white balance on cloudy days

[steveorino 7]

Quite by accident I hit the white balance button on a cloudy day (Sat). I had been doing tandems and saw the other vidiots' video. It appeared quite dark and shadowy as mine typically does on those type of days. My last jump was a video instead of a tandem. When Igot down I noticed the white balance button was on. Crap! While the inside the plane shots were a little washed out the freefall video was a lot better than expected. In fact it was bright.

Can anybody give me more info about this setting?

steveOrino

[DSE 3]

If you're asking what it does:
White balance tells the camera that the object/subject it's pointed at when you engage the W/B, that it's seeing white. It balances/calculates color based on what you told it "White" looked like.
You can create some very nice colors by pointing the cam at a slightly reddish object and telling the camera that the reddish color is white, and therefore the shots you take will be cooler/bluish in color. You can point the cam at blue and white balance, and end up with warmer/more reddish colors.
In this list, you can choose colors on which to white balance, and end up with richer/deeper colors, or thinner/washed colors, all depending on your goal.
56k/daylight
Dark Blue =brownish red tint.
Powder/Light Blue= Deeper green tint
Orange=Blue Tint (can be substituted for Night for Day if you under expose by a stop)
Deep Red=Deeper green tints
Dark Green= Desaturated/washed out colors.
Light purple=Lighter green tint
Pink=Deep green tint
Lime Green=Desaturated/washed out.

32k/indoors

Orange=Deep Blue
Deep Red=Green
Lime Green=Warmer skin tones
Dark brown= Light blue
Light purple= Light green
Dark green= Warmer skin tones
Dark purple==Deep Green
Light Blue/Powder Blue=Skin tones not warm
Dark Blue=Warm skin tints

I'd recommend avoiding the more drastic colors for white balancing.
Whatever your camera was aimed towards when you pressed the button is what caused the color balances (or off balances) you see in the resulting frames.

HTH

[quade 3]

While DSE is quite correct about creating different effects . . .

If you're shooting outdoors; just put it on the "Sun" icon and you'll be fine.

What I can't stand is when people put it on "Auto". Then the White Balance "hunts" for white based on the overall scene resulting in all the colors "breathing". Absolutely horrible.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[DSE 3]

My error, I thought he was asking what white balance is, not which setting to use.

[quade 3]

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My error, I thought he was asking what white balance is, not which setting to use.

Oh no. I believe you understood him correctly and did, in fact, give him some useable information.

That said . . . probably quite a bit more than he needed.

I don't think the average semi-pro user really has any business fooling around with the white balance setting procedure that is implemented in the Sony consumer cameras since it has a LOT of ways to f up the video.

I think the MUCH safer way of doing things is to shoot consistantly using the presets; even if you want a "special" coloring effect and then deal with it in post.

A person can -always- adjust in post if he wants, but taking goofed up footage and attempting to make it look "normal" and match it to "standard" settings is much, much harder.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[DSE 3]

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I don't think the average semi-pro user really has any business fooling around with the white balance setting procedure that is implemented in the Sony consumer cameras since it has a LOT of ways to f up the video.

A person can -always- adjust in post if he wants, but taking goofed up footage and attempting to make it look "normal" and match it to "standard" settings is much, much harder.

Here is where our opinions will have to part company.
I'd much rather give the information and have folks know that they can do more with what they've got, than feel I need to hold anything in reserve, but that's probably 12 years of moderating broadcast forums and seeing question "2" pop up a few days after question "1."
Yes, you can mess up more, but doing so means you know more.
Yes, you can *somewhat* approximate the looks of cooled or warmed frames in post, but it's better to do it in acquisition to avoid recompression when possible. Stills...not so important. Video? Exceptionally important.
Either way...I'll probably stick with giving too much/more information than not enough/less info. Someone might stumble across a really valuable setting or tidbit of information in my usually meandering explanations.
TMI has always been my affliction. Just ask LTDiver

[quade 3]

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Here is where our opinions will have to part company.

I have no issue with anyone ever disagreeing with what I have to say. In fact, I encourage it! I've learned quite a bit this way.

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I'd much rather give the information and have folks know that they can do more with what they've got, than feel I need to hold anything in reserve, but that's probably 12 years of moderating broadcast forums and seeing question "2" pop up a few days after question "1."

Heheh. I'm going to take a wild guess at this point that you have no idea what my own history is, but lemme just say that people should almost never try to "impress" people with their credentials while on the internet. It's usually irrelevant to the topic at hand anyway.

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Yes, you can mess up more, but doing so means you know more.

Meanwhile, they have goofed up video they have to deal with. ;^)

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Yes, you can *somewhat* approximate the looks of cooled or warmed frames in post, but it's better to do it in acquisition to avoid recompression when possible. Stills...not so important. Video?
Exceptionally important.

Magic Bullet much?

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Either way...I'll probably stick with giving too much/more information than not enough/less info. Someone might stumble across a really valuable setting or tidbit of information in my usually meandering explanations.
TMI has always been my affliction. Just ask LTDiver

Dats cool, but . . .

Uh, I'm probably never going to have to ask Lori anything; evah!. LOL. Trust me; I hear it all. ;^)

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[ltdiver 3]

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TMI has always been my affliction. Just ask LTDiver

Ever hear of KISS?

ltdiver

Don't tell me the sky's the limit when there are footprints on the moon

[AndyMan 7]

Thanks for the explanation.

I've always known (sorta) what the White Balance did, but I never knew why I'd want to futz with it.

Let the futzing begin.
_Am

__

You put the fun in "funnel" - craichead.

[DSE 3]

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to "impress" people with their credentials while on the internet. It's usually irrelevant to the topic at hand anyway.
Magic Bullet much?

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Didn't know I was meaning it as establishing "credentials." I don't feel the need to do that at all.
as far as MB...google my name combined with theirs. To say anything more would appear to be "impressing people with my credentials." Or you could contact Red Giant directly and ask the Sharp brothers if I "magic bullet much"
Either way, I don't believe in withholding information when it's not necessary or harmful. However, you're the moderator. If you'd rather that I provide quarter-ass answers instead of complete information... I guess I can try to do that too.

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[quade 3]

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as far as MB...google my name combined with theirs. To say anything more would appear to be "impressing people with my credentials." Or you could contact Red Giant directly and ask the Sharp brothers if I "magic bullet much"

This was my point! You said something about not doing color corrections in post. I found it ironic.

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Either way, I don't believe in withholding information when it's not necessary or harmful. However, you're the moderator. If you'd rather that I provide quarter-ass answers instead of complete information... I guess I can try to do that too.

[sigh]
Look, I'm not here to start fights, but you certainly seem to think so. Take the chip off your shoulder.

You gave your information and opinion and I gave mine.

I don't -care- how much or little information you give. You'll notice I never, anywhere, told you to stop.

That said, fooling the camera into a setting other than white was never the intended purpose of White Balance.

quade -
The World's Most Boring Skydiver

[DSE 3]

I guess I missed your point about MB, Quade. MB is not, and never has been, a color correction tool. It's not marketed as such, and not used as such. It's a color alteration tool, used as an effect, and doesn't blanket affect anyone group of pixels, but rather responds to pixels in a given area with varying values. It's NOT a post-color correction tool. Maybe that's where I got lost, is now I understand you think of MB or Celluloid as a "color correction tool. Hence the reason I felt you were wanting to argue. BTW, I'm the author of Celluloid. We don't claim that as a color correction tool any more than Red Giant claims MB is color correction. Be patient with me, I'll get it figured out...folks here aren't interested in a complete answer, so I'll do my best to dumb it down from now on.

Steve, point your camera at something that is white, and press the button. That's *all* you need to know. The camera will do the rest

[AHoyThere 0]

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fooling the camera into a setting other than white was never the intended purpose of White Balance.

This may be true. But, by setting a custom WB the camera can produce desired results with less post processing. There are products that can help with this in a controlled manner to give consistent results such as the Warm Cards available here...
http://www.studio1productions.com/warmcards.htm

These cards will help adjust WB to produce either a warmer or cooler image by "fooling" the camera White Balance setting to something other than true white.
This may be exactly what the cameraman wants and adjusting WB may be the best way to accomplish the goal.
While these cards are marketed for video, they work with digital still cameras just as well in order to set a custom white balance to give either warmer or cooler results if that is what the cameraman wants.

[Fast 0]

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My error, I thought he was asking what white balance is, not which setting to use.

Oh no. I believe you understood him correctly and did, in fact, give him some useable information.

That said . . . probably quite a bit more than he needed.

I don't think the average semi-pro user really has any business fooling around with the white balance setting procedure that is implemented in the Sony consumer cameras since it has a LOT of ways to f up the video.

I think the MUCH safer way of doing things is to shoot consistantly using the presets; even if you want a "special" coloring effect and then deal with it in post.

A person can -always- adjust in post if he wants, but taking goofed up footage and attempting to make it look "normal" and match it to "standard" settings is much, much harder.

Ok sure and I know your background in video and stuff... But, those of us who don't know a whole ton about video, color, etc... might want to learn more about it. It's a shame I don't have time in my life to redo school and learn more about photography because man it makes me happy taking pictures.

If DSE wants to take the extra time to give a full answer I don't see why people should tell him not to. Though sometimes its over the heads of a lot of people, its always in the archives then and at some point someone might find it usefull.

I learn more about light every day.

And no i am not trying to talk crap to anyone :)

~D
Where troubles melt like lemon drops Away above the chimney tops That's where you'll find me.
Swooping is taking one last poke at the bear before escaping it's cave - davelepka

[DSE 3]

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While these cards are marketed for video, they work with digital still cameras just as well in order to set a custom white balance to give either warmer or cooler results if that is what the cameraman wants.

Actually, when Doug Jensen created the WarmCards, he did so with still cams in mind. They offer a small set on a necklace/lanyard for stills.

Thx for the input, guys.