Questions for those who are Born Again

[windcatcher 0]

I would rather be called "follower of Christ" since the word "Christian" is loosely claimed by many people, often by those who believe in God and only attend church on Easter, and continue to live their lives contrary to God's word.

Mother to the cutest little thing in the world...

[pajarito 0]

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I would rather be called "follower of Christ" since the word "Christian" is loosely claimed by many people, often by those who believe in God and only attend church on Easter, and continue to live their lives contrary to God's word.

I'd rather be called born again because that's what Jesus said.

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Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
John 3:3

Judas was a "follower of Christ." He believed just like Satan believes.

Repentance & faith. Repentance & faith.
(born again)

[karenmeal 0]

Wasn't Judas set up by Jesus in order to fulfill his prophecy of being denied by an apostle?

"Life is a temporary victory over the causes which induce death." - Sylvester Graham

[Royd 0]

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Wasn't Judas set up by Jesus in order to fulfill his prophecy of being denied by an apostle?

sounds like a conspiracy theory to me.

[SuperKat 0]

Don't ever feel you'd be offending Chrstians by miswording or not grasping things and what not.

It is never "OK" to sin as a Christian. It's fine if you committed a sin and ask for forgiveness, just try your darndest to not repeat it again. It's not about going to church, giving money and trying to convert others. What matters is what's in your heart and how your heart is in relationship with Jesus.

Christians go to church for worship and fellowship with other Christians. It's not abot converting others either. You cannot convert a person's heart. Only God can. However, you can spread the good news (gospel). Once you've done your part God handles the rest.

What's the goal, you ask? Jesus loves you. He loved you so much that he died for you and I and paid your sins in full for you and I. All he wants is for you to love him as much as he loves you. Going to heaven is a free gift from God. It's not something you earned by being a Christian.

Living a good life? There is no such thing. You are not perfect and God knows that. You can't live a sinless life. With the saving grace of Jesus you can live a blameless life.

Those that live a good life? You mean someone who never broke the 10 commandment's and they never ever ever heard about the Gospel of Jesus? I honestly don't know. This is a good question to ask a Pastor or Theologian. I just know that if a person led a good life and never ever broke the 10 commandments but has rejected Jesus. That person's name will not be in the book of life.

A Christian that does horrible things to people and continues to do this to people? How do we view this person? As a Christian, it's not right for us to judge people whether they are Christian or not. However, my speculation would be that this person obviously has backslidden and has lost his relationship with Christ through his heart. Perhaps this person's heart wasn't 100% when he gave his life to God. Perhaps he became a Christian because he thought it was the right thing to do. Perhaps this person became a Christian because he didn't want to go to hell. Who knows? It's all speculation because i don't know the given situation and the person you're referring to. The bottom line is that he/she will be judged accordingly by God.

How shoud you react to the same person if they're preaching to you? If this person is spreading the gospel of Jesus he's giving you "the good news". If on the other hand, this ame person is preaching to you about how to live a Godly life or what you're doing is sinful, that's a different story. Basically, if this same person is not giving you the good news and he wants to call you out and judge you, then he is a hippocrite and he's doing the exact opposite of what God wants him to do.

A lot of Christians may or may not have the same views about this than I do. A true Christian church will believe:
1. Jesus is your Lord and Savior, he died for your sins and 3 days later he was resurrected to build a mansion for us to live in all eternity with him.
2. We have a personal relationship with Jesus Christ through our hearts.
3. The bible is the final authority of God.

Before I became saved I researched Christianity for at least two years. I found a lot of answers through going to different non-denominational churches, reading tracts and booklets, and havng my own experiences of seeing God through the eyes of my heart. A good source of info is:
http://www.carm.org

Great books to read to help your research:
1. The Purpose Driven Life
2. The Bible Answer Book by Hank Hanegraf

What's the most you ever lost in a coin toss, Friendo?

[jakee 1,259]

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Wasn't Judas set up by Jesus in order to fulfill his prophecy of being denied by an apostle?

Yes

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jakee 1,259]

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Living a good life? There is no such thing. You are not perfect and God knows that. You can't live a sinless life. With the saving grace of Jesus you can live a blameless life.

Well thats an incredibly sad (and slightly dishonest) way of looking at things. Living a 'good' life does not neccessitate being perfect or 'sinless'. Its not a binary scale, you can slip up once or twice and still be a good person (not now Paj).

What sort of way to go through life is it thinking "Oh well I may be horrible and unworthy but at least I can suck up to this bloke and he'll give me a free pass." Thats just depressing!

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[chadkal 0]

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Wasn't Judas set up by Jesus in order to fulfill his prophecy of being denied by an apostle?

absolutely not,....
where would you get such an adea?
yes it did fulfill a prophecy,....but how did Jesus set him up?

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I am a greek midget

[freeflybella 0]

Thanks again.

According to your reply - it is mostly evangelical work. The Way of The Master, I mean. And this is the part I'm curious about. Is there a continuum? Isn't there a trial period? A time for living out that you've been saved before you go out and 'spread the word"?

Can someone, that simply - accept Jesus as his saviour one day, and then begin questioning others as to whether they are liars and thieves?

Do you believe that a person can be one way today and tomorrow be a completely changed person having finally seen the light? Is it that clear and immediate?

And can that person then start calling others to Jesus right away?

Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

[SuperKat 0]

What's the most you ever lost in a coin toss, Friendo?

[jakee 1,259]

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I'm sorry, I'm a little hard of hearing, what was that?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[jcd11235 0]

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he was resurrected to build a mansion for us to live in all eternity with him.

[blasphemy]I hope it's easier to find than the arc.[/blaspemy]

Math tutoring available. Only $6! per hour! First lesson: Factorials!

[Royd 0]

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Do you believe that a person can be one way today and tomorrow be a completely changed person having finally seen the light? Is it that clear and immediate?

And can that person then start calling others to Jesus right away?

Go back and remember when you first started jumping. You viewed life differently, and couldn't shut up about it.

Receiving the new birth is the same way. A radical change will happen in your thinking processes.

You won't have to be put into a room to be brainwashed. You will know that something has happened to you that you can't really explain. At this point it will be helpful to have someone you can trust to bounce questions off of.

Of course, just like in skydiving, those who are interested will show interest, and those who aren't will shut you down quickly.

[pajarito 0]

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Wasn't Judas set up by Jesus in order to fulfill his prophecy of being denied by an apostle?

No.

[pajarito 0]

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Is there a continuum? Isn't there a trial period? A time for living out that you've been saved before you go out and 'spread the word"?

I’m not really sure what you’re talking about with regard to a “trial period” but “it’s appointed for man once to die, then the judgment.” Better make haste. Make the best out of whatever time you’ve got.

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Can someone, that simply - accept Jesus as his saviour one day, and then begin questioning others as to whether they are liars and thieves?

If there is true conversion (born again), there will be a deep concern for those who aren’t. That’s because I no longer simply believe, I know what they will face when they die. The same thing I will face. Righteous judgment. I’m not judging you by asking if you’ve lied or stolen, etc. I’m a liar and a thief at heart also.

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Do you believe that a person can be one way today and tomorrow be a completely changed person having finally seen the light? Is it that clear and immediate?

Yes. True conversion is a radical change. You will become a new creature in Christ. He will give you new desires and new direction. That doesn’t mean you don’t sin anymore. You just don’t wallow in it and you don’t desire to. It’s the difference between floating down the river of sin or swimming against the current. You cannot sin, ask for forgiveness (confession or whatever), continue in a pattern of sin, and expect to be truly saved. That is a sign of a false convert.

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And can that person then start calling others to Jesus right away?

They are commanded to do so.

"Have you no wish for others to be saved? Then you are not saved yourself. Be sure of that." He continued, "The saving of souls, if a man has once gained love to perishing sinners and his blessed Master, will be an all-absorbing passion to him. It will so carry him away, that he will almost forget himself in the saving of others. He will be like the brave fireman, who cares not for the scorch or the heat, so that he may rescue the poor creature on whom true humanity has set its heart. If sinners will be damned, at least let them leap to hell over our bodies. And if they will perish, let them perish with our arms about their knees, imploring them to stay. If hell must be filled, at least let it be filled in the teeth of our exertions, and let not one go there unwarned and unprayed for." –Charles Spurgeon

[TonyJ 0]

Yes. True conversion is a radical change. You will become a new creature in Christ. He will give you new desires and new direction. That doesn’t mean you don’t sin anymore. You just don’t wallow in it and you don’t desire to. It’s the difference between floating down the river of sin or swimming against the current. You cannot sin, ask for forgiveness (confession or whatever), continue in a pattern of sin, and expect to be truly saved. That is a sign of a false convert.

i dont agree with you here, salvation is a free gift, you cannot work to keep yourself saved, yes sinning and keep asking for forgiveness in a pattern is not good, but lets keep it in context, that has nothing to do with salvation. they may be a young convert, satan knows our weakness.......


Mt 18:21 ¶ Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Mt 18:22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

Lu 17:4 And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.
(KJV)

so do you think he would expect this from us, but not him? tony

[freeflybella 0]

Fascinating.

I really appreciate your answering my questions.

One final. When this conversion happens, when a person goes from being one person one day to a completely changed person the next day - is there any specific doctrine regarding how he is to handle his relationships with the people in his life?

I mean, if God comes first - what about the friends and family who don't believe?

How can a woman, for instance, who is married, become born again and then remain in a marriage when her husband refuses (but say for the sake of argument, tolerates) to follow along? What about her parents? And her friends?

Is there some kind of doctrine regarding these situations?

Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

[Botellines 0]

Your sig line is very scary. Do you really believe what that "are you a good person" link sais?

It only incites fear on the people, according to that page i am going straight to hell, however i consider myself a good person as i try to live a decent live and not hurt others.

I think those who made that web page are horrible people because they only want to control others by fear and that is bad. How i hate righteous people!!!

I wish born again christians would realize that i don´t have to be wrong for them to be right. They can be right as well as i don´t give a damn about what they think.

[freeflybella 0]

Interesting comparison.

I do remember what I felt like after my first jump. I was stoked. I wanted to do it again and again and again.

But I wasn't a completely changed person and I sure didn't want to go telling people I was a "skydiver".

I knew no one would get it unless they did it. I was bored as hell trying describe the indescribable. I only talked about it when someone asked. Of course then I was happy to gush with excitement.

I certainly didn't go around calling people pussies if they didn't want to jump.

But your and Pajarito's explanations differ, from what I gather.

In his explanation, it's about saving others. Not sharing the wonder. His seems to be about a warning.

Did I misunderstand?

Action expresses priority. - Mahatma Ghandi

[pajarito 0]

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i dont agree with you here, salvation is a free gift, you cannot work to keep yourself saved, yes sinning and keep asking for forgiveness in a pattern is not good, but lets keep it in context, that has nothing to do with salvation. they may be a young convert, satan knows our weakness.......


Mt 18:21 ¶ Then came Peter to him, and said, Lord, how oft shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? till seven times?
Mt 18:22 Jesus saith unto him, I say not unto thee, Until seven times: but, Until seventy times seven.

Lu 17:4 And if he trespass against thee seven times in a day, and seven times in a day turn again to thee, saying, I repent; thou shalt forgive him.
(KJV)

so do you think he would expect this from us, but not him? tony

I don't know what you're talking about. Pretty much the whole book of Romans illustrates what I'm talking about here. Nothing I've said so far is "work righteous." Salvation IS a free gift and you can do absolutely nothing to earn it. However, without awareness of their sinfulness, there will be no repentance. Without repentance, there will be no forgiveness. Without forgiveness, there is no salvation. Those who aren't born again are under the Law of God. The law shows them that their sin is exceedingly sinful in the eyes of God and leads them to the cross. That is its purpose. Once born again, they are no longer bound by the law and are saved from having to pay the penalty for their lawlessness.

[pajarito 0]

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Your sig line is very scary. Do you really believe what that "are you a good person" link sais?

Yes.

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It only incites fear on the people, according to that page i am going straight to hell, however i consider myself a good person as i try to live a decent live and not hurt others.

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It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.
Hebrews 10:31

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I think those who made that web page are horrible people because they only want to control others by fear and that is bad. How i hate righteous people!!!

They’re not righteous and neither am I. Neither are you. That’s the point. If it instills some fear in you at this point, that’s good. The fear of the Lord is the beginning of wisdom (Proverbs 9:10).

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I wish born again christians would realize that i don´t have to be wrong for them to be right. They can be right as well as i don´t give a damn about what they think.

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Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.
Acts 4:12

If you would sincerely examine yourself and listen to your conscience, you’d realize that you fall short of God’s moral law and have broken it countless times. He sees every thought and deed all of which will be judged when you die.

[TonyJ 0]

when you said,"You cannot sin, ask for forgiveness (confession or whatever), continue in a pattern of sin, and expect to be truly saved. That is a sign of a false convert." i took that as you were talking about a saved person, asking for forgiveness. but if you were talking about a non believer than i understand. tony

[pajarito 0]

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When this conversion happens, when a person goes from being one person one day to a completely changed person the next day - is there any specific doctrine regarding how he is to handle his relationships with the people in his life?

Love the Lord with all your heart, soul, strength, mind and your neighbor as yourself. Pray. Read the Bible and follow its instruction. Grow in your faith. You should have concern for the eternal destiny of others. Jesus said, to go and make disciples of the world. Spread the good news.

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I mean, if God comes first - what about the friends and family who don't believe?

If you realize that they’ll suffer eternal damnation if they were to die in their sins, you should tell them. If it doesn’t concern you, you should worry about your own salvation. You might need to examine yourself and make sure you’re in the faith.

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How can a woman, for instance, who is married, become born again and then remain in a marriage when her husband refuses (but say for the sake of argument, tolerates) to follow along? What about her parents? And her friends?

Because she should love him and visa versa as Jesus loved both of them. God loved the world so much that he gave his only son to be the sacrificial payment for all sinners. He didn’t abandon them because they were. Just the opposite. That’s love.

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Is there some kind of doctrine regarding these situations?

It’s all in the Book.

[pajarito 0]

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when you said,"You cannot sin, ask for forgiveness (confession or whatever), continue in a pattern of sin, and expect to be truly saved. That is a sign of a false convert." i took that as you were talking about a saved person, asking for forgiveness. but if you were talking about a non believer than i understand. tony

I was talking about the unrepentant sinner. Sorry about the confusion.

[pajarito 0]

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when you said,"You cannot sin, ask for forgiveness (confession or whatever), continue in a pattern of sin, and expect to be truly saved. That is a sign of a false convert." i took that as you were talking about a saved person, asking for forgiveness. but if you were talking about a non believer than i understand. tony

By the way, my point was that, if you continue in a pattern of sin (e.g. plan to), there is real question whether you were ever born again in the first place. If you aren't growing in Christ and continue to "backslide" over and over again concerning the same thing, return and call on the Lord over and over again, then maybe there's a deep rooted problem. Maybe you didn't "slide forward" in the first place. In the end, some will cry Lord, Lord, and he will say depart from me you worker of iniquity. Paul says to examine yourself to see if you're in the faith. He says to make your election sure.