored. 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Chrisky 0 #6 October 15, 2003 Yep, outside and s-folded. Theory is that like this it will not knot (knot not?) the PC in the BOC locking it in case of a horseshoe. Add: This is why i tend to care that my bridle attachement point is on the same side as the handle (hackey, mf, pud, whatever), so the PC will "deploy" right out of the pocket (if pulled by the bridle or let go of handle) and not have to "roll out" first. Get the idea? Sorry i don't have alink to the packing method depicted.The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open. From the edge you just see more. ... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #7 October 16, 2003 Sounds clear to me. It also sounds like it will take some "talent" to get the PC and s-folded bridle to go into the pouch properly, but magic comes from experience. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Chrisky 0 #8 October 16, 2003 Not really, just pack it nice and flat, then keep the whole thing in your hand "grabbing" the s-folds one at a time. You'll end up having your PC and bridle in one hand and having the other one free to stuff it in nice and clean(why, the bridle is still attached of course!!). Most stuff always sounds easy, hehehe.The mind is like a parachute - it only works once it's open. From the edge you just see more. ... Not every Swooper hooks & not every Hooker swoops ... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
gus 1 #9 October 16, 2003 I thought I'd read a post by Bill Booth explaining why you should pack the bridle inside the pc. I think it was to ensure that the pc couldn't inflate under the bridle. GusOutpatientsOnline.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
fudd 0 #10 October 16, 2003 I have the same setup as you, and don't got velcro on my new PC. Never had any trouble with it. Very little bridle exposed anyway. As long as you're not freeflying, but stay on your belly it should be safe enough. If you're freeflying you REALLY should consider getting another rigg. I know a lot of people is freeflying with Vector II, but that doesn't make it safe. There are only 10 types of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cruzlite 0 #11 October 16, 2003 QuoteI thought I'd read a post by Bill Booth explaining why you should pack the bridle inside the pc. I think it was to ensure that the pc couldn't inflate under the bridle. Gus Found Bill Booth's post...don't know how to link... will attach Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mr2mk1g 10 #12 October 16, 2003 Standard training in England it (virtually) the bill booth method. we are told to ALWAYS S-fold the bridle into the roll of the PC - THAT is the way to avoid a horse shoe / maya hard pull. The 1 1/2 inch vecro patch you refer to is called an "idiot patch", (assuming your talking about a little square patch on your top flap and it doesnt actually "go" anywhere). Its basically there to remind you how to route your bridle. Its entirely superflous and can either be removed, or ignored. You could always get some hook velcro on your bridle though and... use it to remind you how to correctly route your bridle. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
FrogNog 1 #13 October 16, 2003 OK, based on the Bill Booth post I now know I don't know anything different from what I knew before, except that there may be one more thing I didn't know. Should I be, hypothetically speaking, packing someone else's rig for them - under the supervision of a rigger, of course - I will continue to do it the way I know they prefer. Meanwhile I will continue to review which way I want to do this for myself. I note in the Bill Booth post that the manuals say to s-fold the bridle against the mesh (i.e. the "most inside" part of the PC) and I have been s-folding the bridle on top of the PC after it has already been folded in half once (but not yet folded up the rest of the way). This may or may not be a trivial difference in re knotting. But from Bill Booth's post, I don't understand the "envelope" concept that you don't want the bridle to "get above" - what is that, and which way is "up"? (Yeah, that question is the sign of a good skydiving student, huh? ) Is the envelope the folded-up PC wrapping around the bridle s-folds, and we want to avoid allowing the s-folds to get loose or wrap around any significant portion of the folded PC? And is "up" behind you in the air, meaning knots (outside the pouch) are more probable if the user is holding the PC and the bridle gets loose and streams out in a big "U" in the air? I never before thought this would be a problem, as long as the bridle didn't wrap your arm or something. And on issues of scale - is this a "big" or "little" thing? Obviously a PC that won't come out of the pouch is bad, and this is one possible component of that. And a PC that wears the bridle like a girdle is also bad. But I'm known to be overconcerned about things, and some at my DZ already seem to care less about how their PCs are packed ("just stuff it in there and pound the heck out of it to get it flat") than I do/would. -=-=-=-=- Pull. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cruzlite 0 #14 October 16, 2003 Assumption incorrect; 1&1/2" velcro is on bottom flap & sits under right SIDE flap when closed-as close as you can get to BOC pocket mouth & still be under SIDE flap. (velcro on bridle would be between pin & pc) (This is Vector II) But, thanks anyway, D Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cruzlite 0 #15 October 16, 2003 Yes, I believe this issue IS important. That said; I will continue to pack with bridle inside pc as Bill states in post, for two of the same reasons I jump vectors-safety & reliability. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #16 October 17, 2003 Quote1&1/2" velcro is on bottom flap & sits under right SIDE flap when closed-as close as you can get to BOC pocket mouth & still be under SIDE flap. In that case, I would definitely get the bridle velcro fitted...should cost less than $10...The last thing you want is a great loop of bridle flapping about in freefall...causing premature, or even worse, out of sequence openings...--- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Squeak 17 #17 October 17, 2003 does anyone know of problems associated with this type of PC stowage. Lay PC fabric to floor, flatend bridle on mesh fold PC in half, then fold the sides into 3rds, S fold remaining bridle on fabric, roll fabric into an approximatley 6" long cylender, stow in BOC. Most ppl doit like this at my DZ, and I have never had a prbloem with it. Has anyone else had issues???You are not now, nor will you ever be, good enough to not die in this sport (Sparky) My Life ROCKS! How's yours doing? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
meatbomb 0 #18 October 17, 2003 Quoteroll fabric into an approximatley 6" long cylender The only problem I have heard talked about with this method, is that it is possible for the single roll to expand / unravel once in the pocket, so that it is larger than the mouth of the pocket, giving a stiff/no pull. We always use a double roll to the centre for this reason. But like the saying goes...YMMV --- Swoopert, CS-Aiiiiiii! Piccies Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
