Global warming worse than thought

[brenthutch 383]

The horror.....the horror

http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2007/11/everything_is_caused_by_global.html

[rhys 0]

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The site's stated mission is to expose all the "scares, scams, junk, panics and flummery cooked up by the media, politicians, bureaucrats and so-called scientists and others that try to confuse the public with wrong numbers" Professor Brignell's motto is "Working to Combat Math Hysteria."

This exercise is not merely a lark to show the abject absurdity of this global warming nonsense. Brignell wrote a great book titled Sorry Wrong Number, The Abuse of Measurement on this very subject.

When I was in Africa there was malaria everywhere. We took some of the local expat scientists and researchers at the local hospital there for a jump and became their friends. They were studying tropical diseases especially. I learned from them that malaria is more often than not miss-diagnosed, the local population have seen many people die and they do not understand the scope of disease. Therefore every stubbed to and illness that has stomach cramps or fever is blamed on Malaria.

By that rationale, does that mean that malaria does not exist?

I don't like the term 'global warming' and I have grown to dislike the term ‘climate change’ as neither of them encompass the scope of the problems we are facing.

It simply comes down to recourse management and how much we all understand about the repercussions of our actions.

I imagine many of you don’t stop to think of what happens to the stuff you throw away, or what it was that was used to create it and know many of you are the right wing free trade do what ever you please type character.

I can agree to disagree on those things, but the fact of the matter is that through greed, lack of education or inadvertent repercussions of our actions, we are destroying the fragile ecosystems on our most beautiful and living environment.

Everybody dances around semantics, regulations and politics while the decimation continues.

Currently you have a bunch of greedy cunts that have controlled much of the worlds oil supply for many decades and become the most affluent and impressionable people in the world and they are not even able to cap a leaking oil well.

They were too busy trying to make even more billions investing in other areas and they can't even fix up a mess that they created without burning it?

This is crap, we all should be ashamed of ourselves and we should agree to begin to change our ways. This by the way does not mean we have to miss out on anything in particular because we can always substitute for another.

We just need to use our brains more, and not be controlled by those that want to make profit out of us, whichever your definition of profit is.

The exponential human impact on the very life that supports us is overwhelming. It is also ‘seemingly’ impossible to reverse. The life of Planet Earth is being depleted and destroyed at an exponential rate for the profit of a few and at a great expense to us all, and those that follow us.

It is not just about temperature or carbons, it is much more than that, it is the attitude that there will always be these recourses and that we have no responsibility to look after them.

That is weak, that is arrogant, uneducated, ignorant and stupid.

It is a shame, but it is reality.

You can choose to ignore it, or you can choose to try to move towards sustainability.

But who cares anyway, we'll all be dead in 80 years anyway, right?

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[kelpdiver 2]

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Currently you have a bunch of greedy cunts that have controlled much of the worlds oil supply for many decades and become the most affluent and impressionable people in the world and they are not even able to cap a leaking oil well.

Now you're angry at the British?!

BTW, you do know the carbon footprint of flying from NZ to the Americas and back, right? If you think that your desire for a "carbon neutral DZ" means you're not part of the problem, you just as bad as the millions of Prius driving hypocrites we see in the US (and no, Bill, I'm not identifying you in this group).

[rhys 0]

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Now you're angry at the British?!

BTW, you do know the carbon footprint of flying from NZ to the Americas and back, right? If you think that your desire for a "carbon neutral DZ" means you're not part of the problem, you just as bad as the millions of Prius driving hypocrites we see in the US (and no, Bill, I'm not identifying you in this group).

BP is as british as Shell is Dutch, these people have a responsability to us all to clean up the mess they created. Yet it is the gulf states that will have to bare the repercussions.

Are you suggesting I have to become a ferral, soap dodging, tree hugg'n hippie if I am going to be aware and concerned with the problems we are facing, or I should just get a F350 with 28 inch spinners and be done with it?

Do you not belive hybrid and electric cars being intergrated into our current supply is not a good idea?

The car I want most right now beleive it or not is a seppo mobile, I would love a Chevy Volt.

With one of these (or a tesla,or any of the other electric cars that are coming out) I would have the access to relatively easily create my own feul supply.

You may want to be dependant on Oil forever. I would like to move on from that type of thinking.

Each to their own though I supose.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[kelpdiver 2]

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Are you suggesting I have to become a ferral, soap dodging, tree hugg'n hippie if I am going to be aware and concerned with the problems we are facing, or I should just get a F350 with 28 inch spinners and be done with it?

I'm suggesting that being "carbon neutral" via credits is a far cry from consuming fewer resources in the first place. And that SF is full of high earning DINKs (like yourself) that talk about green, but are full of it. Using a prius to more efficiently drive 60 miles a day to work loses to those who own that F350, but take the bus (or bike) 4 miles to work downtown.

[billvon 2,400]

>I'm suggesting that being "carbon neutral" via credits is a far cry from
>consuming fewer resources in the first place.

I agree - but it is one way. There are some things (primarily aviation) where there are simply no good alternatives to fossil fuels, although there are some alternatives on the horizon. If you do have to fly, the best way to offset this use is directly, by using less fuel in other places. (Biking instead of driving to work for example.) Another way is effectively paying someone else to do that. As an example of this, buying carbon credits so that a third party can build a solar power facility, and thus reducing the amount of coal burned, can work.

[brenthutch 383]

Who is the regulating authority in the carbon offset market? Who makes sure that 1000 lbs of carbon is offset, and how? Or is this just a big scam playing on the emotions of well meaning but uninformed folks. Who did Al Gore pay to offset his seaside multi million dollar crib?

[billvon 2,400]

>Who is the regulating authority in the carbon offset market?

The most official one is the "clean development mechanism" which is really a mechanism, not an authority. It's administered by the CDM executive board, which in turn is part of United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change.

Less official ones are Green-e Energy (geared towards renewable energy) Environmental Resources Trust (geared towards reforestation) and Voluntary Carbon Standard (general carbon reduction strategies.) Another one is the EPA. They do not directly valuate or certify carbon offsets, but they do have very good methodologies to certify carbon reduction effectiveness via their Green Power Partnership program.

>playing on the emotions . . . .

You mean people who use statements like "Who did Al Gore pay to offset his seaside multi million dollar crib?"

[brenthutch 383]

I don’t see the emotion in my query. Al Gore bought multi million dollar crib with a half a dozen fire places. Since his is in the carbon offset market I wondered if he paid himself.

[maxmadmax 8]

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Who did Al Gore pay to offset his seaside multi million dollar crib?

Try Ken Lay of Enron fame.

Don't go away mad....just go away!

[brenthutch 383]

Riddle me this Batman,

Does a carbon offset lower the temp of the planet or does it divert resources that would be better allocated else ware.

[brenthutch 383]

It seems to me that this carbon offset thing is like the purgatory thing. "Pay me a lot of money or your relatives will rot in hell" vs. Pay me allot of money or you will destroy the planet.

[rhys 0]

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It seems to me that this carbon offset thing is like the purgatory thing. "Pay me a lot of money or your relatives will rot in hell" vs. Pay me allot of money or you will destroy the planet.

Carbon is only the surface of the problems we are facing but you might want to consider this scenario also.

If you charge me lots of money for billowing out carbons, I may decide to invest in technology that will reduce my output or counteract it...

For example, If a factory can dump its shit in a river without onsequnce, then they will do it. If cost to clean the river are imposed on the factory, it may cost them more in the long run to just dump the shit and they will be forced to create a solution.

Try to think along those lines...I don't necesarily agree entirly with the whole carbon trading thing but at least it is a start.

The auditing problem of where the moeny will go is a separte issue, You could start the solution to that by auditing the federal reserve, but that would open a can of worms that would destroy the USA as we know it, huh!

Have you ever read the Dr. Seuss book called 'The Lorax?'

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[rhys 0]

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I'm suggesting that being "carbon neutral" via credits is a far cry from consuming fewer resources in the first place. And that SF is full of high earning DINKs (like yourself) that talk about green, but are full of it. Using a prius to more efficiently drive 60 miles a day to work loses to those who own that F350, but take the bus (or bike) 4 miles to work downtown.

Sometimes we have no choice other that to use fossil fuels, this is not our fault, this is the fault of the greedy, the regulations and intelectual property laws.

If someone invents an electric plane for example, there is nothing stopping Cessna or piper or a conglomerate of all aircraft companies from purchasing the patent and not implementing it because they may make more money in the long run selling spare parts for IC aircraft etc.

If I am to pay a company to offset my carbon i want to make damned sure it is going to the right place and doing what they say, of course some of it is going to be administraton costs so we will pay more. For this reason I will act locally and think globally.

There is no perfect answer, but credits are a damned sight better than simply allowing pollution to go unchecked.

If people make money out of us not being able to breath propery/polluting. Those people need to contribute to the clean up.

"When the power of love overcomes the love of power, then the world will see peace." - 'Jimi' Hendrix

[billvon 2,400]

>I don’t see the emotion in my query.

Imagine if someone had replied to you thusly:

"Oh, but you're OK with Bush killing US soldiers to get his oil?"

Would you answer that seriously, or would you figure someone was just looking for an emotional response?

(BTW I answered the first part of your question seriously, but I'm guessing you really didn't want an answer.)

[brenthutch 383]

Act NOW, Carbon offset credits on sale for half off! PM me for details!!!!

[billvon 2,400]

>Does a carbon offset lower the temp of the planet

No, it just reduces the amount of CO2 emitted.

>or does it divert resources that would be better allocated else ware.

No, it actually funds creation of those resources.

>It seems to me that this carbon offset thing is like the purgatory thing.
>"Pay me a lot of money or your relatives will rot in hell" vs. Pay me allot
>of money or you will destroy the planet.

I have never seen anyone claim that. I think people who purchase carbon offsets now are similar to people who donate money to charities - they want to help, but cannot feed people directly themselves. I think that makes the world a better place overall.