SF strike on Iranian Nukes

[lawrocket 3]

I’ll keep it real. The US has a long history of involvement beyond our borders. For a while it was the Monroe Doctrine. But starting after WWII, the Domino Theory provided a rationale for the expansion of US power across the globe. Yes, we’ve assassinated people. We’ve supported human rights abusers. We’ve hand hands in all kinds of dirty stuff. Difference is that now we’re actually bragging about it.

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Say/do nothing until Jerusalem and Tel Aviv are smoking radioactive craters?

Part of the problem may be that we AREN’T saying and doing nothing. Seems to me the policy has been to do whatever we can to prevent Israel from knocking out those threats. But recall back in the early 80’s when Israel conducted a bombing raid on an Iraqi nuclear power plant under construction and faced international condemnation.

Israel can defend itself and they don’t fuck around. The US – and the rest of the world – is usually set on trying to hold Israel back from its activities.

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Yet, when they make it clear they are pursuing weapons of mass destruction, and make it abundantly clear through words and actions (supporting Hamas and other terrorist groups in this case) that they are least likely to act on their threats, do the threatened countries have no right whatsoever to mitigate the threat?

It’s a tough issue. Admittedly, a very tough issue. On the one hand, we’d like to think that we can engage in pre-emptive war. On the other hand, we did that in Iraq – so we said. Iran also has a pretty strong grass-roots presence of people wanting a more Western-type government (I think Iran is actually one of the greatest hopes we have for an establishing a solid democracy in the Middle East within the next 20 years) and this kind of thing is likely not helpful.

But it’s not mitigating a threat. It’s mitigating a threat of an ability to carry out a threat that might be made. I’m still one of those who thinks preparing a defense and retaliation is superior to “pretaliation.”

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Your principles may favor a different outcome, I suppose

They do. It’s just my way of thinking. It’s thinking, “What would our response be if it was done to us?” We’d be outraged.

I look at the act and not the actor.

My wife is hotter than your wife.

[wolfriverjoe 1,340]

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So committing acts of war are wrong?

Yes. Unless in defense. Start a war with us? We'll blow your asses out. I don't have a problem with that.

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if you want to talk of "Moral Highground" in a conversation that involves Iran then that high ground isn't very high.

Are you saying that we're the gutter but Iran's the sewer? So let's go down there where they are?

I'm quoting this one, but you made some valid points about how tough of a situation this is a little further on.

I'm mostly in agreement that acts of war should only be committed in self defense, but how far should we allow Iran to get before we attack?
Do we have to wait until they actually have an atomic weapon and have used it before we attack?

Best guess is they'd attack Israel, but that's not certain.

I don't have see a real problem in "lowering ourselves to their level" and using proxies and puppet groups to disable or damage their abililty to gain weapons that are that destructive.

Of course, there is a reasonable argument that if they do manage to join the "Nuclear Club" that they will actually calm down a bit and be more responsible.
It goes along the lines of: If they obtain this level of power, they will become targets of that sort of power. Hopefully they will understand that if they actually use their nukes, then Tehran and maybe a couple of other cities will become smoking, glowing holes in the ground.

Right now they really aren't under that sort of threat. If they get nukes, they certainly will be. It all depends on how rational the leaders really are. Are they more interested in staying in power? Or in fulfilling "Allah's Will" even if it means that they won't be around to see it.

Troubling and scary.

"There are NO situations which do not call for a French Maid outfit." Lucky McSwervy

"~ya don't GET old by being weak & stupid!" - Airtwardo