softlandings 0 #1 January 5, 2003 Well, I tried again. Good exit, struggled a bit getting stable, and actually RELAXED! I did the turns! Did my forward movement! Smiled! And then my goggles blew up over my helmet! I couldnt see anything, was not sure where my JM was, struggling trying to see, my JM pulled. I was devestated, I knew I failed again. Had standup landing, but who cares?? I didnt pull when I was in trouble. So, now what do I do? Try again? How do I practice altitude awareness?? Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CrazyIvan 0 #2 January 5, 2003 Well, first of all, check your googles next time, they MUST be tight or this will happen again, do you wear glasses/contacts? Altitude awareness must come like a SECOND NATURE, I'd say, if you wear a watch, do some chores or just walk around the house, and aprox. every 5 secs look at your watch, or, play a song on your stereo, lay on the floor, practice your body position wearing your alti and do the same, if there is a song you like, and you keep that in your head, next time you jump, that song will play in your head and automatically you'll be looking at your alti, that's a auto-memory effect. I don't know, I'm just trying to help you, but you should develop a method by yourself. Don't feel bad about failing, look at it this way, YOU WILL GET TO JUMP AGAIN!!! __________________________________________ Blue Skies and May the Force be with you. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #3 January 5, 2003 I'm sorry about what happened with your Level IV jump. Have you determined what went wrong with your goggles? It's not something you want to get into the habit of doing (because it sucks) but it is possible to skydive without goggles. When all is said and done, it sounds like you just need to be more aware of your dynamically changing skydiving environment. The more you jump, the more experience you will gain and the more your internal clock will start to kick in. Thank you JM for being there when you had problems, but the next time something weird happens, try to think rationally and try not to hestitate with your actions. Learn to be an independent skydiver. This is a great sport and we want you to be part of it. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SkydiveMonkey 0 #4 January 5, 2003 QuoteHow do I practice altitude awareness I've seen "altis" that are used for ground practice - you start it off at say 12k and it'll wind down at a normall freefall rate so you can work on your awareness. Maybe there's one at your dz?____________________ Say no to subliminal messages Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Luna 0 #5 January 5, 2003 Man, that sucks! I'm still in my student progression, too, so take this for what it's worth. I had trouble on my very first jump seeing my altimeter. I really thought I was around 1-2 grand higher than I was. Then when my instructors started pointing their fingers in my face (signal to pull), it took me a bit before I realized what they were telling me. I managed to get pulled right before he would have pulled for me, so I passed. It scared me, though. From my experience, you don't need to practice altitude awareness. Ever since then, all of my instructors can tell you, and have told me, that I have great altitude awareness. I guess that it just scared me enough that I have become super-vigilant about checking my altitude all the time. As far as your situation, personally, if I had my goggles blow off and I couldn't see, I would have waved off and pulled right then. But, don't let it get you down! Try again. You know now that you can do the required maneuvers for the jump (you did get those turns signed off on your proficiency card, right?). You just have to go do it one more time, and this time your goggles shouldn't be a factor. But, talk to your instructor about what you should do if they are. I say I would have pulled, but ask your instructor what you should have done. That way you will be prepared if it ever happens again. Just don't give up! You'll get through it. We all do, eventually. Good luck! I'm walking a marathon to raise money for the Leukemia & Lymphoma Society. Click Here for more information! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rmcvey 0 #6 January 5, 2003 Quote Well, I tried again. Good exit, struggled a bit getting stable, and actually RELAXED! I did the turns! Did my forward movement! Smiled! And then my goggles blew up over my helmet! I couldnt see anything, was not sure where my JM was, struggling trying to see, my JM pulled. I was devestated, I knew I failed again. Had standup landing, but who cares?? I didnt pull when I was in trouble. So, now what do I do? Try again? How do I practice altitude awareness?? Up untill the googles coming off sounds like you were doing a real good skydive. On my AFF level 1 the strap on my Protec came lose and started spanking me in the face. I just froze in freefall thinking "jeez i didnt think freefall would hurt this much" I didnt do my practice pulls and only noticed my altimeter at 6500', from which point i just stared at it until I deployed. When i got down i looked like someone had give me cracking left hook, and had blood down my chin, and spent the next few days badly bruised. I thought id really messed up at the time but looking back now i can understand why it freaked me out so much. Talk to your JM about it, and ask him/her what you should have done?? They may tell you that ideally, in future you should do this..... or do that........ just listen to them an learn from their advice... ...but they will also say to not worry too much, repeat the jump, RELAX again, smile and this time make sure you goggles are tight enough!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
seedy 0 #7 January 5, 2003 I had a pair of goggles fly off of me too. I had prescription sunglasses on underneath them. They went too. It was such a surprise that I also lost altitude awareness and the JM pulled. Thankfully, the JM was there. It taught me an important lesson. The next time something happened that caused me to lose focus in that manner, I waved off and pulled. Remember what they are drilling into you. Your priorities: 1 PULL 2 PULL at altitude 3 PULL stable. I intend to live forever -- so far, so good. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #8 January 5, 2003 Quote Well, first of all, check your googles next time i agree, and i'll add to that, you might want to buy a pair of your own. its by far the cheapest thing you'll buy (maybe beside rubber bands), but it will save you the trouble of adjusting the pair you borrow every time anyway, be glad that you've learned this lesson now and not later on when you are all alone. i'm pretty sure that in the future, if something like that happens again , you'll wave and pull. O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #9 January 5, 2003 Hopefully a more experienced skydiver can interject here into this topic. But based on my Eloy boogie experience, just pulling (at any ole altitude) because one feels out of control is just as dangerous. At a busy dropzone, you've got to know that there'll be another skydiver in your airspace any minute and if you pull at the incorrect altitudes, you put yourself and the other skydiver(s) following you at risk. Now it's my understanding that if you do pull early (whether you did it, or had a pre-mature delpoyment) you must immediately fly your canopy off of the flight line. Just my two cents and I'm sure a more experience skydiver can add to all of this. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dterrick 0 #10 January 5, 2003 Interesting thing that happens under AFF that might not happen under Static/IAD progression. You said it right when you said "didn't pull when you were in trouble". IAD's dont get to see ANYBODY else in the air until RW training starts and that can be 30 jumps or more. By then, altitude awareness will have set in and most processes will be automatic. (Read on... there are always different circumstances) My pre-second RW training jump (# in the 40's) I was equally freaked and elated to have a jump coach that I blew past declared breakoff. By then I was regularly pulling at 2500 ... and 4k came and went because I was "aware" I was not at pull altirude. Still pulled in time but got shit for a bad breakoff. THAT was a lesson told me only once. You too will now know that the "SAFE" thing to do in ANY equipment failure early on in your jump career (unstable and unable to get stable, lost goggoes, flipped contact lens, obstructed altimeter, leg cramp... bla bla bla...) is to pull. Pulling out of the record 300 way for a "minor" equipment mal would likely be frowned upon by 299 others and a dozen pilots (never forget air traffic when under canopy - especially when nobody expects you to be there!). Then again, nobody I know of has ever burned in by pulling too highEnjoy your repeat dive. And never EVER whine about a soft, on target landing. The skydive is not over till you're packed and ready to go again! Dave Life is very short and there's no time for fussing and fighting my friend (Lennon/McCartney) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dex 0 #11 January 5, 2003 Quote But based on my Eloy boogie experience, just pulling (at any ole altitude) because one feels out of control is just as dangerous. I'm not sure I'm more experienced but here is my take; Pulling at a high altitude at a busy boogie can be dangerous but it's not as dangerous as not pulling, AFF students (at least I was) are all taught that if they are unsure of their altitude (and can't figure it out) to pull. Esp when you only have a couple freefalls under your belt it's more important to pull then to worry if someone will freefall through your canopy for the rest of your life. The fact is all skydivers should know their altitude.... and if they don't they should pull. The rules are in order of importance 1 PULL 2 Pull at safe altitude 3 Pull stable.. If I'm ever in freefall and blind from being kicked in the head, or losing glasses/contacts I'm gonna give a *GOOD* wave and pull. Sure it's possible I'll pull at 8 grand, better 8 grand then 800 feet and a main/reserve entanglement.... If I have awareness I'll wait until I think I am a grand above my normal altitude.. I won't wait for my cypres. As for failing AFF4.. people aren't born with altitude awareness it has to be learned, you've prolly only left an airplane a half dozen or so times learn from the jump and move on! :) Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanuckInUSA 0 #12 January 5, 2003 Hey I'm not saying that people shouldn't pull when something they can't handle happens. I just want some of the newer folks to know that they should not be hanging out on the flight line if they've pulled high. If you find yourself open (for whatever reason) above the normal pull altitudes for your drop zone, please fly your canopy off of the flight line as soon as possible. Try not to worry about the things you have no control over Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
falxori 0 #13 January 5, 2003 Quote If you find yourself open (for whatever reason) above the normal pull altitudes for your drop zone, please fly your canopy off of the flight line as soon as possible. i think that goes for any altitude. there are still people who are yet to deploy close to you. as soon as its open and controlable, i head 90 degrees from jump run direction. O "Carpe diem, quam minimum credula postero." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sebazz1 2 #14 January 6, 2003 If at any time a student is unaware of their suroundings or their altitude they must pull. It is part of their freefall emergency procedures or the 5 second rule used for AFF levels 3 through 7. Sounds to me like you just need to redo the jump with your newly learned lesson and move on from there. Good Luck! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kuper 0 #15 January 10, 2003 hey! i'm really really really glad to hear you fell good and succeeded in your turns!!! i did today (again) a hold heading dive, and my JM caught me twice because i started turning and then while tring to fix it - i just got it worse ... but he still think next time i have to do AFF5 (he passed me AFF4 - god knows why) i mean, he is the chiff of the club - but what will be when i'll be turning from the moment i get out - and without a JM holding me?!?!?! please tell me how you fixed your body position, and don't take it so badly. in the end line - it was the target of this jump, and you got to it!!! besides, my goggles blew up at the 2nd time i tried AFF4 - and yes - it was frightening, but look at this that way: you have this trouble now with your JM. think what would happend if he weren't there? (and believe me - you won't take a 'too big' goggles again from that time) tell me what's going on :) blue sky! http://www.orikuper.printroom.com Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
