Video Is a Window Into a Terror Suspect’s Isolation

[jenfly00 0]

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The funny thing professor is that I have been where the rubber meets the road for over 24 years. Again don't lecture me on the Constitution, I'm not one of your captive audience. When you are at the tip of the spear (so to speak) you help shape the interpretation of the Constitution. It is somewhat of a living, breathing document isn't it?

I feel all warm and fuzzy knowing there are right minded people like you out there enforcing the law.

Out of curiosity, what fascinating and rewarding career path did you abandon to become a cop?

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[skycop 0]

Really?
Isn't that what courts and ultimately the Supreme Court are for?
Sometimes what you think and what I think may be different in terms of the Constitution.
It is a document that lives and breathes.
We don't live by the Napoleonic code, we live by rules that bend and twist, depending on many factors.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[skycop 0]

Evidently not the one you chose.
My tag line says it all, or at least what some people think.
If you don't have a point then feel free to (try) insult me, oh wait........you did............

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[jenfly00 0]

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Evidently not the one you chose.
My tag line says it all, or at least what some people think.
If you don't have a point then feel free to (try) insult me, oh wait........you did............

I don't believe simple to be causative of stupid ...but, you know, they seem to hang out together quite a bit.

It's your god given right to be simple and/or stupid. It's your views and comments about being the tip of the spear shaping the interpretation of the constitution.

It does seem you are markedly myopic about being willing to destroy your house (allegorically speaking) to combat those who oppose it.

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"O brave new world that has such people in it".

[Skyrad 0]

I can't help but think SO WHAT. This guy is being treated no differently (Actually most likely better) than hundreds maybe over the last six years thousands of others. Just because he is an American why should he be treated better than other humans that were innocent? Its bollocks that America treats anyone like this, its bloody criminal. The land of the free if it ever existed is a thing of the past. A dead relic of yester year. Its as dead as Soviet communism it was a nice idea but it simply didn't work. You now live in a country that executes, assasinates, kidnaps, tortures and imprisons without any regard for international law. A country that starts wars of aggression on countries that are of no threat to it and only countries that are weaker than it.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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The man is a traitor during wartime, he deserves what he gets. I could care less if he has PTSD, if he would have been successful in his mission the same people complaining would be calling for his head on a stick.
When we get hit again, and I said WHEN not if, the proper perspective will emerge for dealing with these people.

At least in the UK one is innocent until proven guilty, so much for truth justice and liberty for all

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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When we get hit again, and I said WHEN not if, the proper perspective will emerge for dealing with these people.

So instead of securing our borders and truely making us safe here.. Bush and Co send off our young men and women to a war that will get some people promoted.. and a bunchs of others dead to stroke his EGO to be a WAR president. Feel good programs like the TSA... and Homeland Security are at best a sham... to bad we did not STAY THE COURSE in Afghanistan... you know the place where the actual terrorists trained....oh thats right Georgieboy with his incompetence is not after Bin Laden anymore...

But like Tommy Franks has stated clearly... WHEN the next major attack occurs.. there will be martial law and our country will finally be a right wing wet dream police state.

Just think what could have been done using those troop numbers to secure the USA from the threat of a NBC attack by terrorists within the US by securing your borders.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[Skyrad 0]

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The funny thing professor is that I have been where the rubber meets the road for over 24 years. Again don't lecture me on the Constitution, I'm not one of your captive audience. When you are at the tip of the spear (so to speak) you help shape the interpretation of the Constitution. It is somewhat of a living, breathing document isn't it?

Bloody hell, are you serious? Over here its very senior educated judges that shape the interpretation of the constitution and never on their own. Thats f**king scary that you have such an attitude/belife.

When an author is too meticulous about his style, you may presume that his mind is frivolous and his content flimsy.
Lucius Annaeus Seneca

[wuffo2 0]

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I can't help but think SO WHAT. This guy is being treated no differently (Actually most likely better) than hundreds maybe over the last six years thousands of others. Just because he is an American why should he be treated better than other humans that were innocent? Its bollocks that America treats anyone like this, its bloody criminal. The land of the free if it ever existed is a thing of the past. A dead relic of yester year. Its as dead as Soviet communism it was a nice idea but it simply didn't work. You now live in a country that executes, assasinates, kidnaps, tortures and imprisons without any regard for international law. A country that starts wars of aggression on countries that are of no threat to it and only countries that are weaker than it.

What he said

[skycop 0]

Same here, what I was saying was my vocation (as a whole) has alot to do with the shaping of case law, not me personally. It is up to judges local, state, federal etc, to interpret constitution and rule accordingly.
As far as the "tip of the spear" comment, again my vocation along with several others are the ones running into buildings when everyone else in running out.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[skycop 0]

It does seem you are markedly myopic about being willing to destroy your house (allegorically speaking) to combat those who oppose it.


What does destroying my house have to do with allergies? Is it 'cause of all the dust and stuff?

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[Andy9o8 0]

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As far as the "tip of the spear" comment, again my vocation along with several others are the ones running into buildings when everyone else in running out.

Oh, big fucking deal. Like this is some kind of primitive dick-swinging contest. It doesn't negate the fact that you still have a fundamental lack of understanding of the true meaning of the rule of law as it should be practiced by democratic nations.

[jakee 1,255]

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When an American city becomes a smoking hole in the ground, and one will, then talk to me about constitutional guarantees.
Enemy combatants don't get the same treatment as "criminals" pure and simple.
Don't lecture me about taking an oath, he is a traitor and does not fall under those guidelines.

My word, control through fear is most certainly alive and well in the US!

If we allow this kind of 'justice' (hah) to become widespread then it cannot fail to harm the US. Innocent people will be locked up for very long periods of time and the complete and utter lack of transparency and oversight will allow the administration to claim x, y and z successes without actually having achieved a damn thing!

It is attitudes precisely like yours which would allow this to become the thin end of the wedge. You seem perfectly happy that rights are being taken away from traitors. The point you miss is that those rights are being taken away from anybody who could be accused of being a traitor. And that means everybody

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[skycop 0]

Uh no.........
I completely understand the rule of law, I LIVE it every day. The subject of the thread was not entitled to due process in the civilian court, at least not originally. His status changed BECAUSE of the rule of law, hence the "living, breathing" aspect of the Constitution and it's interpretation(s).
I doubt our current enemies take their captives to the dentist, if they did I'm afraid it would just be the head (minus the body).

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[skycop 0]

Not fear, reality. Mr. Padilla put himself into this situation.
I don't live in fear, I just understand that due to the very nature of our open society another attack is going to happen. It cannot be prevented, our enemies exploit this very openess and will use it against us.

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[jakee 1,255]

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I doubt our current enemies take their captives to the dentist, if they did I'm afraid it would just be the head (minus the body).

How our enemies treat detainees is completely and utterly irrelevant in how we should treat ours. Is freedom from summary execution the only freedom the government needs to afford us?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[idrankwhat 0]

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Same here, what I was saying was my vocation (as a whole) has alot to do with the shaping of case law, not me personally. It is up to judges local, state, federal etc, to interpret constitution and rule accordingly.

And the supreme court was set to do just that, until the injustice dept took it out of their hands in the eleventh hour.

As far as the "tip of the spear" comment, again my vocation along with several others are the ones running into buildings when everyone else in running out.

That's admirable. But that doesn't mean that just because you're mad at the perpetrators of a national tragedy that we should throw away the laws and principals that this nation was founded upon. Your responses are not far off from "a crime has been committed and someone has to pay. Someone. Anyone. Guilty or not. I want blood." Clear heads need to prevail after a tragedy, not myopic paranoid ones. If we let the latter make the decisions we end up with things like the Patriot act and the Iraq war.

[jakee 1,255]

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Mr. Padilla put himself into this situation.

But what if he didn't? How do you know he is a traitor? The government have said they think he is, but they have fought very hard to avoid having to prove it.

What if the government one day thinks you are a traitor? Are you going to lie back on your steel mattress in your bare cell and think "Oh well, its a fair cop, this is the price I pay for freedom" or are you going to be pissed off and demanding a trial?

Do you want to have an ideagasm?

[kallend 1,625]

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The funny thing professor is that I have been where the rubber meets the road for over 24 years. Again don't lecture me on the Constitution, I'm not one of your captive audience. When you are at the tip of the spear (so to speak) you help shape the interpretation of the Constitution. It is somewhat of a living, breathing document isn't it?

Apparently you DO need a lecture on the Constitution. You appear to have missed the point completely DESPITE your years of military service.

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[SkyDekker 1,123]

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Your responses are not far off from "a crime has been committed and someone has to pay. Someone. Anyone. Guilty or not. I want blood."

I agree, pretty scary coming from a cop.

[Andy9o8 0]

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His status changed BECAUSE of the rule of law, hence the "living, breathing" aspect of the Constitution and it's interpretation(s).

Utter bullshit. He has NOT been accorded the PROMPT due process of law mandated by the Constitution. He was a US citizen arrested in Chicago by the FBI on a "material witness warrant". On the eve of a court proceeding to challenge the warrant, President Bush signed an order designating him an "enemy combatant", and he was handed over to the military - THEREBY DEPRIVING HIM OF A HEARING BEFORE A JUDGE!! Problem is, "enemy combatant" is that vague "third category" the Bush Administration FABRICATED (that's the sleight-of-hand) to avoid having to treat someone either as a POW subject to the Geneva Convention, or a criminal defendant subject to due process of law under the Constitution. But for years, he was denied the due process of law of access to attorneys and a hearing by a neutral, impartial judge to determine whether he should be classified as a POW or a criminal defendant. It was not until three years of being incarcerated WITHOUT CHARGE that the government, very much under pressure, indicted him on criminal charges - and now his custody is finally being transferred from the military back to the Justice Department.

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I completely understand the rule of law, I LIVE it every day.

Sigh. More dick-swinging. Ok, well:
So do I; practice of law (including as a DA) for 20+ years, plus working in criminal justice for a few years before and during law school. I have great respect for the police, but cops and prosecutors aren't concerned with preserving the Constitution, they're focused solely on nailing perps.

[NCclimber 0]

Nice post, Andy.

[kallend 1,625]

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Not fear, reality. Mr. Padilla put himself into this situation.
I don't live in fear, I just understand that due to the very nature of our open society another attack is going to happen. It cannot be prevented, our enemies exploit this very openess and will use it against us.

Maybe you'd prefer this version:

Bill of Circumscribed Rights, 2001

Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion except Christianity, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech in government "free-speech zones" but will prohibit free speech elsewhere (such as airports, seaports and train stations) or of the press, which shall be owned and operated by capitalists; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble in "free-speech zones", and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances , although people are discouraged from sueing the government, and people may be charged or otherwise punished with the evidence kept secret which will make it hard to redress their grievances - sucks to be you!

Amendment II
A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed, except that real militia weapons are not allowed.

Amendment III
No Soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the Owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law. If we want your place, we'll just take it by eminent domain - sucks to be you!

Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized ,except the President has the power to authorize warrantless eavesdropping and physical searches if he feels like it, without telling anyone.

Amendment V
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury unless the President says they can in the name of the War on Terror™; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law unless we say so; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation, unless in the name of the War on Drugs. Although you have the right to remain silent, let's see how you stand up to waterboarding; sucks to be you!

Amendment VI
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial (but you may be taken to Gitmo or a secret prison and held indefinitely without trial) by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law (only if your crime was in Gitmo), and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation (although this can be classified, sorry); to be confronted with the witnesses against him (also classified); to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor (impossible if everything is classified), and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence when we say it's OK.

Amendment VII
In Suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise re-examined in any Court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law (see previous).

Amendment VIII
Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed (partial--bail and fines are moot if you are held without bail and your livelihood destroyed, sucks to be you!), nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted although torture is OK. But if you're in a secret prison, sucks to be you, ha ha!

Amendment IX
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people (but we'll appointed strict constructionists, who say if it's not in the Constitution, it doesn't exist).

Amendment X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people. (see Amendment IX; also, despite making "states' rights" claims, we'll overrule states whenever they are displeased with what states are doing; prosecution of distribution of medicinal marijuana is one small example)

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The only sure way to survive a canopy collision is not to have one.

[skycop 0]

Dick- swinging?
I'm not the one cussing and name calling. I thought lawyers like to use civility in debates.

but cops and prosecutors aren't concerned with preserving the Constitution, they're focused solely on nailing perps.

Yes, that is our job, would you want it any other way?

"Just 'cause I'm simple, don't mean I'm stewpid!"

[Andy9o8 0]

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but cops and prosecutors aren't concerned with preserving the Constitution, they're focused solely on nailing perps.

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Yes, that is our job, would you want it any other way?

Yes, I'd want you to do BOTH, as per your oath.