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tstar

Stowing question and Fittment with Dacron and Rubber Band sizes

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I’m newly licensed and I finally found a used rig!! Wings 31, PDR 253 and a PD Silhouette 230 w/Dacron lines. Fitment is really good and I’m super happy with it!! It has an Argus AAD but that’s another discussion…

So, I’ve been practicing packing because I suck at it and I’m burning through rubber bands like crazy. The ones breaking are the locking stows and any AFTER the brake cascades, they are crazy tight! I got a pack of rubber bands and they look like the small ones. Is it OK to use the larger bands for the cascaded section of the lineset and the smaller rubber bands for the skinnier section??

Also according to Wings the W31 is made for a 260. My plan was to find a used 260 and jump that for a little while longer until I’m ready for the 230. But I can’t for the life of me see how in the hell a 260 could ever fit in this tray UNLESS the Dacron lines really take up that much space???

Tim

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2 hours ago, tstar said:

UNLESS the Dacron lines really take up that much space

They really do take up that much space. 

As for your question on rubber bands; I'm going to encourage you to get with your local rigger to discuss the matter. If you do not have a local rigger, please contact the manufacturer for guidance (or both).

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13 hours ago, tstar said:

I’m newly licensed and I finally found a used rig!! Wings 31, PDR 253 and a PD Silhouette 230 w/Dacron lines. Fitment is really good and I’m super happy with it!! It has an Argus AAD but that’s another discussion…

So, I’ve been practicing packing because I suck at it and I’m burning through rubber bands like crazy. The ones breaking are the locking stows and any AFTER the brake cascades, they are crazy tight! I got a pack of rubber bands and they look like the small ones. Is it OK to use the larger bands for the cascaded section of the lineset and the smaller rubber bands for the skinnier section??

Also according to Wings the W31 is made for a 260. My plan was to find a used 260 and jump that for a little while longer until I’m ready for the 230. But I can’t for the life of me see how in the hell a 260 could ever fit in this tray UNLESS the Dacron lines really take up that much space???

Tim

I prefer Dacron lines, but they do cause the canopy to fit as one size larger.

Also, I use the standard rubber bands (NOT the shorter ones for microline), and double stow.  Usually loose around one per jump on average (I also take them off if they are showing that they will break in the next few jumps).  Remember, you need them to:

- Hold when they should (good condition, right size band, right size bite, and tight enough - double wrap helps this)

- Release when they should (right size band, neat bits and stows)

- Break when needed (rubber bands or tube stows*. NOT castration bands, O-rings, or other solutions to "save you money and time")  Its the difference between changing a rubber band and having a high-speed malfunction/reserve repack/finding that lost main that's still in the bag... yea... good luck with _that_ needle in a hay-field.
*I like tube stows, but I know many folks don't... not trying to start _that_ flame war here...

Having said that, TALK TO YOUR RIGGER.
(s)he should be able to show, instruct, teach, demonstrate, and double check your work on this...  if they won't or can't, TALK TO A DIFFERENT RIGGER...

Blue skies!!

JW


 

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Thanks guys!

It's the off season up here in snow country and the closest rigger to me is infrequently in his loft, I couldn't even coordinate an inspection of this rig from him so I had Joannie at Sunshine Factory check it over before it was shipped up here. Can't speak highly enough about her!!!

The reserve will need to be re-packed before the season opens up again here and I'll have the rigger go over it with a fine tooth comb, maybe even wash it... But for now my goal is to become proficient at packing!!

JW - I noticed those tube stows and thought they looked like a pretty good idea. Are they silicone tubes and do they last substantially longer then the ribber bands? A little research showed that the biggest gripe with them is that they don't stay tight on the bag, right? A quick loop and knot of dental floss would fix that and can easily be cut off when needed... I might look into those...

Thanks again!!!

Tim

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16 hours ago, tstar said:

No to securing the tube stows more securely to the D-Bag??

Tim

No. While the possibility isn't 'super big', you risk a baglock if something breaks 'weird'. Not worth the risk.

General reply:

There are two common sizes of rubber stow bands.

Small (will fit around the top of a beer bottle)

Big (will fit most of the way down the neck of a beer bottle).

There are also 'tandem' bands that are the same circumference as 'big' but much wider. Those aren't normally used on a sport rig.

Personally, I use the big ones for the locking stows and the small ones for the rest.
I single wrap the first two locking and double wrap the second (above & below cascades). I single wrap the small ones the rest of the way.
I know that some folks disagree with this, and that's fine. 
This is the way I've done it for a very long time and it's worked well so far.

I replace the bands that are partially torn. I usually pull on them pretty hard to get the bights (not "bites") in, so ones that are damaged often break.

I get that it's winter and you don't have much access to 'professional advice', but the stowing of the lines part of packing isn't the part that's tough to learn (not that it isn't important, it's just pretty basic).

For practice packing, getting the folded canopy into the bag & the first two locking stows is a good place to stop (and rip it open to start over). Stowing all the lines is a bit of overkill and uses up rubber bands. 

 

As always, my $0.02, worth about what you paid for it, not a professional, didn't even stay at a Holiday Inn last night.

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That sounds good to me and makes total sense. I'm anal and tend to over think everything. I'll probably try and dig up my old fish scale and try to make some sort of force gauge out of it to try and test various rubber bands and stow bands.

Should all the bights should have an equal pull force or should it get progressively stronger?

Besides... I believe only the Holiday Inn EXPRESS creates savants or over night experts! lol

Tim

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I would recommend using regular rubber bands and double stowing everything, and not worrying about the pull force that much. Hear me out. Single stowing can produce sufficient force on majority of the lines, but (speaking about locking stows) the line that sits on the bottom touching the grommet isn't as tensioned as the rest of them, nor does it have sufficient friction and can fall out much easier. If it falls out, it can wrap around something and cause a bag lock.

As for the non locking stows, they are touching the rubber all around, but if you are using the same rubber bands for everything, they are going to be too loose to single stow for the non locking ones. You could use smaller rubber bands and single stow for the non locking stows, but that means keeping spares of both sizes, and that sucks. 

The most important thing is that your lines disconnect from the stows in the correct order. Bag locks aren't fun, line dumps even less so. Pull force is secondary to that. I would also recommend getting a semi stowless. Much easier to pack, better openings, less chance of a bag lock. If they are good enough for your reserve, they should be good enough for your main.

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On 12/1/2021 at 1:21 PM, tstar said:

Should all the bights should have an equal pull force or should it get progressively stronger?

You might check out this packing video from PD. The line stows part starts at the 21:00 minute mark

 

 

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