SStewart 13 #26 January 21, 2012 Quote only as a car cover.....I had an old Rascal 202 that I had never used but still had in an old container....DOM 1989. Two different riggers I knew and trusted refused to repack it for me....so end of discussion. That's what I pay them for, their skills AND their judgment. Why did they refuse to pack it? Was there something wrong with it? Did they inspect it or did they just turn you down based on age alone? The reason I ask is arbitrary time limits make no sense. Why is 20 years the magic number, why not 15 or why not 25? Either one would make just as much sense. Synthetic materials used in reserve construction last a very long time if properly stored and taken care of. I have no problem with riggers setting their own standards and sticking to that, they have every right to do so. Personally I will no longer pack 5 cell reserves even if they pass inspection. But that is not because of reliability but because of performance. Most folks these days don't know how to land a 5 cell and might get hurt landing. For the same reason I would not pack a newer model micro-raven 120 for someone who is going to heavily over load it. It would be much safer to jump a lightly loaded 23 year old Rascal 202. I have refused to pack reserves less than 20 years old and have packed many that were over 20 years old but that is because I go by condition and not by age. It is either air worthy or it is not. It does not turn into a pumpkin on it's 20th birthday. Many PD reserves that are in great shape are reaching the 20 year mark. It seems silly to ground a perfectly good reserve for no reason other than the DOM. IMNSHO Onward and Upward! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
riggerrob 558 #27 January 21, 2012 QuoteQuoteQuoteOkay local rules say I can't jump it any more. Its manufactured by para-flite. Anybody know what their rules are? Also what are the regulations in the US? Para-Flite had no life limits. Basically, for personal skydiving gear built in the US, no companies have had life limits listed. While I like John Sherman's viewpoint, it is a very debatable point. If someone brings gear to a US rigger and the latest manual (not the original manual) says that that pilot rig has a 20 year life, many riggers are going to follow what the manufacturer says. And many FAA inspectors will give the same opinion. The latest manual, if it says it superceeds the previous manual, must be followed. .................................................................... If the original manufacturer will no longer repack it, then it should be retired. For example, Bulter and Para-Phernalia will not repack any of their gear more than 20 years old. National says not to repack any of their gear more than 15 years. I suspect that National's number is a quiet way to retire all the Phantoms affected by the acid-mesh recalls during the late 1980s. Then we get into the confusing question of what to do with old gear made by companies that no longer manufacture skydiving gear: APS, Eagle Systems, G.Q. Security, Guardian, Niagara Parachutes, Para-Flite, Pioneer, Rogersport, Sky Supplies, etc.)???? I say not to repack ancient gear for two reasons: first, it may be difficult to find manuals and all the service bulletins. Secondly, modern skydivers may foolishly try to load an old reserve at 1.5 pounds per square foot and wonder why their ankles break!!!!! Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
flyboy6554 3 #28 January 23, 2012 Quote Quote only as a car cover.....I had an old Rascal 202 that I had never used but still had in an old container....DOM 1989. Two different riggers I knew and trusted refused to repack it for me....so end of discussion. That's what I pay them for, their skills AND their judgment. Why did they refuse to pack it? Was there something wrong with it? Did they inspect it or did they just turn you down based on age alone? The reason I ask is arbitrary time limits make no sense. Why is 20 years the magic number, why not 15 or why not 25? Either one would make just as much sense. Synthetic materials used in reserve construction last a very long time if properly stored and taken care of. I have no problem with riggers setting their own standards and sticking to that, they have every right to do so. Personally I will no longer pack 5 cell reserves even if they pass inspection. But that is not because of reliability but because of performance. Most folks these days don't know how to land a 5 cell and might get hurt landing. For the same reason I would not pack a newer model micro-raven 120 for someone who is going to heavily over load it. It would be much safer to jump a lightly loaded 23 year old Rascal 202. I have refused to pack reserves less than 20 years old and have packed many that were over 20 years old but that is because I go by condition and not by age. It is either air worthy or it is not. It does not turn into a pumpkin on it's 20th birthday. Many PD reserves that are in great shape are reaching the 20 year mark. It seems silly to ground a perfectly good reserve for no reason other than the DOM. IMNSHO I was told "I choose not to pack reserve parachutes that are 20 years old." Quote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
