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jclalor

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So conservative Christian Gov. Perry goes fund raising in Iowa while leaving others to deal with a tainted death penalty case back in Texas. Passing the Buck takes on a whole new meaning.
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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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You can't serve two masters...

I don't know how christian politicians do it.

What a conundrum, eh guys?

"...And I thought, my God... the genius of that! The genius! The will to do that! Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we, because they could stand that these were not monsters, these were men... trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love... but they had the strength... the strength... to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral... and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling... without passion... without judgment... without judgment! Because it's judgment that defeats us...."
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

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You can't serve two masters...

I don't know how christian politicians do it.

What a conundrum, eh guys?

"...And I thought, my God... the genius of that! The genius! The will to do that! Perfect, genuine, complete, crystalline, pure. And then I realized they were stronger than we, because they could stand that these were not monsters, these were men... trained cadres. These men who fought with their hearts, who had families, who had children, who were filled with love... but they had the strength... the strength... to do that. If I had ten divisions of those men, our troubles here would be over very quickly. You have to have men who are moral... and at the same time who are able to utilize their primordial instincts to kill without feeling... without passion... without judgment... without judgment! Because it's judgment that defeats us...."



Apocalypse Now!

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Gov. Perry may not have lost any sleep (paraphrasing his own words) over the possibility of a man being sentenced to death because he's black, but there are at least five justices on the Supreme Court who were concerned enough to take another look. WWJD?
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Gov. Perry may not have lost any sleep (paraphrasing his own words) over the possibility of a man being sentenced to death because he's black, but there are at least five justices on the Supreme Court who were concerned enough to take another look. WWJD?



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C. Jesus' ethic of love and forgiveness doesn't disallow capital punishment.

1. "But Jesus would forgive."

a. This argument proves too much.

1) It becomes an argument against any punishment what-so-ever.
2) What should we do with the criminal we've forgiven?
a) Life in prison instead of capital punishment?
b) But Jesus would forgive.

b. Jesus never challenged the validity of the death penalty.

1) In Jn 8:3-11, for example, there were no witnesses left to testify against the woman caught in adultery (the Law required at least two witnesses).
2) Jesus actually upheld the Law here, He didn't abrogate it, but He did so in a way that wouldn't allow the evil designs of the Scribes and Pharisees to be accomplished.

c. Jesus asked God to forgive, not Caesar; He didn't suggest civil punishment or capital punishment was inappropriate.

d. We must argue for the coherence and consistency of both Testaments.

1) The question is not, "Was Jesus right or was Moses right?"
2) We must also factor in Paul and Peter.

2. "Jesus was crucified."

a. I'm not sure what the point is here? Yes, Jesus was the victim of capital punishment, but what follows from that?

b. The real issue regarding Jesus was not capital punishment, but His innocence.

1) Peter assails the act of handing over an innocent man to godless executioners.
2) Men of Israel, listen to these words: Jesus the Nazarene, a man attested to you by God with miracles and wonders and signs which God performed through Him in your midst, just as you yourselves know--this Man, delivered up by the predetermined plan and foreknowledge of God, you nailed to a cross by the hands of godless men and put Him to death. (Acts 2:22-23)

3. But what about forgiveness?

a. God's mercy is always available in His court.

b. Man's court is another matter, governed by different biblical responsibilities.

D. One simply can't say that capital punishment is patently immoral on biblical grounds.



The Bible and Capital Punishment By Gregory Koukl

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So conservative Christian Gov. Perry goes fund raising in Iowa while leaving others to deal with a tainted death penalty case back in Texas. Passing the Buck takes on a whole new meaning.



You are a remarkable in that you want to hold Gov Perry accountable for his absence for everything that happens in TX. However, you have no comment on BHO's absence during critical times in the nation.

Intellectual elite exhibits a consistent meaning every time.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.

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Does anyone see that paradox in these scriptures:

1. God ordains governing authorities:

a. Jn 19:11 Jesus answered [to Pilate], "You would have no authority over Me, unless it had been given you from above."

b. Rom 13:1-2 Let every person be in subjection to the governing authorities. For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God. Therefore, he who resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves.

Jesus says to the authority, Pilate, "You would have no authority over Me, unless it had been given you from above."

The following scripture:
Rom 13:1-2 Let every person be in subjection to the governing authorities.
Pilate is the governing authority. Is he not? My understanding is that he is.

It goes on to say:
For there is no authority except from God, and those which exist are established by God.

Now, if Pilate is the governing authority, and that his authority existed, it must had been established by God as Pilates authority existed.

Final:
Therefore, he who resists authority has opposed the ordinance of God; and they who have opposed will receive condemnation upon themselves.

Did Jesus resist or not? My understanding is that he did resist Pilates authority.
"...And once you're gone, you can't come back
When you're out of the blue and into the black."
Neil Young

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So what? Christian apologists for immoral acts abound. There were Christians running the Inquisition. There were Christians helping Nazis escape to S. America following WWII. I don't see Christians supporting the death penalty as any better.
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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So conservative Christian Gov. Perry goes fund raising in Iowa while leaving others to deal with a tainted death penalty case back in Texas. Passing the Buck takes on a whole new meaning.



You are a remarkable in that you want to hold Gov Perry accountable for his absence for everything that happens in TX. However, you have no comment on BHO's absence during critical times in the nation.

Intellectual elite exhibits a consistent meaning every time.



BHO is President of the USA, not President of Washington DC.

When was BHO out of the USA at a critical time?
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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So what? Christian apologists for immoral acts abound. There were Christians running the Inquisition. There were Christians helping Nazis escape to S. America following WWII. I don't see Christians supporting the death penalty as any better.



The question isn't what people (right or wrong) have done with scripture. The question is, what does the Bible say concerning a subject? What is the principal (if any) that can be derived? Does it apply to us or not? That is done through a systematic approach. Pull from "all" of scripture concerning something to derive meaning (e.g. what the Bible says concerning capital punishment)....along with historical/grammatical interpretation.

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Gov. Perry may not have lost any sleep (paraphrasing his own words) over the possibility of a man being sentenced to death because he's black, but there are at least five justices on the Supreme Court who were concerned enough to take another look. WWJD?



"The heads. You're looking at the heads. Sometimes he goes too far. He's the first one to admit it."

"One through nine, no maybes, no supposes, no fractions. You can't travel in space, you can't go out into space, you know, without, like, you know, uh, with fractions - what are you going to land on - one-quarter, three-eighths? What are you going to do when you go from here to Venus or something? That's dialectic physics"

"This is the way the fucking world ends! Look at this fucking shit we're in, man! Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm fucking splitting, Jack"
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

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So what? Christian apologists for immoral acts abound. There were Christians running the Inquisition. There were Christians helping Nazis escape to S. America following WWII. I don't see Christians supporting the death penalty as any better.



The question isn't what people (right or wrong) have done with scripture. The question is, what does the Bible say concerning a subject? What is the principal (if any) that can be derived? Does it apply to us or not? That is done through a systematic approach. Pull from "all" of scripture concerning something to derive meaning (e.g. what the Bible says concerning capital punishment)....along with historical/grammatical interpretation.



Its hard to say the Bible is 100% against capital punishment. Overall, it certainly seems to okay it in various circumstances, even in the NT (Romans 13:4 For he is God's servant to do you good. But if you do wrong, be afraid, for he does not bear the sword for nothing. He is God's servant, an agent of wrath to bring punishment on the wrongdoer. )
You stop breathing for a few minutes and everyone jumps to conclusions.

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Its hard to say the Bible is 100% against capital punishment.




That's an understatement. The bible is nothing but one huge collection of contradictory writings from the bronze age.



Life is a contradiction...you are born to die.

Perhaps feeble minds cannot wrap themselves around a paradox?

It doesn't matter what you think...it's about prespective.

"Do I contradict myself? Very well, then I contradict myself, I am large, I contain multitudes."
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

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***Its hard to say the Bible is 100% against capital punishment.




That's an understatement. The bible is nothing but one huge collection of contradictory writings from the bronze age.



Life is a contradiction...you are born to die.

Perhaps feeble minds cannot wrap themselves around a paradox?

It doesn't matter what you think...it's about prespective.

"Do I contradict myself? Very well, then I contradict myself, I am large, I contain multitudes."



What ever you say Colonel Kurtz.

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Gov. Perry may not have lost any sleep (paraphrasing his own words) over the possibility of a man being sentenced to death because he's black, but there are at least five justices on the Supreme Court who were concerned enough to take another look. WWJD?



"The heads. You're looking at the heads. Sometimes he goes too far. He's the first one to admit it."

"One through nine, no maybes, no supposes, no fractions. You can't travel in space, you can't go out into space, you know, without, like, you know, uh, with fractions - what are you going to land on - one-quarter, three-eighths? What are you going to do when you go from here to Venus or something? That's dialectic physics"

"This is the way the fucking world ends! Look at this fucking shit we're in, man! Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm fucking splitting, Jack"



What have you been drinking?
...

The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

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Gov. Perry may not have lost any sleep (paraphrasing his own words) over the possibility of a man being sentenced to death because he's black, but there are at least five justices on the Supreme Court who were concerned enough to take another look. WWJD?



"The heads. You're looking at the heads. Sometimes he goes too far. He's the first one to admit it."

"One through nine, no maybes, no supposes, no fractions. You can't travel in space, you can't go out into space, you know, without, like, you know, uh, with fractions - what are you going to land on - one-quarter, three-eighths? What are you going to do when you go from here to Venus or something? That's dialectic physics"

"This is the way the fucking world ends! Look at this fucking shit we're in, man! Not with a bang, but with a whimper. And with a whimper, I'm fucking splitting, Jack"



What have you been drinking?



Apocalypse Now Shooters with coffee, minus the tequila and vermouth...
Your secrets are the true reflection of who you really are...

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