RonD1120 58
Quotelet me re-assure this, so, if i ever get married, and am a spirit-filled christian, jesus wont give a fuck if i beat up my wife!? your buddy seems less and less appealing..
You missed the point. I didn't explain it well. If you are gay, God says that is sin. If you abuse your wife, God says that is sin. One is not worse than the other.
Quote
Ephesians 5:(NKJV)
22 Wives, submit to your own husbands, as to the Lord. 23 For the husband is head of the wife, as also Christ is head of the church; and He is the Savior of the body. 24 Therefore, just as the church is subject to Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in everything.
25 Husbands, love your wives, just as Christ also loved the church and gave Himself for her, 26 that He might sanctify and cleanse her with the washing of water by the word, 27 that He might present her to Himself a glorious church, not having spot or wrinkle or any such thing, but that she should be holy and without blemish. 28 So husbands ought to love their own wives as their own bodies; he who loves his wife loves himself. 29 For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as the Lord does the church. 30 For we are members of His body,[d] of His flesh and of His bones. 31 “For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh.”[e] 32 This is a great mystery, but I speak concerning Christ and the church. 33 Nevertheless let each one of you in particular so love his own wife as himself, and let the wife see that she respects her husband.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
Andy9o8 0
QuoteNo, the gay can pray for forgiveness and change their lives.
"Being" and "conduct" are two different things, which all too often, unfortunately, get improperly commingled in debates about homosexuality. Conduct itself may very well be a personal choice; although it is frequently driven by innate nature. A straight person may choose to be celibate, or not. A gay person may choose to be celibate, or not. But homosexuality is a state of being into which one is born; and that state of being, as a state of being, is not a personal choice.
Repression, revulsion, rejection, condemnation or punishment of, or even trying to "convert" or "re-educate", a homosexual for nothing more than being born into that state of being is ignorant and cruel.
ah, ok! sorry for the confusion, but; so, if a gay man, beats his boyfriend, or a gay woman hits their girlfriend, they'll burn in hell anyway!? up and until the point where they give up on their gay lifestyle, get married and its all good again?
you know, i moved away from my parents many moons ago, but i'm not married; is that a sin too?
the girls i dated wouldnt let me be their head, they wanted me to give them head and i wanted them to give me head too, but i wasnt their head.. well, yes, i guess you could twist it that way..
are you married? how many times? how many ex-wifes does your pastor and your other buddies have? i think god doesnt like divorces, they are an annoyance in his master plan, how do you feel about that?
you know, i moved away from my parents many moons ago, but i'm not married; is that a sin too?
the girls i dated wouldnt let me be their head, they wanted me to give them head and i wanted them to give me head too, but i wasnt their head.. well, yes, i guess you could twist it that way..
are you married? how many times? how many ex-wifes does your pastor and your other buddies have? i think god doesnt like divorces, they are an annoyance in his master plan, how do you feel about that?
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
RonD1120 58
QuoteQuoteNo, the gay can pray for forgiveness and change their lives.
"Being" and "conduct" are two different things, which all too often, unfortunately, get improperly commingled in debates about homosexuality. Conduct itself may very well be a personal choice; although it is frequently driven by innate nature. A straight person may choose to be celibate, or not. A gay person may choose to be celibate, or not. But homosexuality is a state of being into which one is born; and that state of being, as a state of being, is not a personal choice.
Repression, revulsion, rejection, condemnation or punishment of, or even trying to "convert" or "re-educate", a homosexual for nothing more than being born into that state of being is ignorant and cruel.
In today's society it is a tough debate. From the Christian standpoint we have the beginning Scripture,
QuoteGenesis 1:26-28 (New King James Version)
26 Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over the cattle, over all[a] the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.” 27 So God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. 28 Then God blessed them, and God said to them, “Be fruitful and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it; have dominion over the fish of the sea, over the birds of the air, and over every living thing that moves on the earth.
And the condemnation Scripture such as the one previous,
QuoteRomans 1:26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
As well as,
QuoteRevelation 22:12 “And behold, I am coming quickly, and My reward is with Me, to give to every one according to his work. 13 I am the Alpha and the Omega, the Beginning and the End, the First and the Last.”[f]
14 Blessed are those who do His commandments,[g] that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city. 15 But[h] outside are dogs and sorcerers and sexually immoral and murderers and idolaters, and whoever loves and practices a lie.
Therefore, the argument becomes God intended for man and woman to procreate and other sexual relationships are lust. Fornication in all forms and conditions are sinful behavior.
We live in a society where majority rules. Obviously, the number of gays is increasing. Therefore, we have to deal with them. Furthermore, we have accepted fornication within our society as acceptable.
Homosexuality used to be considered a mental illness but majority rule changed that perspective. There are classic conditions that predictably result in same sex attraction.
I think it is the degradation of society, of mankind in general and, sign of the times that we are in our last days. However, I know that with God a day is as a thousand years and a thousand years is as a day. Ergo, this social condition ain't going away. As a counselor, I only address the issue with a client if they bring it up.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
Andy9o8 0
You have not addressed the distinction between "being" and "conduct". In fact, you have evaded it with non-sequitur (or a not-truly-responsive answer) designed, it would seem, principally to enable you to use the opportunity to prosletyze. With all due respect, it's a technique you seem to use frequently in many of your response posts.
Sorry, but that's just nonsense. The innate, from-birth state of being of homosexuality is not increasing; it's just that open acknowledgement of such being is increasing in our society. Also - and I hate analogies, but I feel I have no choice - saying that homosexuality is no longer classified as mental illness due to majority rule is like saying that the Earth is no longer considered flat due to majority rule. Semantically, it may have some technical validity, but that's only because the "majority" have come to replace ignorance with knowledge.
If you think you can get these kinds of arguments past intelligent people, I think you'll find you're mistaken.
QuoteWe live in a society where majority rules. Obviously, the number of gays is increasing. Therefore, we have to deal with them. Furthermore, we have accepted fornication within our society as acceptable. Homosexuality used to be considered a mental illness but majority rule changed that perspective. There are classic conditions that predictably result in same sex attraction.
Sorry, but that's just nonsense. The innate, from-birth state of being of homosexuality is not increasing; it's just that open acknowledgement of such being is increasing in our society. Also - and I hate analogies, but I feel I have no choice - saying that homosexuality is no longer classified as mental illness due to majority rule is like saying that the Earth is no longer considered flat due to majority rule. Semantically, it may have some technical validity, but that's only because the "majority" have come to replace ignorance with knowledge.
If you think you can get these kinds of arguments past intelligent people, I think you'll find you're mistaken.
RonD1120 58
Quoteah, ok! sorry for the confusion, but; so, if a gay man, beats his boyfriend, or a gay woman hits their girlfriend, they'll burn in hell anyway!? up and until the point where they give up on their gay lifestyle, get married and its all good again?
you know, i moved away from my parents many moons ago, but i'm not married; is that a sin too?
the girls i dated wouldnt let me be their head, they wanted me to give them head and i wanted them to give me head too, but i wasnt their head.. well, yes, i guess you could twist it that way..
are you married? how many times? how many ex-wifes does your pastor and your other buddies have? i think god doesnt like divorces, they are an annoyance in his master plan, how do you feel about that?
I hope I say this with understanding, we are born sinners. Therefore, we commit sin. To be forgiven of our sins, we must accept Jesus Christ of Nazareth as our Lord and Savior. To be condemned and eternally lost requires no action. To be saved and receive eternal blessing requires a decision for Christ. It is a gift but it must be accepted. That acceptance is called repenting of sin. Meaning, the sinner must change his mind. You make a 180 and go in the other, opposite direction.
I do not have a pastor at this time. I have been married three times. The first ended because of my sinful behavior after four years. The second ended after ten years when my wife left. I think she relapsed on drugs but lack proof. Her main stated reason was that she hated Florida and would forsake our relationship to move back out west. My third marriage is approaching fifteen years and will last until death.
You are correct, God hates divorce. With Christ all things are possible, including marriage.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
so, how many divorces have you had since you were born again!? and isnt that in direct contradiction to your beliefs!?
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
RonD1120 58
QuoteYou have not addressed the distinction between "being" and "conduct". In fact, you have evaded it with non-sequitur (or a not-truly-responsive answer) designed, it would seem, principally to enable you to use the opportunity to prosletyze. With all due respect, it's a technique you seem to use frequently in many of your response posts.
QuoteWe live in a society where majority rules. Obviously, the number of gays is increasing. Therefore, we have to deal with them. Furthermore, we have accepted fornication within our society as acceptable. Homosexuality used to be considered a mental illness but majority rule changed that perspective. There are classic conditions that predictably result in same sex attraction.
Sorry, but that's just nonsense. The innate, from-birth state of being of homosexuality is not increasing; it's just that open acknowledgement of such being is increasing in our society. Also - and I hate analogies, but I feel I have no choice - saying that homosexuality is no longer classified as mental illness due to majority rule is like saying that the Earth is no longer considered flat due to majority rule. Semantically, it may have some technical validity, but that's only because the "majority" have come to replace ignorance with knowledge.
If you think you can get these kinds of arguments past intelligent people, I think you'll find you're mistaken.
No argument intended from me. I was using the term argument in a rhetorical sense. I think that is the correct term.
When I was in graduate school, 1971-73, the American Psychological Association considered homosexuality as a mental illness. The DSM-IV does not. You assumed argument that was not intended. I say it is a complex issue. From the Christian standpoint it is sin. From the social/legal standpoint, manage it within legal bounds.
You are starting to reveal emotion.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
RonD1120 58
Quoteso, how many divorces have you had since you were born again!? and isnt that in direct contradiction to your beliefs!?
One. And, yes, I did not want it. My wife moved to California and said the marriage was over. I waited a year and then divorced her. It is impossible to unscramble eggs.
![[:/]](/uploads/emoticons/dry.png "[:/]"){kind=small}
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
Andy9o8 0
QuoteFrom the Christian standpoint it is sin.
You are again evading the distinction between conduct in which one may or may not engage, and innate nature into which one is born.
QuoteYou assumed argument that was not intended.
No, I didn't. I knew fully well what you intended, and you know that I knew. Which means I know that you know that I knew. Ya know?
QuoteQuoteso, how many divorces have you had since you were born again!? and isnt that in direct contradiction to your beliefs!?
One. And, yes, I did not want it. My wife moved to California and said the marriage was over. I waited a year and then divorced her. It is impossible to unscramble eggs.
one flesh, shouldnt you have moved with her then!?
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
RonD1120 58
QuoteQuoteFrom the Christian standpoint it is sin.
You are again evading the distinction between conduct in which one may or may not engage, and innate nature into which one is born.
I do not believe a person is born homosexual. I believe it is learned behavior. I cannot prove it. I just believe it based on Scripture.
How's that?
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
wmw999 2,148
How did you learn to be heterosexual?
Wendy P.
Wendy P.
There is nothing more dangerous than breaking a basic safety rule and getting away with it. It removes fear of the consequences and builds false confidence. (tbrown)
Andy9o8 0
QuoteQuoteQuoteFrom the Christian standpoint it is sin.
You are again evading the distinction between conduct in which one may or may not engage, and innate nature into which one is born.
I do not believe a person is born homosexual. I believe it is learned behavior. I cannot prove it. I just believe it based on Scripture.
How's that?
Artificial ignorance, I suppose.
RonD1120 58
Quote
one flesh, shouldnt you have moved with her then!?
That is an excellent point and has merit. In my situation, it would have required allowing our house to go into foreclosure. My father was terminally ill and my mother needed my support. I chose to stay in Florida.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
QuoteHow did you learn to be heterosexual?
Wendy P.
BOOBIES!!!
“Some may never live, but the crazy never die.”
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
Skyrad 0
QuoteTo be forgiven of our sins, we must accept Jesus Christ of Nazareth as our Lord and Savior.
Q1) Why?
Q2) Whay did God insist that someone had to die as a sacrafice if he's a loving God of the New Testament?
Q3) What happened to all the millions of people who lived before Jesus was even born? Are they burning in hell through no fault of their own?
When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Lucius Annaeus Seneca
Andy9o8 0
QuoteQuoteHow did you learn to be heterosexual?
Wendy P.
BOOBIES!!!
If you get this thread moved to Bonfire, I'm gonna hunt you down like a dog. Go name your penis.
RonD1120 58
QuoteHow did you learn to be heterosexual?
Wendy P.
My girlfriend taught me and my buddies supported the teaching.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
RonD1120 58
Quote
I do not believe a person is born homosexual. I believe it is learned behavior. I cannot prove it. I just believe it based on Scripture.
How's that?
Artificial ignorance, I suppose.
It works for me.
Look for the shiny things of God revealed by the Holy Spirit. They only last for an instant but it is a Holy Instant. Let your soul absorb them.
-Hunter S. Thompson
"No. Try not. Do... or do not. There is no try."
-Yoda
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