Muenkel 0 #26 February 20, 2002 QuoteWith "Native Americans" living on it without exploiting the natural resources... (*throws lid to can of worms down and runs*)Very true. The early settlers were very cruel in alot of ways to the Native Americans. But like I said, no society is perfect and we need to learn and move forward. As for spoiling the land...we must have progress. With progress comes a better standard of living. Yes, that progress has caused pollution and the destruction of natural resources, but once again we are learning. We are much more environmentally aware and are coming up with new ideas all the time on how to allow for progress and protect the environment at the same time. "I am a victim of my environment."Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #27 February 20, 2002 Quotewithout exploiting the natural resourcesBullshit, have you ever studied Anthropolgy? Indians wasted a shit load, it depends on the tribe and stuff. Stuff like the N. American horse became extinct b/c of them...then it was reintroduced about a 1000yrs later by europeans...."I said don't look Ethel, It was too late, she'd already been incensed... " Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Muenkel 0 #28 February 20, 2002 QuoteStuff like the N. American horse became extinct b/c of them...then it was reintroduced about a 1000yrs later by europeans....Maybe I am really stupid, but if they were extinct, how did they get reintroduced?"I am a victim of my environment."Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AggieDave 6 #29 February 20, 2002 Some had migrated to Europe of the landbridge btw Alaska and Russia many moons ago..."I said don't look Ethel, It was too late, she'd already been incensed... " Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #30 February 20, 2002 "exploiting the natural resources"Interesting you brought this up. I saw a web site not long ago ...I think it was the millineum club or something like that. It was a society of scientists and generally educated types that were forming a "Think Tank" to change the way we all live. Currently we tend to only think about the next 50-100 years. Pretty short sighted of us really. These guys are trying to get people to plan developement that will work for the next 1000 years instead. Interesting concept....."I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
jfields 0 #31 February 20, 2002 QuoteCurrently we tend to only think about the next 50-100 years. Pretty short sighted of us really. These guys are trying to get people to plan developement that will work for the next 1000 years instead. Interesting concept.....And nobody can criticize the end results of your plan until you are like 950 years dead. Talk about low accountability. Sweet! Justin Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
schroedera 0 #32 February 20, 2002 Ok, I tried not to say anything, as I often do, but don't diss the animation. Ok, maybe diss the animation, but don't diss what it's trying to do.It's trying to open people's eyes. Sure, we see it and say "Shit, I know all of that, but it's not my fault, I can't do anything to make a huge diff, so I'll do what I can, but won't spend my life feeling bad."Well that'd be a fine statement, IF people ALWAYS thought that way. IF it didn't take someone standing infront of you with pics and numbers to get people to think like that. The vast majority of people in the west are ignorant, usually by choice, to the true extent of damage that our culture is causing the rest of the world. We're blind 90% of the time to the pain and suffering that goes on out there. Most times, we don't want to know. How often do you hear people say, "I don't even watch the news anymore. It's all bad, depressing shit." Well it's f***ing true, it is! But you don't see them running off crusading for a better newscast, do you? No, because that's over there, and we're over here."Maybe the makers could better spend thier time helping the underprivileged as opposed to trying to make the rest of us feel bad about what we have." -RainboThat reeks of the current public outlook; Let them someone else help them, I'm gonna go see a movie.Why don't we ALL help them. Why not take the selfless route and choose to lower our standard of living in order to raise another human's? How many of you are religious? Take the bible, how much emphasis is put on helping your fellow man, to the point where you simply cannot anymore?Religion is just one of a thousand logical motives to equalize the living standards of the earth, if that's the one that gets some people up and working in that direction, fine. If it take profiteers believing there's a profit to be made in having a wider market, fine. If it take peoples good will, fine, what ever it takes, there are so many good resons to do it en-mass, but alas, we do not.Why? Why not. We could sooooo easily have been born into poverty and terrible conditions. Why is there so much negativity? I don't understand the driving force. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #33 February 20, 2002 "The vast majority of people in the west are ignorant, usually by choice"You could have stopped there. The rest is just symptoms..."I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Iflyme 0 #34 February 20, 2002 ***We are much more environmentally aware and are coming up with new ideas all the time on how to allow for progress and protect the environment at the same time. ***Bullshit. Your President is NOT interested in portecting the environment -- he, and his wealthy oil friends are exploiting the environment to increase the standard of living in your country -- if they were truly concerned about the environment, they would increase spending on research into alternative energies, and stop expanding the search for oil.And very few First Nation peoples were wasteful before the Europeans arrived in North America. When an animal was killed, almost every bit of it was used -- for food, tools, clothing, etc. No "trophy hunters" who killed for pleasure. Anyway - one world, one people. I don't believe in billionaires when there are people on the planet who die from starvation. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #35 February 20, 2002 "I don't believe in billionaires when there are people on the planet who die from starvation"Obviously you aren't one then...."I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Iflyme 0 #36 February 20, 2002 QuoteObviously you aren't one then.... ... no - and fortunately my family and I aren't starving either ... I must be honest and say that I don't have the solutions, but I won't shop at big box stores (Costco, Home Depot, etc), and I definitely won't wear any article of clothing with a corporate logo, like Nike... Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bill2 0 #37 February 20, 2002 With "Native Americans" living on it without exploiting the natural resources... (*throws lid to can of worms down and runs*) pull and flare,lisa_________________________________________true they didn't exploit the natural resources in the way that they are exploited now, but much of that is due to population growth. If the native american population was as large then as the US population is now, they would have had a huge pollution problem back then. as for the rest of the world in such a bad state, much of it is due to their having a political/cultural system that doesn't allow them to improve their own lives. Hundreds of years ago the Islamic world was at the forefront in technology/medicine/ etc. Now they are far behind the west. If you look at Islamic countries now, the vast majority are not democracies with no educational and job opportunities for their citizens. and in this day and age, with technology moving so quickly, that spells disaster for any country that can't keep up. Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
freeflir29 0 #38 February 20, 2002 "I definitely won't wear any article of clothing with a corporate logo, like Nike"To each his own......I'm wearing a Tommy Hifiger shirt today. Guess I'm scum....LMAO"I only have a C license, so I don't know shit..right?"-Clay Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Muenkel 0 #39 February 20, 2002 Quote***We are much more environmentally aware and are coming up with new ideas all the time on how to allow for progress and protect the environment at the same time. ***Bullshit. Your President is NOT interested in portecting the environment --At what point did I mention "My President". Yes we have had different leaders who have different policies, this is what makes our country great. I am talking about our progress in technology in general. We can move forward and learn how to protect our environment also.As for "My President", I am damn proud he is My President.Lastly, it doesn't matter if you are a billionaire or poor, you can still be an asshole. Money does not make a person. We each individually make the decision as to the type of person we want to be. I am not the richest man in the world, nor am I the poorest, but I am not going to piss and moan that someone has more than me."I am a victim of my environment."Chris Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ADRNALN 0 #40 February 20, 2002 I guess I am not very PC but, SO!?! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
rhino 0 #41 February 20, 2002 That was cool...Blue Skies and Smooth Rides!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rainbo 0 #42 February 21, 2002 Go ahead and make an example of my statements, thing is...I have been to many of the places in the world that are not as lucky as us. Thing is, I met the bodies of friends that came home trying to help some of the very people that are being used as an example here. And no, they were not military casualties, they were in something called the Peace Corps.Do not try to cite religion either...I do not want to get into that conversation...it is also far to dismal. My attitude is what it is because I have seen in person what so many only know from the safety of a book, magazine, or computer screen. From my perspective people throughout the world are basically the same, and over time have the ability to change thier corner of the world for the better. The fact that some are not allowed to is terrible, but you see, the thing is that in reality there is very little that any of us can do for them...fact!As I said, life ain't fair...nough said.BSBDRainbo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NewGuy 0 #43 February 21, 2002 It made me feel pretty lucky to live where I do and have the life I have. Especially being able to jump out of planes on the weekend. It kindof made my other problems in life seem small. This is why I wanted to share it... that's all. Cheers,NewGuy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
spinmaster 0 #44 February 21, 2002 ________________________Something that might add a little perspective to your day: terra________________________Hate to ruin your day but I read an interview with the guy who put those numbers out. They were sent as a casual comment on society to a friend, who copied a friend, who copied 10 friends...and so on and so on and so on. Well, there was no really study of the factuality of the numbers at the time. It was all made up!Sense then, some studies have been done or used to validate them. It turns out some are relatively accurate (the ones that were easy to figure out) and some are not (most of the really odd ball figures like having relatives who died in a war (the estimate was way under the real number)).Moral: 1) just because it's in an email or on the web doesn't mean its a fact. 2) Be careful when you get up on the soapbox and preach down to others. After all, there was soap in the box and its slippery.Blue One's,Dan Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
wildblue 4 #45 February 21, 2002 QuoteThe vast majority of people in the west are ignorant, usually by choice, to the true extent of damage that our culture is causing the rest of the world. We're blind 90% of the time to the pain and suffering that goes on out there. Most times, we don't want to know. So what you're saying is, our culture is resposible for the downfall of society in the rest of the world?Damn... we are evil evil people.Never argue with stupid people.They just drag you down 2 their level & beat you with experience Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Rainbo 0 #46 February 21, 2002 Hey New guy,Sorry also...did not mean to get preachy, was just coming off a couple of bad days. If I do preach it is normally about staying safe and having fun skydiving. I think that is the track I will get back on. I look forward to sharing some time doing that with you and everyone else in the future...take care.BSBDRainbo Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NewGuy 0 #47 February 21, 2002 Rainbo, no offense taken. My response was directed pretty much to the entire thread. My reaction to the animation was different than most people's and I really didn't intend to offend. I was actually excited to share it with others as I thought in and odd way it might improve their day as well.Do I feel guilty after seeing it? Nope, and I don't have any expectations of people to feel guilty. A couple of people touched on the accuracy of the numbers. Yes, this is taken off the web and could be completely inaccurate - hopefully people are aware of this (with anything from the web or even other sources). There is a statement on the site about that numbers that is worth taking a look at. (again, there is no proof to the accuracy of the statement either). It's just food for thought. Cheers,NewGuy Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keith 0 #48 February 21, 2002 "Yeah.....but we Europeans showed them a thing or two..."Yeah, smallpox Keith Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Keith 0 #49 February 21, 2002 Quote With "Native Americans" living on it without exploiting the natural resources... (*throws lid to can of worms down and runs*) AMEN Sister!!! BTW I have another 20 bucks for you for Jump for the Cause. Keith Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
